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    [Guardian] 7.2.5 Legion Guardian Guide by Pumps

    Legion Guardian Guide by Pumps




    Hey mates, brief introduction for me. Armory Guild WCL YouTube Druid Discord Tank Discord

    Welcome to my Legion Guardian Guide, Originally wrote the guide in a more in depth google doc link here. Converting some things to mmoc format was less than ideal.
    My name is Sam and i live in Australia, my Druid's name is Pumps, I am an officer/raid leader in the guild, Honestly. I also write most of our boss strats for prog.
    I have been playing WoW since BC launch and haven't missed a raid tier since. Maining Guardian Druid since MoP but i also play all the tanks as needed.
    Raiding at varying levels from world top 10 to world top 400. Currently a more relaxed world top 10-30.
    I am on US - Frostmourne, a now Oceanic realm, even though there were dark days of 00+ ping always, it is now firmly the home of the majority of the top oceanic players.
    My guide will mostly prioritize top tier progression raiding and is heavily subject to change at the start of any raid tier, as new builds/strats/changes come to fruition.

    Why are you writing this far too long guide?
    MMOC has been a solid source of info for almost all the classes for a fair while now and poor Guardian druids have missed out on that benefit with the last guide being a little outdated now, Also year long farm boredom helps.

    7.2.5 TLDR - Credit to Faide

    What Changed from WoD to Legion
    Bears are currently in a great place even coming from the previous tier where we excelled in most aspects, as with most of other tanks our AoE dps is really high and our pure bear single target is middle of the pack, this is mainly because our rotation is aoe centric eg; using Swipe and Thrash single target. The rotation has not changed much and should be quite simple to pick up if you have played any form of Druid tank in the past.

    Overall with our High Health pool due to our new Mastery (which increases our Health and Healing taken) and solid Active Mit (100%+ uptime) we are looking to be quite smooth sponge tanks, excelling especially on more magic oriented fights.

    Active Mitigation
    Savage Defense - is gone completely and we now have 2 new Active mit spells;
    Ironfur - Increases Armor by 65% for 6 seconds, multiple uses stack.
    Frenzied Regen - has changed to a 2 (3 with traits) charge system of Heals you for 50% of all damage taken in the last 5 sec over 3 sec, minimum 5% of maximum health.

    Damaging Abilities
    Mangle - Hasn't changed that much, it's cooldown is reduced by haste and there is a new passive called 'Gore' which is a 15% chance on Thrash/Swipe/Moonfire to reset the CD on mangle and make it generate 4 extra rage.
    Thrash - now has a cooldown and can be stacked up to 3 times like the old lacerate.
    Swipe - Is back boys, now our new filler spell, has no CD and costs no rage.
    Moonfire - Able to be cast in Bear form now and therefore an integral part of our new rotation.
    Maul - 7.2.5 Now on the GCD but is our hardest hitting ability, costs 45 rage.
    Lacerate - Removed/semi baked into Thrash

    Defensive Cooldowns
    Barkskin - Similar to WoD but now has a slightly longer cooldown at 90 seconds baseline.
    Survival Instincts - Got the same treatment as barkskin, still 2 charges but slightly longer cooldown at 4minutes each baseline.

    Artifact Ability
    Rage of the Sleeper - Unleashes the rage of Ursoc for 10 sec, preventing 25% of all damage you take and reflecting (250% of Attack power) Nature damage back at your attackers.
    The thorns is incredibly powerful on mobs with fast attacks or certain spells that proc it rapidly, can easily be the top of your damage breakdown.
    In combination with the major trait Embrace of the Nightmare, is easily one of our best CDs offensively and defensively in a large amount of situations.
    Try not to get too triggered when you pop it and then they get chain stunned

    Other noteworthy changes
    Incapacitating Roar baseline, it's not great.
    Rebirth can be cast in Bear form
    Lost most of our baseline heals, just keeping Healing Touch.
    Can no longer have Mighty bash and Typhoon at the same time.
    Lost Berserk as a cooldown, now baked into the Incarnation talent.
    Maul no longer has any defensive benefit with the removal of Tooth and claw.
    Resolve is removed for all tanks.
    Shapeshift CD - Powershifting
    One of the more annoying lesser known changes is that power shifting is gone, powershifting was a macro that changed your form into the same form, so you cast bear form again and instead of putting you into human form it immediately changes you back to bear.
    This was primarily for pvp but had extra rage gen power in pve.
    However in Legion all shapeshifting has a 1 second GCD now so shifting in and out of bear for us now loses 2 full GCDs out and back in.




    Abilities


    Offensive

    Mangle - Mangle the target for 387% Physical damage. Deals 20% additional damage against bleeding targets.
    High damage, generates 5 rage.

    Swipe - Swipe nearby enemies, inflicting Physical damage.
    Our filler spell, a swipe in an aoe 360 degrees around you, deals medium damage. Doesn't generate rage on it's own but in combination with GG can get quite a lot from the moonfire procs in large packs.

