Lich King vs Broken Shores

[thesentinelblue]

Lich King is def powerful enough to drive the Burning Legion back through the portal. LK is not strong enough to take on the entire legion. LK has limits but they are high enough that they are almost considered a god-tier. (Arthas literally played with us the entire fight, when he grew bored of us. He 1-shot us.)

If we are dealing with dreadlords and their command of the dead. LK def overpowers a dreadlord's will. In W3, Ner'zhul lost control of them due to the frozen throne being cracked and so much power escaping or he willingly let them control them in the Burning Legion's name.

Besides we are dealing with more then just a war. This is the equivalent of a Tiger vs a Bear.

One side gains from defeat of enemies and resurrecting them to serve their will. The other side gains from souls being driven towards their soul machine.

One side can literally shit out building as of legion and have space ships. The other side has several necropoli and can actually summon their structures slowly but surely. (And several more being built as of WOTLK)

Necropolis take quite a beating to take down. We haven't actually crashed a necropolis yet if im correct but I know we haven't destroyed a spaceship either. (We have seen one necropolis crash due to malfunctioning and one crashing due to Drakari Trolls.)
We know there are probably countless legion ships.

If we have control of all Necropoli seen ingame it would be about 13. This includes all named ones, unnamed ones, and WOTLK launch event ones.

I would also love to mention some other airplay.
As of now, Legion has Fel Bats, Abyssals, Doomguards, Terrorguards, Infernals ( and maybe nathrezim due to their wings.)
Scourge Forces has Frost wyrms(including all varities such as emberwyrms and blackwyrms), Gargoyles, Nerubian Flyers, undead gryphons, anything thats dead and can fly......

This is something that actually interests me. Mainly because I want to see a bone chicken 1v1 a fel bat.

I could go on but i've already spend around 20 minutes writing this post.

[steelballfc]

God....
I really start to hate the Lich-king

[Lastgope]

Lich King dosent one shot me. I laugh at him as he tickles me with his death rays.

He gets the last laugh though because he will never drop that damn horse.

[Forgottenone]

It would have been interesting to watch.

For the Lich King
He has an army at his disposal capable of zerging the island. If he has full control over all the undead he could have pressured the demons immensely and managed to kill off a few top generals. With the ebon blade helping they could have a decent chance.

Against the Lich King
The portal is guarded by not just numerous demons but each demon is stronger 1v1 than an undead. Each Felguard could easily kill a few undead before dying. Furthermore all demons that are killed wouldn't come back as undead, a major ability the Lich King relied on. Lastly the demon generals, if I recall there were numerous named demons with impressive feats. They could possibly have held back the Legion, pull some Khadgar level trick and stop the undead. Lastly if there is an overwhelming force on the other side of the portal all undead that get to close would be instantly destroyed.


To be fair any one/two specific factions working together would lose to the Legion. However if all of Azeroth had banded together then they would have won. For example if all the factions I listed below worked together and had attacked at a later point the Broken Shore would have been a swift victory. The Legion is strong and numerous but they would have failed against everything. We also wouldn't have this expansion if they worked together lol

-Scourge
-Horde
-Alliance
-Bloodsail Buccaneers
-Ebon Blade
-Argent Crusade
-Dragonflights
-Centaur clans

[Saverem]

Should had called Bolvar the LICH KING. He would had soloed the broken shores by himself, especially if he has a company of Death Knights with him.

Half of the items that gave TLK his power (Frostmourne) is broken and gone, its shard incorporated into the DK's weapon now. TLK now is about half as strong as he once was without his sword that can steal souls and then put unlife into powerful undead minions (Sindragosa) to serve him.

The helmet only controls the undead, without his sword, he is half of what he was in WoTLK.

[Aquamonkey]

What gives the LK his power is the Frozen Throne and the souls he consumes.

[Bethanie]

I think the only way the Lich King could have won on the Broken Shore, is if he was able to raise the corpses of fallen demons.

Of course when a demon dies it's soul goes back to the nether, ready to be reborn. However in most cases it's corpse is left behind, and if it could be raised into undeath servitude, then the Lich King would have access to a near infinite army of undead demons.

So does anyone know, can a fallen demons corpse be raised into undeath?

[Zulkhan]

What gives the LK his power is the Frozen Throne and the souls he consumes.

And that's why sinking Northrend to destroy the Lich King wasn't that bad of an idea.

[Aquamonkey]

So does anyone know, can a fallen demons corpse be raised into undeath?

Yes. See undead Mannoroth in WoD.

[Aucald]

Yes. See undead Mannoroth in WoD.

Was that a truly undead version of Mannoroth, or just Gul'dan siphoning his spirit back into his physical remains in an accelerated fashion? The Legion also animated some of the ghosts of Black Rook Hold but they seemed to actually give them true, living bodies as opposed to putting them in a state of undeath.

