I dont see many survival hunters around

[Nefarious Tea]

...Well, I should say, Enjoy hunters now, the vocal "melee hunters!" minority. You whined hard and long enough to get Blizzard to break everything about hunters. If the rest of us knew SV-to-melee was being even passingly discussed by the devs, we would have been screaming NO! But nobody knew until the change was announced, so we the majority got fucked over thanks to the vocal minority. Enjoy an essentially new class. At least Demon Hunters got a starting zone.

I don't know if it's been said in the thread already although I'm sure it has, and I don't know if you know (or read the thread)... but back in Vanilla Survival was essentially a melee spec. It just sucked, because Marks, then as now and forever, is superior DPS. It was similar to Paladins, Priests, Shamasal, and Druids in Vanilla: you could heal so you WERE healing. And Warriors? You were either a tank or you were a scrub.

Another way to look at it is this: Survival is a melee spec, probably for the rest of WoW's life at this point, or certainly Legion and the expansion after, at any rate. You can like it, as some do... or you can not, as others do. But the anti-Legion-era-Survival crowd are just being assholes for the sake of being assholes at this point. So quit; didn't your mother ever tell you that if you had nothing nice to say, to say nothing at all?

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

They're pretty bland tbqh.

[Deleted]

Uh, hunters have been spamming something since, well, BC at least. I didn't play Classic, so I can't say what happened there. Steady, Cobra, whatever, that's what we did, that's what we have done for a long, long time. That's one thing that hasn't been discussed much: the paradigmatic shift from ABC (Always Be Casting) to...er, whatever we have now. That shift is, among other reasons, why I hate how hunters currently play. I cannot unlearn 10 years of muscle memory in a week. I find myself hitting buttons--any attack--because that's what hunters have done for a decade.
.

Try not to be mad and try reading next time. Maybe you won't rip everything out of context then. I was replying to someone who said SV hunter is too "spammy" and I just told him that we always used to spam skills.


So... "fuck off" right back to you.

And just because you can't adapt doesn't mean hunters are worse or less fun than before, it just means you can't adapt (and suck). No one whined about wanting a melee spec either, people just liked it and would've loved it.

[Riistov]

I know it's been said before in this thread, but the game already has far too many melee classes. I have been raiding since BC and I've never once heard the phrase "Wow, we're really heavy on ranged dps right now".

Not sure why every spec/class thats been added to the game has been melee. The removal of a ranged spec seems pretty silly to me.

[unfilteredJW]

Made me finally roll a hunter.

I've been wanting a polearm using class for a long, long while. Glad they finally gave it to me.

[ejpaints]

I'm not interested in playing melee, so SV is dead to me. I'll do the artifact quest just so I can see the story for the weapon but I'll be completing it in another spec.

[lmaoboat]

I don't understand why people are mad at Survival being melee. Maybe you didn't ask about it but you weren't asking for survival to be something unique anyway. Survival has NEVER had a real identity. It's always been " Kinda like MM but with dots "

There's an absolute fuckload of melee choices as it is, not to mention every new class so far has been melee. Since Blizzard apparently thinks three ranged weapon using specs is stretching it too thin, but 20ish melee is just fine, they get rid of one of our specs to make yet another melee because: "Haha, remember that 'Imma melee hunter!' meme guys?" But the worst part is for all their talk, they didn't manage to make any class spec more "unique" than it was before, so not only do we have just two ranged now, but they're about as bland as they've ever been.

So why am I so mad? Probably because Blizzard hasn't actually improved anything about our class, taken a lot of it away, made what's there worse, and left us with a hyped up idea of "Class Fantasy" that only serves to make what was okay before look bad as well.

[Noocta]

There's an absolute fuckload of melee choices as it is, not to mention every new class so far has been melee. Since Blizzard apparently thinks three ranged weapon using specs is stretching it too thin, but 20ish melee is just fine, they get rid of one of our specs to make yet another melee because: "Haha, remember that 'Imma melee hunter!' meme guys?" But the worst part is for all their talk, they didn't manage to make any class spec more "unique" than it was before, so not only do we have just two ranged now, but they're about as bland as they've ever been.