    Thrash - Thrash all nearby enemies, dealing immediate physical damage and periodic bleed damage.
    Higher damage than swipe and mangle with thrash relics, but with a CD, the immediate damage is the bulk of the damage at the moment. Maintaining thrash stacks quite a lot easier than the old lacerate single target stacks.

    Moonfire - A quick beam of lunar light burns the enemy for (100% of Spell power) Arcane damage and then an additional (440% of Spell power) Arcane damage over 16 sec. Usable while in Bear Form.
    A nice ranged DoT, semi replaces the role of faerie fire in the past in terms of attacking from ranged.

    Maul - Maul the target for 750% Physical damage.
    Our only offensive rage spender, now on the GCD as of 7.2.5, do not spam this if you are new, only use it to avoid hitting rage cap or it will eat all the rage you can generate and you will have none to use defensively.
    Our hardest hitting ability now after 7.2.5.

    Defensive / AM

    Ironfur - Increases armor by 65% for 6 sec. Multiple uses of this ability may overlap.
    Our Physical Active Mitigation spell, what most of your rage is going to be spent on while tanking any real physical damage because unlike other AMs you can never use too much of this due to it's ability to stack.


    Frenzied Regen - Heals you for 50% of all damage taken in the last 5 sec over 3 sec, minimum 5% of maximum health.
    All of our self heals outside of talents/gear.
    Rather underwhelming in most low damage situations, feels almost wasteful or negligible in 5 mans but really shines in higher damage taken situations like raids or large burstier pulls.

    Cooldowns

    Barkskin - Your skin becomes as tough as bark, reducing all damage you take by 20% and preventing damage from delaying your spellcasts. Lasts 12 sec.
    Our small CD but lasts quite a long duration, almost a 30% uptime when combined with Survival of the Fittest and traits. Used whenever you are tanking any real damage mostly.

    Survival Instincts - Reduces all damage you take by 50% for 6 sec. Max 2 charges.
    Our big CD, the 2 charges makes it excellent in more single or quick succession nuke burst situations.
    Says max 2 charges there is a legendary that gives you a 3rd. Again quite good synergy with Survival of the Fittest.

    Rage of the Sleeper - Unleashes the rage of Ursoc for 10 sec, preventing 25% of all damage you take and reflecting (250% of Attack power) Nature damage back at your attackers.
    While the artifact is not actually an ability it definitely deserves a large mention as you cannot play the spec properly without it.
    In combination with the major trait Embrace of the Nightmare, is easily one of best CDs in the game offensively and defensively in a large amount of situations.

    Utility
    Druid utility is quite lacking currently and is definitely the weakest part of the class with our only real utility spell being stampeding roar most experienced guardians might have a giggle at this category.


    Stampeding Roar - Lets loose a wild roar, increasing the movement speed of all friendly players within 10 yards by 60% for 8 sec.
    While a great mobility tool for the raid being a little rarer with Roar only being Guardian and Feral it does come at the cost of a whole row of talents.

    Rebirth - Returns the spirit to the body, restoring a dead target to life with 60% health and 20% mana. Castable in combat.
    Basic battle res, good in 5 mans okay in raids although be wary ressing people in melee range in front of the boss, can be dangerous.

    Incapacitating Roar - Invokes the spirit of Ursol to roar, incapacitating all enemies within 10 yards for 3 sec. Any damage caused will remove the effect. Usable in all shapeshift forms.
    The best utility tool we have in dungeons at the moment, it's only value is interrupting casts for a millisecond, most mobs will immediately start casting again.
    Gets some ok value in a few dungeons where the mobs ability goes on CD after they cast it; eg BRH, Nelths

    Passives

    Gore - Using Thrash, Swipe or Moonfire has a 15% chance to rest the cooldown on Mangle and cause it to generate 4 Rage.

    Thick Hide - Reduces all damage taken by 6%.


    Talents


    Summary of Preferences and Why;
    Level 15

    Brambles - Sharp brambles protect you, absorbing and reflecting up to (Attack power * 0.24) damage from each attack.
    Only dps talent, in situations where tankiness is not that relevant, this is the clear winner. Using Barkskin off CD for max dps

    Bristling Fur - Bristle your fur, causing you to generate Rage based on damage taken for 8 sec.
    Highest amount of rage gen when used well and has it's place but there is a point where Blood Frenzy is more rage which makes this talent overall the least appealing, dungeon wise.
    Can be a little shit single target if you dodge multiple swings the rage gen is small, my go to rage talent now.

    Blood Frenzy - Thrash also generates 2 Rage each time it deals damage.
    Decent rage gen especially with any significant aoe. Bristling Fur pulls ahead in terms of rage gained once you start taking significant damage. eg; not easy dungeons

    Level 30

    Guttural Roars -Increases the radius of Stampeding Roar by 200%, the radius of Incapacitating Roar by 100%, and reduces the cooldown of Stampeding Roar by 50%.
    Easily the number 1 talent atm, even if the raid doesn't need your roars the other two are just too underwhelming.

