Do you guys expect another balance hotfix before launch?

[Phases]

Do you guys expect that we will get another balance patch before legion launches?
Or will the next balance patch probably be around raid release?

[Krille]

Yes definitely. Going by WatcherDevs interviews during Gamescom they want to put out fixes before the release and then let it stay that way for a few months (they wouldn't care if a spec is 10% stronger than everyone else, for instance). He said they "didn't want to nerf specs people had put work into with their artifact" so most balancing will be now, before/at release, and then no balancing until we're at a point where many have two artifacts at a high level i suppose.

[Phases]

Yeah with the new artifact system if your spec gets nerfed into the ground, youre losing allot of time leveling another artifact. Let's hope they fix the dps differences before launch. Some specs are so far ahead of others in the same role, that we would see allot of the same specs at the start of the expansion.

[Super Kami Dende]

I wouldn't expect anything massive, most hotfixes were just to make some classes usuable pre-artifact. Once we have artifact in hand most of the pre-patch hotfixes will like get reverted.

[Krille]

I wouldn't expect anything massive, most hotfixes were just to make some classes usuable pre-artifact. Once we have artifact in hand most of the pre-patch hotfixes will like get reverted.

No they won't. They're tuning for 110 with artifacts atm.

[Phases]

No they won't. They're are tuning for 110 with artifacts atm.

Yeah, balancing for 1 week in an expansion would be insane, hopefully they will reach their goal of only a few % between specs on max level with artifacts. Their tank and healing balance seems to be quiet good at the moment.

[Krille]

Yeah, balancing for 1 week in an expansion would be insane, hopefully they will reach their goal of only a few % between specs on max level with artifacts. Their tank and healing balance seems to be quiet good at the moment.

DH tanks still needs something more to be really viable, from what i've seen of mythic+ dungeons they still take shitloads of damage at 110. I thought Blizzard was moving away from spiky dmg. Anyway i agree, why would they balance for 100.. Healing is at a very good point in balance, maybe Disc needs more throughput. DPS-wise i think Fire mage is a bit too strong and retri/warlocks are a bit low. But i'm anticipating a change for those two specs/classes.

[Marston]

DH tanks still needs something more to be really viable, from what i've seen of mythic+ dungeons they still take shitloads of damage at 110. I thought Blizzard was moving away from spiky dmg.

I think that depends on the Mythic+ level, eh? If Demon Hunter work normally at Mythic dungeon level or at Mythic+3 or Mythic+6 or whatever number with the appropriate gear, then all is good. But if you lack gear and are pushing Mythic+ or can't upgrade your gear anymore and still pushing Mythic+, damage will just get so high that pretty much everything will feel spiky at some point.

Just look at some of the bonus damag/health number:
Mythic+1 gives enemies only +8% HP/DMG
But I saw numbers as high as +141%

And it can get even higher. At some point more or less everything will just feel spiky because the multiplier is so high. Or did I misunderstand your concern?

[Krille]

I think that depends on the Mythic+ level, eh? If Demon Hunter work normally at Mythic dungeon level or at Mythic+3 or Mythic+6 or whatever number with the appropriate gear, then all is good. But if you lack gear and are pushing Mythic+ or can't upgrade your gear anymore and still pushing Mythic+, damage will just get so high that pretty much everything will feel spiky at some point.

Just look at some of the bonus damag/health number:
Mythic+1 gives enemies only +8% HP/DMG
But I saw numbers as high as +141%

And it can get even higher. At some point more or less everything will just feel spiky because the multiplier is so high. Or did I misunderstand your concern?

Yes i watched Slootbag play Vengeance DH in a mythic+ dungeon but it wasn't that high. He had decent gear and a nicely progressed artifact weapon so he shouldn't have taken that much damage. I think they need more baseline armor and magic resistance, still.

[miffy23]

Yes absolutely. There will be another round of tuning before it goes live, and there will be more tuning patches before raids go live. Same as every expansion, really.

People shouldn't worry about numbers until maybe the week before raid launch or so.

