Sylvanas is evil

[Deleted]

The bias for Sylvanas is so strong it's ridiculous.

She's evil. She's consistently been evil ever since Arthas made her what she is.

In Gilneas she killed Genn's son just to spite the worgen, she outright lied to the horde emissary, she disobeyed the orders of Garrosh, her Warchief, and bombed Gilneas with the Plague.

Yet Genn and Jaina get the most crap. They are right though and justified in their actions. The alliance is screwed either way. What good will it be if we defeat the Legion only to go under yet again, just this time it will be to a dark lady instead of a dark lord.

She's hot though, I guess that excuses all her actions.

[DeltrusDisc]

An incredibly biased opinion.

Or do you think your opinion is fact because it is backed up by some facts?

This coming from a fellow Alliance player.

[InfernalDark]

Alliance fanboy whining, yawn.

[Emeraldon]

IN MY EYES THE JEDI ALLIANCE ARE EVIL!

No

[cparle87]

Okie dokie. In order. She was going to shoot Genn, but his son sacrificed himself to take the hit. She even said right there that arrow was not meant for 'his whelp.' Secondly, Garrosh was half a breath from sending the Forsaken in as meat shields for the rest of the Horde to invade Gilneas anyway before Sylvanas stepped in and got him to let her handle the invasion. That still could've happened if she didn't get results.

[Nalorakk]

OP is an idiot
OP is an alliance fanboy

coincidence?
not at all

[Venziir]

The bias for Sylvanas is so strong it's ridiculous.

She's evil. She's consistently been evil ever since Arthas made her what she is.

In Gilneas she killed Genn's son just to spite the worgen, she outright lied to the horde emissary, she disobeyed the orders of Garrosh, her Warchief, and bombed Gilneas with the Plague.

Yet Genn and Jaina get the most crap. They are right though and justified in their actions. The alliance is screwed either way. What good will it be if we defeat the Legion only to go under yet again, just this time it will be to a dark lady instead of a dark lord.

She's hot though, I guess that excuses all her actions.

She's not "just" evil. She's not a black and white character. She's pragmatic to boot and cares very little about others than her self and her people, which is now the entire Horde, which could be interesting. She did not just kill Genn's son out of spite; they were at war not to mention that he takes the arrow instead of his father. Yes, she did disobey Garrosh, but only partly, since she was told to conquer Gilneas no matter what. In Legion, Genn is the one who instigates war with the Horde in Stormheim, not Sylvanas. No one from the Alliance even attempts to ask the Horde, why they ran away from the Broken Shore, they simply just assumed that they'd been betrayed and went apeshit instead of sending a single ambassador or diplomat or even envoy.

Sylvanas isn't kind, or good, obviously. But she isn't not just evil, if she was she wouldn't have saved the Horde at the Broken Shore, nor would she have helped Varian or anyone else during that battle. It's not black and white.... NEXT!

[Ryzeth]

The bias for Sylvanas is so strong it's ridiculous.

She's evil. She's consistently been evil ever since Arthas made her what she is.
Totally. Let's just ignore all the times she has -willingly- offered help to the horde, and been ignored/rebuffed. Not to mention she -willingly helped the blood elves to clean up the mess Arthas left in Silvermoon/Ghostlands.-

In Gilneas she killed Genn's son just to spite the worgen, she outright lied to the horde emissary, she disobeyed the orders of Garrosh, her Warchief, and bombed Gilneas with the Plague.
She didn't kill him out of spite. His son jumped in front of the arrow that she shot at Genn, to save his father. Do you even follow the storyline? She also didn't disobey any orders; she was permitted to utilise a weaker strand of the plague.

Yet Genn and Jaina get the most crap. They are right though and justified in their actions. The alliance is screwed either way. What good will it be if we defeat the Legion only to go under yet again, just this time it will be to a dark lady instead of a dark lord.
Jaina is hardly justified; she wanted Garrosh slain for what he did, and that's what happened. None of the actual Horde supported him during his tenure as Warchief. Her wanted vengeance on the rest of the Horde is not "justifiable" it's just her being arrogant and stubborn.

She's hot though, I guess that excuses all her actions.

The utter clueless ignorance coming from you, is truly amazing.

[Deleted]

She saved the horde, but she didn't do it out of the kindness of her heart, it made no sense for all of them to die there. While Varian was tricked by Gul'dan and the legion's retreat to the tomb and died.

I like how people also ignore the Wrathgate and write it off to some splinter faction within the Forsaken. Yeah right...

For all his faults Garrosh believed in the horde and what he did, he did to further the horde. All Sylvanas ever did was have it her way or the highway. She hated Arthas and tried to kill him at all costs and past that she's been ignoring the chain of command and doing whatever she pleases.

[Lochton]

The bias for Sylvanas is so strong it's ridiculous.

That is actually bias, you know?

She's evil. She's consistently been evil ever since Arthas made her what she is.

That is actually bias as well, you know?

In Gilneas she killed Genn's son just to spite the worgen, she outright lied to the horde emissary, she disobeyed the orders of Garrosh, her Warchief, and bombed Gilneas with the Plague.

That is actually war, you know? Garrosh was a tactical fool, nothing more.

Yet Genn and Jaina get the most crap. They are right though and justified in their actions. The alliance is screwed either way. What good will it be if we defeat the Legion only to go under yet again, just this time it will be to a dark lady instead of a dark lord.

Sylvanas was right in her actions too.

She's hot though, I guess that excuses all her actions.

That is actually bias, you know?

[Dreknar20]

shes evil for................killing her enemies?