    Intimidating Roar - [I]Replaces disorienting roar, doesnt break on damage. Now roots instead of fears in 7.2/I]


    Wild Charge - Charge to an enemy, immobilizing them for 4 sec. (has different effects in each different form)
    Will likely have a niche on a fight or 2 where you charge back after large knockback.

    Level 45

    Balance Affinity - Passive: Increases the range of all of your abilities by 5 yards. Moonkin Form spells Starsurge Lunar Strike Solar Wrath Sunfire.
    My pick most of the time in 5 mans, Extra 5 yards on all your abilities is very nice for dungeons and some raid encounters, damage in boomkin form quite undertuned.

    Feral Affinity - Passive: Increases your movement speed by 15%. Cat form spells: Shred, Rip, Rake and Ferocious Bite.
    Movement speed often underrated, currently the highest dps affinity with Catweaving rotation.

    Resto Affinity - Passive: Heals you for 3% of your maximum health every 5 sec. If you are at full health, a random nearby injured ally will be healed instead. Resto spells gained; Rejuvenation, Swiftmend and Healing Touch.
    The healing output on spells like swiftmend/rejuv is quite decent and the passive gets constant value.

    Level 60

    Mighty Bash - Invokes the spirit of Ursoc to stun the target for 5 sec. Usable in all shapeshift forms.
    I heavily prefer the Typhoon niche in most situations due to the amount of stuns in the game and DR.

    Mass Entangle - Roots the target in place for 30 sec and spreads to additional nearby enemies. Damage may interrupt the effect. Usable in all shapeshift forms
    Super niche, it's been used once or twice in the past eg; Iron maidens. May have its time to shine again.

    Typhoon - Strikes targets within 15 yards in front of you with a violent Typhoon, knocking them back and dazing them for 6 sec. Usable in all shapeshift forms.
    This is my go to 99% of the time, good interrupt/repositioning and a nice typhoon + sprint away combo is the ultimate defense.

    Level 75

    Soul of the Forest - Mangle generates 5 more Rage and deals 25% more damage.
    An alternate to GG single target in terms of rage gen, falls behind when there is more than 1 mob.

    Incarnation - An improved Bear Form that reduces the cooldown on all melee damage abilities and Growl to 1.5 sec, Increases armor by 15% and causes Mangle to hit up to 3 targets. Lasts 30 seconds.
    Highest dps once you get the Embrace of the Nightmare trait if used optimally, also makes taunt and thrash 1.5s CD so great for picking up lots of adds.

    Galactic Guardian - Your damage has a 7% chance to trigger a free automatic Moonfire on that target. When this occurs, the next Moonfire you cast generates 8 Rage and deal 300% extra initial damage.
    Best for most scenarios, easy to use. Solid rage gen on multiple targets.
    Since 7.1, now a dps gain to use over swipe single target and 2 targets but swipe > ggmoonfire if 3+ targets. Works great with balance shoulders.

    Level 90

    Earthwarden - When you deal direct damage with Thrash, you gain a charge of Earthwarden, reducing the damage of the next auto attack you take by 30%. Earthwarden may have up to 3 charges.
    Pretty average talent all round havent found a use for it yet this xpac.

    Guardian of Elune - Mangle increases the duration of your next Ironfur or Mark of Ursol by 2 sec, or the healing of your next Frenzied Regeneration by 20%.
    On Average the best talent due to always getting good value.

    Survival of the Fittest - Reduces the cooldowns of Barkskin and Survival Instincts by 33%.
    Best dps talent with Brambles because the other 2 talents don't affect dps at all, mainly good for when you need defensives up sooner for more specific boss mechanic timings.

    Level 100

    Rend and Tear - While in Bear Form, Thrash also increases your damage dealt to the target, and reduces your damage taken from the target by 2% per application of Thrash.
    Was switching between this and Lunar beam until i got the legendary legs, both feel quite good, with the 2 extra thrash stack legendary legs this will likely continue to be the best talent single target.

    Lunar Beam -Summons a beam of lunar light at your location, dealing [(100% of Attack power) * 8] Arcane damage and healing you for [(300% of Attack power) * 8] over 8 sec.
    Comboing with Embrace of the Nightmare lines up perfectly and deals quite a lot of damage and heals a ton for 10 seconds, works decently with new legendary cape.

    Pulverize - A devastating blow that consumes 2 stacks of your Thrash on the target to deal 850% Physical damage, and reduces all damage you take by 9% for 20 sec.
    Only consuming 2 stacks makes it quite good as you can reapply 1 stack straight after using pulv, with the 7.1.5 buff this has quite strong DPS and defensive potential being better than Rend and Tear without the legs.

