SotW nerf.

[Jaese]

I fully expect other classes numbers to be brought more in line before they touch WW again. I was pulling respectable DPS on H-Nyth and H-Ursoc last night; not #1, but definitely in the top 5 or so in the raid.

Sounding the deathknell of the class is:
- idiotic,
- showing your badness.

[infinitemeridian]

I fully expect other classes numbers to be brought more in line before they touch WW again. I was pulling respectable DPS on H-Nyth and H-Ursoc last night; not #1, but definitely in the top 5 or so in the raid.

Sounding the deathknell of the class is:
- idiotic,
- showing your badness.

Agreed. I'm only 843 ilvl and I was top 5 among mostly 847-851ish raiders. Only people who had me edged out were DHs and hunters.

The nerf was necessary. Does it suck that we got nerfed? Sure. But we're far from useless and our cleave/aoe is still god-tier.

[Popchi]

Im gonna reroll rogue. Thanks blizz for destroying my class again.

I just don't understand posts like this! In my raid last night I did fine and was actually proud of my performance. A nerf to one spell didn't affect my performance at all. In fact, for the last 2 weeks I've been joking with my guildies when we run dungeons about how I can hit my 1-shot button and things just melt.

[shammypie]

Agreed. I'm only 843 ilvl and I was top 5 among mostly 847-851ish raiders. Only people who had me edged out were DHs and hunters.

The nerf was necessary. Does it suck that we got nerfed? Sure. But we're far from useless and our cleave/aoe is still god-tier.

look at the other bright side, most of the monk mains are already done leveling so it won't affect our run around the quest zone collecting mobs and 1 shot them game.

[Tellof]

Im gonna reroll rogue. Thanks blizz for destroying my class again.

lol -- okay bye. Top kek.

It's like people have never used SCK - I would rather they nerf the 40 sec cooldown than the thing without a cooldown that can do more damage over the course of sustained cleave/AoE. Heaven forbid we actually have to work for our damage instead of press 1 button. Besides, it's still strong as hell on single target.

To quote the last paragraph of the article that did the write-up on new damage distribution:
"So I say unto you, do not give in to despair that the AOE damage from Strike of the Windlord is greatly lessened, but take solace in the fact that the truly OP AOE ability has been with us all along, and rejoice that the changes do not effect single target in the slightest. Embrace Spinning Crane Kick, learn to use it to its fullest extent, and leave the memory of the IWIN button that was Strike of the Windlord AOE fondly in the past."

[Swankyy]

lol -- okay bye. Top kek.

It's like people have never used SCK - I would rather they nerf the 40 sec cooldown than the thing without a cooldown that can do more damage over the course of sustained cleave/AoE. Heaven forbid we actually have to work for our damage instead of press 1 button. Besides, it's still strong as hell on single target.

To quote the last paragraph of the article that did the write-up on new damage distribution:
"So I say unto you, do not give in to despair that the AOE damage from Strike of the Windlord is greatly lessened, but take solace in the fact that the truly OP AOE ability has been with us all along, and rejoice that the changes do not effect single target in the slightest. Embrace Spinning Crane Kick, learn to use it to its fullest extent, and leave the memory of the IWIN button that was Strike of the Windlord AOE fondly in the past."

Babylonius and Walking the Wind ftw.

[Quickpaw]

ITT - You mean I have to keep up with SCK stacks to do good AoE now instead of pressing 1 button!?!?!!?! See ya going to play [insert flavor of the month class here]

[Tellof]

To put the nail in the coffin of "WW sux": WW is in the top 25% of all DPS specs for Heroic Emerald Nightmare on Warcraftlogs.com. On Il'gynoth, Heart of Corruption (which is 80% an add/cleave/aoe fight) they are #3 overall only behind Marksman and Havoc.

If you're really upset and feeling underpowered then go complain to the Frost DKs (who are lagging 100K dps behind Marksman at 75th percentile) and see how that goes lmao.

Edit: I should point out that we're kind of in the ideal spot right now, assuming Blizzard is seeing the same things I am. We're high enough on the food chain to be competitive but not so high that we'd be on the nerf radar. Let's hope we stay right where we are.

[Deleted]

To put the nail in the coffin of "WW sux": WW is in the top 25% of all DPS specs for Heroic Emerald Nightmare on Warcraftlogs.com. On Il'gynoth, Heart of Corruption (which is 80% an add/cleave/aoe fight) they are #3 overall only behind Marksman and Havoc.

If you're really upset and feeling underpowered then go complain to the Frost DKs (who are lagging 100K dps behind Marksman at 75th percentile) and see how that goes lmao.

Edit: I should point out that we're kind of in the ideal spot right now, assuming Blizzard is seeing the same things I am. We're high enough on the food chain to be competitive but not so high that we'd be on the nerf radar. Let's hope we stay right where we are.

It's not ideal to compare on a spec per spec basis, as classes with multiple dps specs always lead to seriously skewed logs. E.g. If Fire is 5% better than Frost and Arcane on a boss, most mages killing the boss - especially those in good guilds - switch to fire. This leaves Frost and Arcane as much weaker in those lists than they actually are. It's not ideal, and Blizzard should work more to keep the specs closer together. It also makes it really hard to tell which of those specs would really need some buffs, and which are just not played by good players because they're a little weaker than the counterpart. But it has to be kept in mind when looking at statistics.