Isnt that what everyone does

[Venziir]

She saved the horde, but she didn't do it out of the kindness of her heart, it made no sense for all of them to die there. While Varian was tricked by Gul'dan and the legion's retreat to the tomb and died.

I like how people also ignore the Wrathgate and write it off to some splinter faction within the Forsaken. Yeah right...

For all his faults Garrosh believed in the horde and what he did, he did to further the horde. All Sylvanas ever did was have it her way or the highway. She hated Arthas and tried to kill him at all costs and past that she's been ignoring the chain of command and doing whatever she pleases.

That's exactly what Garrosh did too, he simply just claimed that it was about how superior the orcs were. Just like how Sylvanas in wotlk claimed that her only motif was vengeance.

As for the Wrathgate; We KNOW it was a splinter faction, we KNOW it was the work on the Burning Legion, we KNOW it WASN'T Sylvanas, go stuff that headcanon nonsense of yours elsewhere.

She saved Vol'jin and the Horde because she knew it was the right thing, she could've just saved herself or her own troops, but no, she did not. Varian wasn't tricked anymore than the Horde was, he just went another way and insisted on taking the front. The entire Broken Shore was one big trap, we KNOW this.

[tanksin the enhance shamy]

wrathgate was a plan orchestrated largely by the dreadlord sylvanas held captive

[Calfredd]

In Gilneas she killed Genn's son just to spite the worgen, she outright lied to the horde emissary, she disobeyed the orders of Garrosh, her Warchief, and bombed Gilneas with the Plague.

You are aware (obviously not but still...) that Sylvanas was aiming for Genn but his son took the shot for him. She even says that the arrow wasn't meant to be wasted on him.

[Lochton]

She saved the horde, but she didn't do it out of the kindness of her heart, it made no sense for all of them to die there. While Varian was tricked by Gul'dan and the legion's retreat to the tomb and died.

She called back the Horde because she saw it as not a chance for her part to advance further, you know, HUGE massive army on the ridge as well.

I like how people also ignore the Wrathgate and write it off to some splinter faction within the Forsaken. Yeah right...

Lore states it wasn't her people, so all the tin foil you want.

For all his faults Garrosh believed in the horde and what he did, he did to further the horde. All Sylvanas ever did was have it her way or the highway. She hated Arthas and tried to kill him at all costs and past that she's been ignoring the chain of command and doing whatever she pleases.

Garrosh DIDN'T believe in the Horde, in the end it was culled down to what he thought was the true Horde. You're judging Sylvanas on one blunder of vengeance, while Garrosh has done the same, or worse.

[Gherothar]

12 freakin' years of story and character development and there are still retards who don't get it. I think is partly Blizzard's fault, though, with their terrible story-telling, but man. How dense can people be?

[Leih]

I don't even main Horde but I felt pretty emotional during the cutscene where she stared into space while everything went on around her, taking in the magnitude of what had just happened, then turned to the assembled crowds and rallied them for revenge.

I sincerely hope they DON'T make her a bad warchief. It'd be nice if for one a character actually learned and became better instead of the usual Blizzard trademark corruption route.

[Ryzeth]

She saved the horde, but she didn't do it out of the kindness of her heart, it made no sense for all of them to die there. While Varian was tricked by Gul'dan and the legion's retreat to the tomb and died.
So you admit Sylvanas is smarter. Got it.

I like how people also ignore the Wrathgate and write it off to some splinter faction within the Forsaken. Yeah right...
That's because Putress let the power get to his head. You can say that isn't true all you like, but he wanted to see how devastating it could actually be. He killed hundreds of Horde with it too, in case you missed it.

For all his faults Garrosh believed in the horde and what he did, he did to further the horde. All Sylvanas ever did was have it her way or the highway. She hated Arthas and tried to kill him at all costs and past that she's been ignoring the chain of command and doing whatever she pleases.
No. He did what he wanted to, to benefit him the most. Again, do you not actually follow the storyline? The power got to his head, and he wanted more of it. That's why he embraced the Sha/Old Gods because they gave him unprecedented amounts of power, that ended up destroying his body.

Tin foil hat wearers need to be put down.

[kumarshah]

Sylvanas is the savior Horde deserves and got.

[Deleted]

If Sylvanas wasn't chaotic evil she wouldn't be an interresting character. That doesn't mean she's inherently evil, she just performs actions that any reasonable human being will percieve as evil unless you agree with said actions. She's a wonderful personality, one of the best Blizzard has ever created tbh, but if she wasn't a pragmatic, narcissistic and controversial personality she wouldn't be fun to watch. We can root for her because she (rather we) can sort of justify her behavior and attempt to humanize her despite her incredibly dark activities.

I mean, she works actively to subject living creatures to the same torment and horror that she was so pissed off to have suffered from herself for the benefit of her already cursed and previously dying out people. She created allegiances/servitude of terrible beings that have no place in service to her to further her goals and advance her power. She's the evil dictator that we love to root for because she's actualy transparrent and we can relate to that.

She's not trying to hide her chaotic evil ways or behavior, which is why we admire her. She's our dream of stepping out of the societal norms and doing what we want/feel is best and being rewarded for it. That's what makes her a brilliant character - we like to imagine ourselves overcomming the tragedies she has suffered, telling the world to fuck itself and give up all empathy for the world to further our own goals and ambitions.

I'm worried Legion will try to bring a more 'stereotype' vibe to Sylvanas. I realize the goal is to try to empower her character and widen her arc but if she begins actualy deviating too much from the 'fuck the world' fantasy she represents, I don't think she'll be interresting anymore. By far my favorite character in Warcraft history and I'm worried for her future..