    Rotation, Stat Priorities and Enchants


    Stats

    Mastery - Increases total Health and healing taken as well as Attack power.
    Vers - Increases all damage and healing done and reduces damage taken.
    Haste - Lowers CD on Thrash and FR, slightly more rage gen from auto attacks.
    Crit - Increases Crit chance and converts % of crit into dodge.

    Stat Priority

    This stuff is probably going to change a little at the start of the tier but for now i am running;

    Defensive stat prio - Vers ≥ Mastery > Haste > Crit
    Pure Bear Dps stat prio - Haste > Crit ≥ Vers > Mastery
    Catweave stat prio - Crit ≥ Vers > Haste > Mastery


    Enchants

    Cloak - +200 Agility
    Ring - +200 Vers
    Neck - Currently the only enchant with a choice.
    Defensively Best - Mark of the Heavy Hide - Chance to proc 3000 armor for 10 seconds.
    Offensively Best - Mark of the Hidden Satyr - Chance to summon a Satyr which will fire a nightmare bolt at your target for fire damage. Averages 1-3% of your damage on a fight.

    Mark of the Trained Soldier - +600 Flat mastery, no proc.
    Mark of the Claw - Chance to proc 1000 Haste and Crit for 6 seconds. - good for aoe
    Mark of the Distant Army - Chance to summon a rain of arrows upon your target.

    Aslo available in 7.15 are new cheaper neck enchants; these have no real value outside of just being a cheaper alternative.
    Mark of the Deadly - +200 Crit
    Mark of the Versatile - +200 Versatility
    Mark of the Quick - +200 Haste
    Mark of the Master - +200 Mastery

    Potions
    Agi > Vers for dps in WoD potions

    Potion of the Old War - Use: Summons a pair of ghostly fallen warriors that will echo your melee attacks and abilities.
    - Highest DPS potion for bear at the moment if used optimally.

    Potion of Prolonged Power - Use: Increase Agi + Stam by 2500 for 60 seconds. 60s CD. Great pot for 5 mans and aoe currently due to insane uptime. Replaced wod pots for aoe.

    Potion of Deadly Grace - Use: Grants your attacks a chance to unleash a bolt of energy at your target. Lasts 25s

    Unbending Potion - Use: Increases your bonus armor by 3500 for 25 sec.
    Quite solid defensively, but no longer has any Offensive benefit eg pre potting at the start of a fight.


    Rotation

    Bears have currently quite a simple rotation offensively.
    1. Moonfire 100% uptime
    2. Mangle off CD
    3. Thrash 100% uptime and use off CD
    4. Moonfire with GG proc > Swipe if 2 targets or less.
    5. Maul
    6. Swipe as filler, Swipe > Mangle if 3+ Targets.

    General single target opener something like Moonfire while running in > Mangle > Thrash > Swipe

    You are of course a tank still but active mit is quite straightforward atm;
    1. Ironfur if you are tanking physical damage
    2. CDs as you need, Rots/Skin/SI

    Most intricacies are fight dependant eg; when to use active mit or cds appropriately like RotS/Incarnation.
    General tank rule of thumb is use everything at your disposal to stay alive even if it means not having a CD later on in the fight that you think you need, you will be surprised how often you get through things with less CD's than expected. If you die while still having things up that could've saved you then you are playing sub optimally for your raid.


    Catweaving not recommended for beginners
    Currently the optimal dps rotation involves "Catweaving" which in an ideal not tanking situation your rotation looks something like; as of 7.2.5 fairly irrelevant
    Mangle > Thrash (bear) > Rip > Rake > Shred > Swipe > Maul (Moonfire being constantly up due to the GG talent)
    Which means you shift into cat form to dump all your energy then shift back into bear to Mangle > Thrash then back to cat to dump your energy and rinse repeat.
    Rotation looks something like Mangle > Thrash > Cat > Rake > Shred > Shred > Bear > Mangle > Thrash > Shred > Shred > Rip > Repeat. Mauling whenever possible generally 2 per Bear cast and Ferocious biting sub 25%. Can fit extra Ferocious bites in with enough haste.
    Combo Point spender rotation Rip > Rip > FB repeat generally.

    Artifact Routes and Legendaries


    Claws of Ursoc's 3 relic slots are Fire, Blood and Life. The 3rd slot which is locked is Life, which you unlock through the Druid Campaign in your class hall, currently takes about 10 days or so to complete.
    All Routes are heavily dependant on how much AP you can acquire in a certain amount of time pre raid.
    Which route to go will depend on how much we can actually acquire and where we stand defensively, meaning how much defense can we sacrifice to maximize damage without sacrificing our survivability too much.
    If 27 traits is easily achievable before or early into raid the most likely route will be the top route to EotN. Currently looking like you will have around 20 traits in the first tier.

    My current Artifact pathing, leaving Mauler until last only edit possibly getting all 3 Mangle traits before Bear Hug.