[Aquamonkey]

Was that a truly undead version of Mannoroth, or just Gul'dan siphoning his spirit back into his physical remains in an accelerated fashion? The Legion also animated some of the ghosts of Black Rook Hold but they seemed to actually give them true, living bodies as opposed to putting them in a state of undeath.

Mannoroth starts the encounter as a skeleton and ends with a busted body. He is never fully restored. Also:

Dave stated NPCs can have more than one classification lore-wise
Well, yes, Mannoroth is an undead demon. Demons know how to raise undead, and he was a demon previously. (Muffinus)

[Aucald]

Mannoroth starts the encounter as a skeleton and ends with a busted body. He is never fully restored. Also:

Dave stated NPCs can have more than one classification lore-wise
Well, yes, Mannoroth is an undead demon. Demons know how to raise undead, and he was a demon previously. (Muffinus)

I mean more in the sense of Fel "necromancy" versus its Scourge counterpart - the Legion can certainly raise the dead, but they don't seem to do so in a fashion that binds the will of the raised individual to another mind (Mannoroth, albeit raised by Gul'dan's magic, does not appear subservient to him in any way). We know the Dreadlords essentially created necromancy or at least experimented with it back in the War of the Ancients, but I would doubt such abilities would ever have been conferred to the Lich King Kil'jaeden was responsible for creating.

[Wewlad]

Oh shit he's back.

/popcorn

If you get mad, it's your fault for responding.

[Deleted]

Besides we are dealing with more then just a war. This is the equivalent of a Tiger vs a Bear.

One side gains from defeat of enemies and resurrecting them to serve their will. The other side gains from souls being driven towards their soul machine.

One side can literally shit out building as of legion and have space ships. The other side has several necropoli and can actually summon their structures slowly but surely. (And several more being built as of WOTLK)

...What tiger's and bears have you seen fighting? o.O

[Kellorion]

...What tiger's and bears have you seen fighting? o.O

They do, in zoos, bears lose almost always.....

[Kelthos]

I mean more in the sense of Fel "necromancy" versus its Scourge counterpart - the Legion can certainly raise the dead, but they don't seem to do so in a fashion that binds the will of the raised individual to another mind (Mannoroth, albeit raised by Gul'dan's magic, does not appear subservient to him in any way). We know the Dreadlords essentially created necromancy or at least experimented with it back in the War of the Ancients, but I would doubt such abilities would ever have been conferred to the Lich King Kil'jaeden was responsible for creating.

I do believe the necromancy used by the Nathrezim (and some Eredar apparently like Kil'jaeden) is the same as that used by the Scourge. Instead of using fel in conjunction with their necromancy however, the Scourge went a more shadow and rune magic route.

[Aucald]

I do believe the necromancy used by the Nathrezim (and some Eredar apparently like Kil'jaeden) is the same as that used by the Scourge. Instead of using fel in conjunction with their necromancy however, the Scourge went a more shadow and rune magic route.

Necromancy seems to be a product of almost purely Shadow magic, which the Nathrezim and Eredar are proficient at. Gul'dan's use of Fel to resurrect Mannoroth struck me less as Necromancy and more him just speeding up the "normal" process of Mannoroth's demonic soul reconstituting his body in the Twisting Nether. He just funneled Fel into the corpse of Mannoroth, giving the Pit Lord a vessel for his soul to re-enter. Demonic and Scourge necromancy seems to be a different beast - dealing with the manipulation of soul essences and connecting them back to dead bodies in a way to bind their will to that of the Necromancer in question. I doubt Scourge Necromancy could manipulate a demonic soul (likely by design) because it seems doubtful Kil'jaeden would permit that kind of power to mortal Necromancers or to his tool, the Lich King. Demonic Necromancy might be another matter entirely.

[Deleted]

They do, in zoos, bears lose almost always.....

I mean...do the bears gain from defeat of their enemies and ressurect them to serve their wil? And the tigers have space ships?

[bromanbro]

I know you're all having fun with this Gogeta vs Vegito fanfic, but lore-wise the players have been stronger than the Lich King since WOLK. We killed literally everyone worth killing, then weakened the LK enough to let Tirion 1-shot him.

Bolvar's hanging by a thread on that throne. Would probably be dead if he didn't take the helm to become the LK.

[Aquamonkey]

I know you're all having fun with this Gogeta vs Vegito fanfic, but lore-wise the players have been stronger than the Lich King since WOLK. We killed literally everyone worth killing, then weakened the LK enough to let Tirion 1-shot him.

Bolvar's hanging by a thread on that throne. Would probably be dead if he didn't take the helm to become the LK.

The spirits released from Frostmourne held Arthas down so he couldn't fight anymore.