The Alliance and The Horde had no chance against the Legion on the Broken Shore

[Felixon]

While there're are others topics,where mostly people are blaming the Horde for their "treachery" and "cowardice", I would like to focus on one important detail I paid attention to yesterday,while I was running the Broken Shore scenario for the second time - the moment,when gul'dan summons 30+ Legion lieutenants and commanders such as Brutallus,Jaraxxus (EREDAR LORD OF THE BURNING LEGION), Tichondrius and line of other demons we have faced or at least heard before in the Warcraft lore.Though they don't appear in the Varian's final stand,they were there.(Actually,im even wondering why none of them didn't try to shoot a spell,which would take down the Skyfire,but that wouldn't be that impressive as summoning a huge FEL REAVER.Probably they thought it's not worth an effort). So,even if the Horde would clear the ridge and join the fight with the Alliance,I think,that they would get wiped out if they would try to make a stand and the wisest thing to do was to call a retreat - for the both sides.Even if all of the Alliance leaders would be present (yet I don't know why they weren't) they didn't stand a chance against all of them.


Share your thoughts.

[Venziir]

Well, that was kinda the entire point of The Broken Shore; to show that we never even had a chance.

[spinner981]

It was my understanding that the horde failed the Alliance because they were supposed to ward off the flying demons to allow the Alliance gunship to get close, and it took off with its passengers at a delay because of the horde's refusal to do so. Thus, the giant demon had time to grab the gunship, thus Varian died. Could it have happened differently? Could one of the huge demon lieutenants have shot it down? Possibly. Probably. But they didn't, instead it was a giant demon monster that grabbed the ship because the horde fled leaving the Alliance soldiers for dead.

As far as the 'we don't have a chance' thing goes. We do have a chance, it's called plot armor.

[Deleted]

And in the rogue order hall quest line they say it was all a trap, the broken shore, to lure the worlds best hero's into their death

[Venziir]

It was my understanding that the horde failed the Alliance because they were supposed to ward off the flying demons to allow the Alliance gunship to get close, and it took off with its passengers at a delay because of the horde's refusal to do so. Thus, the giant demon had time to grab the gunship, thus Varian died. Could it have happened differently? Could one of the huge demon lieutenants have shot it down? Possibly. Probably. But they didn't, instead it was a giant demon monster that grabbed the ship because the horde fled leaving the Alliance soldiers for dead.

As far as the 'we don't have a chance' thing goes. We do have a chance, it's called plot armor.

Have you even seen the Horde video? The Horde was overrun and assaulted by the Fel Space Ships within minutes. Besides, the Fel Reaver wasn't even summoned until after the Horde had retreated. And no; we had no chance at that point. Our plot armor doesn't come unto action until later in the expansion.

[Pengalor]

It was my understanding that the horde failed the Alliance because they were supposed to ward off the flying demons to allow the Alliance gunship to get close, and it took off with its passengers at a delay because of the horde's refusal to do so. Thus, the giant demon had time to grab the gunship, thus Varian died. Could it have happened differently? Could one of the huge demon lieutenants have shot it down? Possibly. Probably. But they didn't, instead it was a giant demon monster that grabbed the ship because the horde fled leaving the Alliance soldiers for dead.

As far as the 'we don't have a chance' thing goes. We do have a chance, it's called plot armor.

That's not how plot armor works. Plot armor just means certain characters won't die because they're essential to the story (though you see how that worked out). I doesn't give any guarantee against failure because that would make for a really boring story. And no, it wasn't the Horde's fault, the Horde would have been wiped out had they stayed any longer and Gul'dan was never in any actual danger from the Alliance. That's kind of the point, Gul'dan allowed both factions to come to his front door and then laughed in their faces at the futility of their attempts to stop him.

[Deleted]

It was my understanding that the horde failed the Alliance because they were supposed to ward off the flying demons to allow the Alliance gunship to get close, and it took off with its passengers at a delay because of the horde's refusal to do so. Thus, the giant demon had time to grab the gunship, thus Varian died. Could it have happened differently? Could one of the huge demon lieutenants have shot it down? Possibly. Probably. But they didn't, instead it was a giant demon monster that grabbed the ship because the horde fled leaving the Alliance soldiers for dead.

As far as the 'we don't have a chance' thing goes. We do have a chance, it's called plot armor.

^ This guy basically wants John fucking Cena, against all the odds.