    More in-depth Artifact trait stuff including Relic boss drop list

    7.2 Artifact Traits Pathing

    After 35 traits i will be getting traits in this following order; - note: this is primarily a top end raiding dps focused route

    Fortitude of the Cenarion Circle - Increases damage by 10%, Armor by 12%, and Stamina by 10%.
    Jagged Claws - 10% Thrash damage
    Scintillating Moonlight - Moonfire reduces damage dealt to you by 1%(per rank) from that target
    Fleshknitting - Frenzied Regen gains 1 additional charge
    Pawsitive Outlook - Thrash has a 15% chance to trigger another Thrash
    Vicious Bites - 7% Mangle damage
    Ursoc's Endurance - Increase duration of Barkskin/Ironfur + Mark of Ursol by .5s
    Reinforced Fur - 4% increased Armor on Ironfur.
    Wildflesh - 5% increased Frenzied Regen Healing
    Bestial Fortitude - 1% Stamina
    Perpetual Spring - 3% CD Reduction on Barkskin
    Mauler - 3% Maul crit
    Sharpened Instincts - 3% extra damage reduction on Survival Instincts
    Concordance of the Legionfall - Your abilities have a chance to trigger Concordance of the Legionfall, increasing your vers by X per rank.

    Relics
    Leaving most of that stuff to the google doc, hard to transition it without making it super long.
    TL;DR Thrash offensively and Ursoc's Endurance Relics defensively, the best by far.



    Legendaries


    Neck - Prydaz, Xavriac's Magnum Opus - Every 30 seconds you gain an absorb shield for 15% of your max health for 30 seconds. This effect can only occur once every 30 seconds.
    Solid defensive legendary since 7.1.5.

    Wrist - Luffa Wrappings - Increase the damage and radius of Thrash by 25%.
    Great for 5 mans or burstier add fights where you don't get max thrash stacks or they don't fall off.

    Legs - Elize's Everlasting Encasement - Thrash can stack up to 2 more times.
    The interaction with Rend + Tear and the decent secondaries makes this great when you can get it consistently stacked high eg; raids.

    Ring - Sephuz's Secret - Successfully applying a loss of control effect to an enemy, interrupting or dispelling grants you 70% increased movement speed and 25% haste for 10 seconds. 30s CD
    Great for faster 5 mans where the legs don't get to stack up, similar to the belt.

    Chest - Ekowraith, Creator of Worlds - Increase the effect of Astral Influence, Feline Swiftness, Thick Hide and Ysera's Gift by 75%.
    Works on Thick Hide passive granting flat 4.5% damage taken reduction and also whatever affinity you use. Resto 2.25% hp per 5s , Balance 3.75 yards extra range and Feral 11.25% movespeed.

    Wasit - Cinidaria, the Symbiote - Your attacks cause an additional 30% damage as Physical to enemies above 90% health and leech 100% of the damage back.
    Decent secondaries, a little underrated, good for 5 mans and burstier add content. Cheese potential on bosses or adds that stay above 90% or have multiple high hp phases. Leech great for necrotic as it ignores necrotic.

    Feet - Skysec's Hold - Frenzied Regen heals you for an additional 12% of your maximum health over 5 seconds.
    Great secondaries, While the FR effect is often overheal in hard hitting raids, better for weaker content and more open world / 5 mans. Can be quite solid defensively.

    Ring - Dual Determination - Survival Instincts gains 1 additional charge and recharges 15% faster.
    Great for bosses with more set time hard hitting mechanics and mythic+, average secondaries. Synergizes well with Survival of the fittest. Great for prog.

    Head - Oakheart's Puny Quods -Barksin Instantly grants 45 rage plus an additional 15 rage over 3 seconds.
    Great stats, very mediocre legendary bonus.

    Trinket - Archimonde's Hatred Reborn -Use: Gain an absorb shield for 30% of your max health for 10 seconds. When the shield is consumed or expires, 75% of the damage absorbedis dealt to nearby enemies, split evenly. 75s CD.
    Decent dps value and a solid absorb on a short timer.

    Cloak - Fury of Nature - While in Bear Form, you deal 30% increased Nature and Arcane damage, and are healed for 30% of all Nature and Arcane damage done.
    Pretty decent in combination with the Balance shoulders (Lady and the Child) as an alternative to thrash bracers. Healing while small still adds up to a relevant amount.

    Ring - Soul of the Archdruid - Gains the Soul of the Forest talent.
    Pretty solid rage gen and a decent dps increase, stats qutie low on the ring but the talent is decent, overall good legendary.