[beanman12345]

Yes definitely. Going by WatcherDevs interviews during Gamescom they want to put out fixes before the release and then let it stay that way for a few months (they wouldn't care if a spec is 10% stronger than everyone else, for instance). He said they "didn't want to nerf specs people had put work into with their artifact" so most balancing will be now, before/at release, and then no balancing until we're at a point where many have two artifacts at a high level i suppose.

Did you even read the interviews?

"they wouldn't care if a spec is 10% stronger than everyone else, for instance" this is so not what they said.

Even using the mage as example. "If Fire is way too good, rather than bringing them down to a point where they are tied with or worse than Frost and Arcane, they will take them to slightly too good still." he basically flat out states nerfs will happen. What they aren't doing is nerfing the spec that is 10% stronger to then be 10% weaker. Instead they will nerf spec to be 2% stronger. It will stay stronger, but not nearly as strong.

[miffy23]

Did you even read the interviews?

"they wouldn't care if a spec is 10% stronger than everyone else, for instance" this is so not what they said.

Even using the mage as example. "If Fire is way too good, rather than bringing them down to a point where they are tied with or worse than Frost and Arcane, they will take them to slightly too good still." he basically flat out states nerfs will happen. What they aren't doing is nerfing the spec that is 10% stronger to then be 10% weaker. Instead they will nerf spec to be 2% stronger. It will stay stronger, but not nearly as strong.

I always find it fascinating how messages get completely misunderstood and misrepresented and then spread.

[Deleted]

Did you even read the interviews?

"they wouldn't care if a spec is 10% stronger than everyone else, for instance" this is so not what they said.

Even using the mage as example. "If Fire is way too good, rather than bringing them down to a point where they are tied with or worse than Frost and Arcane, they will take them to slightly too good still." he basically flat out states nerfs will happen. What they aren't doing is nerfing the spec that is 10% stronger to then be 10% weaker. Instead they will nerf spec to be 2% stronger. It will stay stronger, but not nearly as strong.

To be fair, they always say this. In the past there were a lot of cases where this resulted in overnerfing even if that wasn't their intention.

Personally I'll just wait and see until raids get released. The proof is in the eating of the pudding after all I hope they'll get it right, but for now it's anybody's guess. Obviously, feedback before that time is super important, but I'll leave that to the experienced testers.

[beanman12345]

To be fair, they always say this. In the past there were a lot of cases where this resulted in overnerfing even if that wasn't their intention.

Personally I'll just wait and see until raids get released. The proof is in the eating of the pudding after all I hope they'll get it right, but for now it's anybody's guess. Obviously, feedback before that time is super important, but I'll leave that to the experienced testers.

Oh i'm not saying they will or won't get the nerfs right. in some cases i'm sure they won't. But this guy states they are going to do nothing. which they flat out said they are going to nerf specs when needed.

[Karlz0rz]

Blizzard say and do a lot of things!
Let's just all wait until the game gets released and see how things are then :P.

[Gorsameth]

Balance for 100? No. I dont think we will see a balance pass before launch.

Will we see a balance fix before the first raid opens? Yes I fully expect we will.

[precious]

Expect outlaw nerfs tomorrow. Its stupid of how far ahead is atm in ST.

[Deleted]

Nope, not before Legion is here.

[Deleted]

Oh i'm not saying they will or won't get the nerfs right. in some cases i'm sure they won't. But this guy states they are going to do nothing. which they flat out said they are going to nerf specs when needed.

Fair enough

In response to the original question: I'm going to assume that Blizz collected a lot of data during Beta, but won't be bringing many balancing tweaks near release unless something is stupidly broken. In the end, they'll most likely have more stuff to adjust than just class balance and I'd rather they focus on the more pressing matters that affect everyone. After all, it would be worse to have major issues with quests, artifacts or server stability near launch. Class balance only really matters when stuff like Mythic+ dungeons and raids are released (and rated PvP, but that's a different beast entirely).

[Deleted]

I'm not really convinced their current plans are that great either... imagine you start with some spec that is slightly underpowered.. now if they really act like they said they would with balancing, you KNOW you'll keep on being underpowered for a LOOOONG time since Blizzard will only do minimal power reductions on the currently leading spec. Might feel pretty bad.