[Hctaz]

It was my understanding that the horde failed the Alliance because they were supposed to ward off the flying demons to allow the Alliance gunship to get close, and it took off with its passengers at a delay because of the horde's refusal to do so. Thus, the giant demon had time to grab the gunship, thus Varian died. Could it have happened differently? Could one of the huge demon lieutenants have shot it down? Possibly. Probably. But they didn't, instead it was a giant demon monster that grabbed the ship because the horde fled leaving the Alliance soldiers for dead.

I don't know why everybody thinks this. Did nobody see the fact that the ridge held like 50% more demons than the Alliance had to face at all? The archers were fine when they weren't threatened but as soon as all our leaders got shit on then we were pretty boned. Sylvanas only retreated because Vol'jin told her not to let the horde die otherwise she probably would have stayed longer and only fled when literally everybody else was downed.

[Felixon]

I don't know why everybody thinks this. Did nobody see the fact that the ridge held like 50% more demons than the Alliance had to face at all? The archers were fine when they weren't threatened but as soon as all our leaders got shit on then we were pretty boned. Sylvanas only retreated because Vol'jin told her not to let the horde die otherwise she probably would have stayed longer and only fled when literally everybody else was downed.

I think,that the main reason is because people don't play with both factions or even don't bother to watch the both cinematics at least.That's why I have a Horde alt to see the other part of the story,so that I can understand the reasons for their actions.

[Smallfruitbat]

I absolutely loved the Broken Shores scenario. For once, I didn’t feel like the invincible commander, seeing us fell a bunch of demons only to have them replaced 10 times over was a serious WTF moment. From a psychological point, luring the main Azerothian forces to one place and then confronting them with the ‘Legion’ as well as killing off their champions is a pretty good demoralising tactic. I’ve not played the rogue campaign yet, but in hindsight it does feel like we were lured into a trap.

Personally, I feel that this is one of the few times we’ve actually faced a real danger. The Legion (and Deathwing previously) are seeking to eradicate all life plain and simple, it’s not a coup waiting to happen or a potential invasion from another timeline because the grass is greener. There has been a lot of speculation about how the expac is going to end –I’m pretty excited about it. I’m also hoping that we’ll get another ‘pruning’ of major characters. Much as I dislike the Horde vs Alliance threads (because they get nasty), it’s refreshing to see people responding to the story and getting passionate about their pet faction.

[Silvus]

I think,that the main reason is because people don't play with both factions or even don't bother to watch the both cinematics at least.That's why I have a Horde alt to see the other part of the story,so that I can understand the reasons for their actions.

Yet its more fun that players CANT see the other cinematics, so the alliance/horde conflict is even real for the players.
Back in vanilla you could not have 2 factions on a server. And tbh I liked that idea so your alliance or horde. Not both

[Smallfruitbat]

I think,that the main reason is because people don't play with both factions or even don't bother to watch the both cinematics at least.That's why I have a Horde alt to see the other part of the story,so that I can understand the reasons for their actions.

People play for a lot of reasons, personally I love the story so that is first and foremost for me, I main alliance but keep a max level hordie around so I can experience the other side of the coin. There are a lot of people who have very little clue what is actually going on and why they have been sent to execute such and such a boss, it's their loss.

[Deleted]

People play for a lot of reasons, personally I love the story so that is first and foremost for me, I main alliance but keep a max level hordie around so I can experience the other side of the coin. There are a lot of people who have very little clue what is actually going on and why they have been sent to execute such and such a boss, it's their loss.

Pretty much what I do myself. For that reason, I have a max level Horde since I started as well. I am an Alliance first and foremost, always have been, always will be. However, unlike the majority of shitheads that play my faction, I keep an open mind in addition to the realization that it doesn't matter what they want, Blizzard won't be pissing off the other half of their playerbase and portray them as the coward, shitty faction. Children can yell "Horde are cowards" until you are blue in the face, even more than Blizzard's logo, but that won't mean that this is Blizzard's canon for the simple aforementioned reason.

[Felixon]

Pretty much what I do myself. For that reason, I have a max level Horde since I started as well. I am an Alliance first and foremost, always have been, always will be. However, unlike the majority of shitheads that play my faction, I keep an open mind in addition to the realization that it doesn't matter what they won't, Blizzard won't be pissing off the other half of their playerbase and portray them as the coward, shitty faction. Children can yell "Horde are cowards" until you are blue in the face, even more than Blizzard's logo, but that won't mean that this is Blizzard's canon for the simple aforementioned reason.

This.Like in life,there're always two sides in each story.You can't jump at somebody's throat right ahead without allowing him to speak.