    How i rate the legendaries from an overall standpoint, mainly a more dps oriented point of view.
    1 Elize's Everlasting Encasement
    2 Luffa Wrappings
    3 Ekowraith, Creator of Worlds
    4 Cinidaria, the Symbiote
    5 Archimonde's Hatred Reborn
    6 Soul of the Archdruid
    7 Fury of Nature
    8 Sephuz's Secret
    9 Prydaz, Xavriac's Magnum Opus
    10 Skysec's Hold
    11 Dual Determination
    12 Oakheart's Puny Quods

    Closing statements


    Thanks for reading mates, if you made it this far you are truly dedicated to being the Guardian of your raid.
    Leaving a few things like BiS lists and Boss specific strats to the google doc which i will be maintaining up to date to try to keep this already too long guide a little shorter. Feel free to whisper or PM me any unanswered questions or inaccuracies, i'm sure there will be a few things that need editing.

    Acronyms and Slang

    RotS Rage of the Sleeper
    EotN Embrace of the Nightmare
    AF Adaptive Fur
    GF Gory Fur
    GCD Global Cooldown
    FR Frenzied Regen
    BS or Skin Barkskin
    SI Survival Instincts
    SR or Roar Stampeding Roar
    GG Galactic Guardian
    SotF Soul of the Forest
    BF Bristling Fur
    GoE Guardian of Elune
    Inc Incarnation
    DoT Damage over Time
    IF Ironfur

    Changelist; last update - d/m/y - 18 / 6 / 2017
    - 26/8 published guide
    -11/9 Updated some Stats related notes eg; Vers ≥ Mastery
    -3/10 Updated things from gdoc to here, eg; Enchants/Pots
    -16/10 Updated more from gdoc; mainly ability descriptions
    -26/10 updated notes from patch 7.1 - Thick Hide nerf + GG change
    -29/10 updated notes from patch 7.1 - Potion of Prolonged power + GG moonfire rotational priority.
    -29/11 updated Nighthold BiS list in google doc.
    -30/12 Updated Guide for patch 7.1.5 - 7.1.5 TLDR - Credit to Vorem
    -16/1 Updated Enchants
    -25/3 Updated Guide for patch 7.2 - 7.2 TLDR - Credit to Vorem
    -6/4 Updated 7.2 Artifact Pathing
    -18/6 Updated Guide for patch 7.2.5 - notably just maul changes and new legos 7.2.5 TLDR - Credit to Faide
    Last edited by Pumpsm8; 2017-06-18 at 04:34 AM.

  2. #2
    This seems like a really great guide. Thanks so much for the great information. I do have a question though. You seem to heavily favor offensive paths for artifacts and legendaries/relics. Do you think that is worth it? I usually like trying to be as defensive as possible, making it as easy as possible on my healer. What do you think is the best defensive path for artifacts/legendaries?

  3. #3
    I like this. Upload some vids of you tanking the new 5 mans on legion, give us all something to watch over the weekend

  4. #4
    How strong do you think Guardian druids are now with the mastery nerf in Legion?

  5. #5
    Thanks alot for the effort and time spent on the guide, god knows the guardian section needed it. It looks pretty informative, hopefully the rest of the community will check and contribute their knowledge or give their input and feedback.

    Sticky please!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Since I'm guessing you have played the Beta and have a feel for how hard we get hit in raid and mythics+, would you suggest a defensive rage generating talent or the more offensive Brambles gor our first tier? Additionaly could you include the optimal talent builts for mythics+ and the ones for raids?
    Lastly, I have gotten a feeling that some of your choices rely on personal playstyle/preference and not necessarily on numbers? If that's the case a reference should be put as a reminder.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by sethers656 View Post
    This seems like a really great guide. Thanks so much for the great information. I do have a question though. You seem to heavily favor offensive paths for artifacts and legendaries/relics. Do you think that is worth it? I usually like trying to be as defensive as possible, making it as easy as possible on my healer. What do you think is the best defensive path for artifacts/legendaries?
    It's really dependant on how hard the content im progressing is, if i ever feel i am in danger of dying due to being too offensive it's always fairly easy to reign it back a bit swapping trinkets or playstyle, but i have always found it's a lot easier for you to bring say 20-30k more dps to the raid than a DPS player adjusting and bringing the same amount but it's definitely all a balancing act.


    Quote Originally Posted by Shenrais View Post
    How strong do you think Guardian druids are now with the mastery nerf in Legion?
    Still really strong, a nerf was definitely expected i think, whenever it's a general consesus that a class is the strongest by a bit too much you know it's coming.

    Top 3 for sure currently. Would of preferred just the +% healing modifier of mastery to get nerfed or even baseline bear form stam instead of the +%health but i just like having a lot of health.


    Quote Originally Posted by Selerian View Post
    Thanks alot for the effort and time spent on the guide, god knows the guardian section needed it. It looks pretty informative, hopefully the rest of the community will check and contribute their knowledge or give their input and feedback.

    Sticky please!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Since I'm guessing you have played the Beta and have a feel for how hard we get hit in raid and mythics+, would you suggest a defensive rage generating talent or the more offensive Brambles gor our first tier? Additionaly could you include the optimal talent builts for mythics+ and the ones for raids?
    Lastly, I have gotten a feeling that some of your choices rely on personal playstyle/preference and not necessarily on numbers? If that's the case a reference should be put as a reminder.
    Yeah as soon as things get a little harder it's definitely better to pick up a rage talent, the damage and mitigation from Brambles is rather low, Bristling Fur and Blood Frenzy are pretty close, i suggest Blood Frenzy for starters and 5 mans because it's passive and if you aren't using Bristling fur optimally it's generally less rage.