So why am I so mad? Probably because Blizzard hasn't actually improved anything about our class, taken a lot of it away, made what's there worse, and left us with a hyped up idea of "Class Fantasy" that only serves to make what was okay before look bad as well.

Literally doesn't matter. They took a spec with no identity and give it one. That's the point.
Did they prune too much from Bm and MM in the process ? Maybe, maybe not. It's not the point tho.

[Juici]

just wait, you know next they will bring in a cloth wearing battle mage just so cloth has a melee, since there's not enough of them already and that's the only armor type with out melee ... cuz ya know people (random ones floating around the place that think their voice is better than other peoples) have been asking for one for donkeys!!!!

[Tsimp]

just wait, you know next they will bring in a cloth wearing battle mage just so cloth has a melee, since there's not enough of them already and that's the only armor type with out melee ... cuz ya know people (random ones floating around the place that think their voice is better than other peoples) have been asking for one for donkeys!!!!

In the original wow handbook disc priest is listed as a melee spec; so be careful what you wish for :P

[Trifle]

I don't know if it's been said in the thread already although I'm sure it has, and I don't know if you know (or read the thread)... but back in Vanilla Survival was essentially a melee spec. It just sucked, because Marks, then as now and forever, is superior DPS.

Vanilla survival was in no way a melee spec. It was a utility spec if anything, with a bunch of passives to improve all damage (not just melee), some trap & survivability stuff, and a grand total of 1 talent that boosted melee damage (+20% crit chance to raptor strike & mongoose bite). It got a new melee attack in counterattack as well, but that was fixed at 40 damage (didn't scale at all), it was more about the 5 second root so you could get out and back to ranged.

If you went all the way to 31 points the main draws were +15% agility and wyvern sting, but usually it was used as a dip after you had gone 31 points in BM or Marksman.

[Alopex]

Never asked for it, but I'm enjoying survival on beta and live

As for Vanilla: melee hunters didn't exist. Even if they went survival. Lacerate was a terrible 31 point talent as well. When that got changed out, they went survival for Wyvern Sting for PvP at best

[Juici]

In the original wow handbook disc priest is listed as a melee spec; so be careful what you wish for :P

oh I don't wish for any ranged class to become melee, not even the rexor hunter concept some people want, if it's ranged it should stay ranged 100% of the time no excuses imo (exception being mechanics )

[MatadorMedia]

Survival is just a crazy ass non-rotation if you ask me. The mongoose bite spam - and the mastery of possible resets of bite - doesn't really mesh with the rest of the "rotation" at all. It's like you can kind of make a rotation built around dots or traps, but the mongoose bite mechanic just gets in the way. It's a dumb move that makes no sense because you have to wait for resets. Otherwise it's kinda fun (but mongoose is THE move, you can't avoid it).

[shadowmouse]

Hunters had melee attacks for a reason back then. They could not shoot at anything closer than 5m. Now, the game has long evolved past that.
And by the way, I think that asking for a melee hunters most people did not think of a completely melee spec, but something that resempled old hunters - ranged class with melee backup when things got too close and personal.

The two points don't really go together. As you said, things don't get "too close and personal" today. That being the case, why would there ever be a reason to go melee today?

I don't presume to speak for other players, let alone most. I know what I wanted, I wanted the melee weapon to be something more than a stat stick (yes, and I would have liked other classes ranged abilities rounded out a bit too, for much the same reason) and I wanted the melee tools to be something other than a trigger for melee hunter jokes.

The current Survival spec does those things well enough for me right now. Will I go Survival full time? Probably not, but it is there when I want to change up a bit. It wasn't a completely new class, but it offers me a bit more variety. I can live with that.