[Deleted]

Having played both the Horde and Alliance side of the story I couldn't agree more. Things could, and should, have gone diffrently for both factions but at the end of the day, we got this outcome. There's so much "Alliance only had to face ground demons" and "Horde were cowards for running!" but c'mon, people, really? The Alliance faced every fucking Eredar lord we've ever known, countless demonic lords and familiar demonic masters with a wide array of others we haven't seen yet ever before, the Horde faced overwhelming numbers from the rear which they did not expect. Nether faction ever stood a single chance on either side of that ridge, its' as simple as that.

The scenario was dynamic, interresting and well fleshed out with cool story elements and (as mentioned before by someone else) it finally felt like we were actualy f*cked pretty hard by our enemy. An entity so strong that even our combined armies couldn't bring the fight to them because we chose a reckless charge over defensive strategies. And it was epic!

[Deleted]

Having played both the Horde and Alliance side of the story I couldn't agree more. Things could, and should, have gone diffrently for both factions but at the end of the day, we got this outcome. There's so much "Alliance only had to face ground demons" and "Horde were cowards for running!" but c'mon, people, really? The Alliance faced every fucking Eredar lord we've ever known with a wide array of others we haven't seen yet ever before, the Horde faced overwhelming numbers from the rear which they did not expect. Nether faction ever stood a single chance on either side of that ridge, its' as simple as that.

The scenario was dynamic, interresting and well fleshed out with cool story elements and (as mentioned before by someone else) it finally felt like we were actualy f*cked pretty hard by our enemy. An entity so strong that even our combined armies couldn't bring the fight to them because we chose a reckless charge over defensive strategies. And it was epic!

The most mind boggling thing about how dynamic it was (in a good way) is the fact that as Alliance, I could see Horde players in the same instance as me...

This was truly a jump in term of how the game developed in the 10 years I played. I had a smile on my face the whole way we were doing that demon that moves between both factions' players.

[Felixon]

I absolutely loved the Broken Shores scenario. For once, I didn’t feel like the invincible commander, seeing us fell a bunch of demons only to have them replaced 10 times over was a serious WTF moment. From a psychological point, luring the main Azerothian forces to one place and then confronting them with the ‘Legion’ as well as killing off their champions is a pretty good demoralising tactic. I’ve not played the rogue campaign yet, but in hindsight it does feel like we were lured into a trap.

Personally, I feel that this is one of the few times we’ve actually faced a real danger. The Legion (and Deathwing previously) are seeking to eradicate all life plain and simple, it’s not a coup waiting to happen or a potential invasion from another timeline because the grass is greener. There has been a lot of speculation about how the expac is going to end –I’m pretty excited about it. I’m also hoping that we’ll get another ‘pruning’ of major characters. Much as I dislike the Horde vs Alliance threads (because they get nasty), it’s refreshing to see people responding to the story and getting passionate about their pet faction.

At the moment,when he summoned those 30+ Legion lieutenants,of whom each we needed the top of the top to defeat,heck,for the first time they made me feel powerless,thus putting us - heroes and champions of what not wars,back to our places.And killing Varian was a major demoralisation - like - "if they kill the one of the best of us,what chance do we have?",making you feel mortal again and understanding how deep in the pile of shit we're standing. If you're watching TWD and saw the ending of the season 6,it's the same - all of them are put on their knees and told,that they think,that they know everything and can deal with everyone,while actually,Negan puts them back on their place and says,that they "don't know a shit".

[Smallfruitbat]

One of the things that I find interesting from an RP POV is what our characters ‘know’ versus what they ‘believe’ versus what is ‘canon’. My Night Elfs summation of the events at the broken shore is simply that the forces of Azeroth were overrun by demons because that is what she saw.

[nnelson54]

You find out in the Rogue class quests that it was all a big trap, set up entirely to lure all the heroes of Azeroth to their death to kill them all in one sitting and start a conflict between the Horde and the Alliance when neither side could afford it. We never had a chance, and that was the entire point.

[Smallfruitbat]

First and foremost, it seems to me that this was a hastily put together attempt to repel the Legion –I think someone described it as going ‘Full Leeroy Jenkins’ –it seems to me that other faction leaders may have been rousing their own troops or making other preparations. No one expected the Legion force in the Broken Shore to have been as big as it was –perhaps Varian thought it was a couple of hundred demons that they could easily beat back with a couple of their own Legions –the NPCs were certainly shocked at the numbers and how well equipped they were.

You see Khadgar at the end of the Demon Hunter questline, sending them to the faction leaders to offer aid –and if you listen to the audio drama, he’s just had his ass kicked by Gul’Dan and company.