  7. #7
    Galactic Guardian - Your damage has a 10% chance to trigger a free automatic Moonfire on that target. When this occurs, the next Moonfire you cast generates 15 Rage.
    Best for most scenarios, easy to use. Solid rage gen on multiple targets.
    Is a Dps loss to use the Moonfire procs on single target.

    What do you mean by that? If I'm GG, I should never use Moonfire except for the pull? as the 15 rage is still not worth casting it? or do you mean one shouldn't play GG in a ST situation (which makes much more sense to me )


    and about the "catweaving". I think that probably only works when I'm currently not tanking as otherwise I'm too squishy?

  8. #8
    If you had the talent, yes you'd want to use the proc. That's way too much rage to ignore if you're actively tanking. But yeah what he's saying is that it's not the best talent for single target dps. Also, yes you'd obviously never want to bearcat while tanking. That would be just silly.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by IMBA View Post
    Galactic Guardian - Your damage has a 10% chance to trigger a free automatic Moonfire on that target. When this occurs, the next Moonfire you cast generates 15 Rage.
    Best for most scenarios, easy to use. Solid rage gen on multiple targets.
    Is a Dps loss to use the Moonfire procs on single target.

    What do you mean by that? If I'm GG, I should never use Moonfire except for the pull? as the 15 rage is still not worth casting it? or do you mean one shouldn't play GG in a ST situation (which makes much more sense to me )


    and about the "catweaving". I think that probably only works when I'm currently not tanking as otherwise I'm too squishy?
    Yeah generally while you are tanking and need the rage it is good to use the procs, but if you already high rage or don't need eg; easy content or you aren't currently tanking with high rage, single target it's a dps loss over swipe/mangle/thrash.

    As for catweaving yeah only when you aren't tanking, you get hit quite hard in cat form.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbs View Post
    If you had the talent, yes you'd want to use the proc. That's way too much rage to ignore if you're actively tanking. But yeah what he's saying is that it's not the best talent for single target dps. Also, yes you'd obviously never want to bearcat while tanking. That would be just silly.
    GG still is the best talent for single target DPS, especially when catweaving, it's just even more dps to not use the moonfire procs.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpsm8 View Post
    GG still is the best talent for single target DPS, especially when catweaving, it's just even more dps to not use the moonfire procs.
    Huh. Learn something new every day. Thanks friend!

  11. #11
    I saw on your google docs that you already gave us our BiS Gear from Emerald Nightmare, and thats pretty amazing and helpfull, but made me think if you could help us with our BiS Gear pre-raid content if its not a problem.
    Thanks a lot for all the work you have done here, its a very great guide

  12. #12
    It's a good guide but i am not agree with one point. You say the best runes are "Jagged claws" and "Vicious Bite", why ? You can take "Reinforced fur", "Sharpened instinct" or "Ursoc's endurance". In progress you will play more tanky than DPS.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Loryc View Post
    I saw on your google docs that you already gave us our BiS Gear from Emerald Nightmare, and thats pretty amazing and helpfull, but made me think if you could help us with our BiS Gear pre-raid content if its not a problem.
    Thanks a lot for all the work you have done here, its a very great guide
    I contemplated making a Dungeon BiS list and i may in the future, but it's a little too RNG for a bis list with warforged/titanforged (outside of maybe Trinkets/Relics/Crafted Gear) generally just the highest ilvl pieces will be the best considering Mastery/Vers are very close now with Haste not far behind even Crit isn't that bad. Can't go too wrong gear wise.



    Quote Originally Posted by Egion View Post
    It's a good guide but i am not agree with one point. You say the best runes are "Jagged claws" and "Vicious Bite", why ? You can take "Reinforced fur", "Sharpened instinct" or "Ursoc's endurance". In progress you will play more tanky than DPS.
    It's all personal playstyle preference honestly, i think value per point relic the mangle and thrash ones give a fair bit more, but yeah everyone is different and sometimes your DPS doesn't matter as much as you being alive a little longer, in my google doc i have a pure defensive relic ranking list aswell which is;

    1. Reinforced Fur
    2. Wildflesh
    3. Ursoc's Endurance

    I don't personally rate Sharpened instincts very highly at the moment.

  14. #14
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    Alright everybody, this thread is now the official main Guardian thread. The other thread is closed to funnel all discussion into this thread and keep it active.