[Renchard]

There's an absolute fuckload of melee choices as it is, not to mention every new class so far has been melee. Since Blizzard apparently thinks three ranged weapon using specs is stretching it too thin, but 20ish melee is just fine, they get rid of one of our specs to make yet another melee because: "Haha, remember that 'Imma melee hunter!' meme guys?" But the worst part is for all their talk, they didn't manage to make any class spec more "unique" than it was before, so not only do we have just two ranged now, but they're about as bland as they've ever been.

I would point out that there's been more ranged DPS specs than melee DPS specs up until Legion. The reason they keep adding more melee DPS specs is because there's been relatively few of them. Ranged specs are just concentrated in fewer classes than melee.

[Deleted]

Survival as a spec made sense in Vanilla (after first rework) and Tbc because of the hunter minimum range. Since then it's merely been a question whether survival or marksman had the highest dps.
Blizzard had to change something to make a clear distinction between the specs. I think introducing the dead zone back for hunters, while making survival melee/range hybrid (where you are supposed to engage and disengage in combat) and marksman only ranged (high stationary damage and strong kiting) would both increase popularity, skill ceiling, and make the "class fantasy" more distinct. I also think BM should be a bit more involving (just look at the disparity between demonology and beast mastery). A lot of people suggested making BM the melee spec. Would be cool with a Rexxar sort of spec.

These are only my thoughts. I don't play the class anymore. Played it a lot in Vanilla and some in Tbc, but I stopped caring when the dead zone was removed.

[Rucktoe]

How is everyone planning on gearing up and what do your attack priorities look like?

What build seems optimal to you?

I want to prioritize getting haste to 25-30% and mastery as high as possible after that. The haste will guarantee I can get 3 flanking strikes off during Eagle and with mastery where I want it will give me at least 2 mongoose bite charges. Haste will also keep my GCD where I want it as well as reducing the channel of the arty.

My build plan is 1-3-3-2-3-2-2

The obvious one that seems different than most is going Animal Instincts instead of mok'nathal. With prioritizing FS and MB and all the procs, I really don't have time to keep mok up. Plus instincts gives me 20% mastery and 10% haste chances. The third one sucks, but whatever, I'll have FS on a 4.5s CD.

I really like the flow of the attack pattern. There is always something going on and I really like pushing the amount of bites I can get off during fury.

What is everyone else prioritizing?

[DarkAviator]

I would point out that there's been more ranged DPS specs than melee DPS specs up until Legion. The reason they keep adding more melee DPS specs is because there's been relatively few of them. Ranged specs are just concentrated in fewer classes than melee.

While this may be true - I didn't count -, the fact remains that raid or dungeon teams usually try to have no more than about a third of their dps be melee, if utility and dps is equal. Especially utility isn't equal, so there are exceptions for sure, but there is no gain in having more specs compete over the about 2-6 melee spots in a raid team.

EDIT: Uh, if my count is correct, leaving SV as ranged would set melee and ranged specs at 12 each, while now there are 13 melee and 11 ranged dps specs.

[Tokee]

How is everyone planning on gearing up and what do your attack priorities look like?

What build seems optimal to you?

I want to prioritize getting haste to 25-30% and mastery as high as possible after that. The haste will guarantee I can get 3 flanking strikes off during Eagle and with mastery where I want it will give me at least 2 mongoose bite charges. Haste will also keep my GCD where I want it as well as reducing the channel of the arty.

My build plan is 1-3-3-2-3-2-2

The obvious one that seems different than most is going Animal Instincts instead of mok'nathal. With prioritizing FS and MB and all the procs, I really don't have time to keep mok up. Plus instincts gives me 20% mastery and 10% haste chances. The third one sucks, but whatever, I'll have FS on a 4.5s CD.

I really like the flow of the attack pattern. There is always something going on and I really like pushing the amount of bites I can get off during fury.

What is everyone else prioritizing?

None of this is correct, btw.