    Some of the last posts to continue discussion from where it left off in the other thread:


    Quote Originally Posted by Kaeth View Post
    Been checking on several of the other changes from the so-called August 26th hotfix, and so far none of the ones I've checked on are implemented. It's as if they posted this list of hotfix notes several days early. Before we accuse the developers of messing up our attack power fix, we should probably wait for the hotfix to be implemented...
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    I suppose its possible, its been the weekend and they probably wanted everyone to get a nice bit of rest before release week, and they might implement those on monday then.
    Quote Originally Posted by Veyloris View Post
    That is not how armor DR works. Each point of armor still gives the same amount of absolute TTL (and usefulness) per point, regardless of how much of the stat you have.

    To further illustrate that point, look at the sheet below.



    Let's call armor damage reduction "ADR". That is, at 6000 armor, you're granted 44.8% reduction=ADR.

    Each additional stack of ironfur is like another huge DR being layered onto you. If Ironfur instead gave you a buff that just gave flat DR, the first buff would be equal to ADR, the second would be about 70% of ADR, and the third would be just over 50% of ADR. In concrete terms, as shown on the sheet, this is equal to 44.7% DR, then a 30.9% DR, then a 23.6% DR, all being on you simultaneously.

    Just as a point of curiosity, those ratios incrase as your base armor does as well. So for a druid with 10k base armor, the ratios are in fact 100%/63%/46.5%. Druids scale EXTREMELY well with item level.

    Every tank is capable of being put in these terms to look very good, my point isn't that bears are overpowered (though I think the nerfs have been utterly overblown), just that the mathematics do not work as you keep asserting they do, and Ironfur is arguably one of the stronger DRs vs. physical damage.

    Additionally... Pallies won't have 50% reduction from SotR for a long time. At almost 860 ilvl on beta my pally alt has ~25% mastery, which is only 41% reduction, and that's with the artifact trait already applied and fairly poor itemization (IE. More mastery than it should have). It's unlikely paladins gearing haste will hit 50% mastery in the first tier, so using that number as a baseline for comparison is ridiculous.

    Also, comparing two abilities in a vacuum is ridiculous and sets up an environment for hyperbole and misinformation. Paladins have very low HP relative to bears, and therefore must have other factors to make up for it, hence their single AM button grants them both armor and magic reduction.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini Soul View Post
    Actually the Nerf to Mastery HP/+Healing reduction has been on live for a while now for US at least, our AP is still messed up and only giving half the amount it should according to the Hotfix's. They changed mastery to be .5% Max HP/Heal and 1% AP per actual 1% mastery . You will know when this is live when you see your mastery read Increase Health and Healing by X% and AP by Y%, Y% will be double X% value IE: +8% Health/Healing and +16%

    The reason why it's not working yet as well some of the other fixes could be because they need a server restart to work which they haven't done yet.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpsm8 View Post
    Level 45

    Balance Affinity - Passive: Increases the range of all of your abilities by 5 yards. Moonkin Form spells Starsurge Lunar Strike Solar Wrath Sunfire.
    Extra 5 yards on all your abilities is pretty nice, damage in boomkin form mildly undertuned atm. Sunfire weaving on AoE may be a dps increase.

    Feral Affinity - Passive: Increases your movement speed by 15%. Cat form spells: Shred, Rip, Rake and Ferocious Bite.
    Movement speed often underrated, currently the highest dps affinity with Catweaving rotation.

    Resto Affinity - Passive: Heals you for 3% of your maximum health every 5 sec. If you are at full health, a random nearby injured ally will be healed instead. Resto spells gained; Rejuvenation, Swiftmend and Regrowth.
    My pick most of the time, especially in dungeons. The healing output on spells like swiftmend/rejuv is quite high and the passive gets constant value.
    Bold n Underlined the part, should add to this section that while in bear form it only heals you for 1.5% instead of 3% for those who don't know about the hidden passive on bear form and taking it because they think its 3%. Should also mention in there that it doesn't double dip from the mastery +healing bonus.

  16. #16
    You should sticky this BTW

  17. #17
    I've heard that the legendary chest doesn't increase Thick Hide and that the legs don't work with Rend & Tear, what's the latest on this?

  18. #18
    So since it seems the hotfixes aren't applied according to some people, is it safe to assume our AP wasn't changed yet?

  19. #19

  20. #20
    Gratz Pumps. Cheers for the guide.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini Soul View Post
    Actually the Nerf to Mastery HP/+Healing reduction has been on live for a while now for US at least, our AP is still messed up and only giving half the amount it should according to the Hotfix's. They changed mastery to be .5% Max HP/Heal and 1% AP per actual 1% mastery . You will know when this is live when you see your mastery read Increase Health and Healing by X% and AP by Y%, Y% will be double X% value IE: +8% Health/Healing and +16%

    The reason why it's not working yet as well some of the other fixes could be because they need a server restart to work which they haven't done yet.
    That's not how hotfixes work though. Lately they've just delayed hotfixes till after the patch notes went up to warn the players of upcoming changes. The actual nerf was posted just before the weekly restart in US, and about 36 hours before the EU one.

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