Thus, the better comparison is taking the top spec from each class, with the exception of melee / ranged differences, and use those for the calculations. Taking that, WW is between upper middle of the pack and middle of the pack on most bosses. That is a really good place to be - as middle of the pack should be the balancing goal for all classes. But obviously with so little data the statistics still suck, so it's a little early to draw conclusions.

[Tellof]

It's not ideal to compare on a spec per spec basis, as classes with multiple dps specs always lead to seriously skewed logs. E.g. If Fire is 5% better than Frost and Arcane on a boss, most mages killing the boss - especially those in good guilds - switch to fire. This leaves Frost and Arcane as much weaker in those lists than they actually are. It's not ideal, and Blizzard should work more to keep the specs closer together. It also makes it really hard to tell which of those specs would really need some buffs, and which are just not played by good players because they're a little weaker than the counterpart. But it has to be kept in mind when looking at statistics.

Thus, the better comparison is taking the top spec from each class, with the exception of melee / ranged differences, and use those for the calculations. Taking that, WW is between upper middle of the pack and middle of the pack on most bosses. That is a really good place to be - as middle of the pack should be the balancing goal for all classes. But obviously with so little data the statistics still suck, so it's a little early to draw conclusions.

That's all true, but my point was that WW isn't garbage as some have been jumping to the conclusion of, else we would have seen them around the bottom with Frost DK. One guy even said "Rerolling Enhance" but WW is still (barely) ahead of it in Heroic. People just need to chill.

Edit: For what it's worth, 95th percentile Heroic shows WW as #2 overall behind Marksmanship.

[Asrialol]

Glad to see they're bringing WW cleave down a bit, it was just stupid doing that much more damage than everyone else in cleave situations. We've still got pretty sweet cleave, and amazing utility with the legendary. Good times.

[Fakie]

Glad to see they're bringing WW cleave down a bit, it was just stupid doing that much more damage than everyone else in cleave situations. We've still got pretty sweet cleave, and amazing utility with the legendary. Good times.

We needed to be toned down. What I don't understand is why Demon Hunters weren't also toned down apart from that one talent without which they do massive amounts of AoE still.

[Celede]

We needed to be toned down. What I don't understand is why Demon Hunters weren't also toned down apart from that one talent without which they do massive amounts of AoE still.

You can't tone down the brand new, most played, class without large amounts of outburst. It's much easier to tone down an already established class instead while slowly and lightly nerfing the newest class without going too far. Demonhunters will likely remain very strong for quite some time.

On a completely separate note. I expected the Sotwl nerf but the ability is definitely very bland and boring now - there isn't anything unique about it.

[Drakain]

What, you guys haven't discovered how to stack up SCK yet? They went overboard on the SoTW secondary target damage - it's not a fun ability anymore, but it was hardly the sole reason why monks have such good AE damage.

[Deleted]

That's all true, but my point was that WW isn't garbage as some have been jumping to the conclusion of, else we would have seen them around the bottom with Frost DK. One guy even said "Rerolling Enhance" but WW is still (barely) ahead of it in Heroic. People just need to chill.

Edit: For what it's worth, 95th percentile Heroic shows WW as #2 overall behind Marksmanship.

Fair enough. Sure it sucks getting nerfed, but I agree: Many people completely exaggerate the impact of nerfs in most cases.

[Creatinebrah]

We needed to be toned down. What I don't understand is why Demon Hunters weren't also toned down apart from that one talent without which they do massive amounts of AoE still.

they will be come monday. don't you worry about that. i suspect arms, fire mage and maybe rogue/feral nerfs as well

[Super Kami Dende]

SotW feels like complete trash now. Found I didn't even press it after the first 2 trash packs in EN. Though trying to get stacks in EN for SCK was a nightmare (no pun intended) since most creature either had an AoE which needed to be moved away from, or the mass swarming from enemies and a constantly moving tank made tab targeting or clicking on the healthbars into a massive annoyance.

Kind of bummed out just how hard they nerf SotW, as it made it pretty much a worthless ability outside of ST every 40 seconds and a waste of Chi on any pack of enemies bigger than 3. Also the ramp up time to get 4 stacks of SCK most trash packs were 75% dead so classes with on demand AoE instead of built AoE absolutely destroyed trash DPS.

Also felt last night that on ST we start off strong but the longer the fight went the more and more my dps starting lagging behind everyone elses and high movement/aoe fights I felt lackluster since the SCK stacks fell off pretty faster and had to be re-built up whenever a new swarm of adds came out.

SotW was good on demand cleave, it was strong, but a 50% damage to secondary targets vs a complete gutting to damage would've felt a lot better.

I don't feel garbage. I just don't feel in anyway "super Op" like people keep claiming we are.

[Babylonius]

SotW feels like complete trash now. Found I didn't even press it after the first 2 trash packs in EN.

Then you lost out on some damage. SotW doesnt fall behind SCK until at least 6 targets AND 6 stacks.

[Super Kami Dende]

Then you lost out on some damage. SotW doesnt fall behind SCK until at least 6 targets AND 6 stacks.

The combined damage of both strikes was only doing 900-1100k. Felt like not using the 2 chi at the start of the fight to stack up my SCK and instead using it on SotW was just delaying any meaningful AoE damage by multiple GCD's that I could have used getting more SCK stacks/uses out.

I'll be honest, if they added something to SotW that made it apply the SCK buff to all targets it hits, that would be pretty amazing. Otherwise it feels like Strike of the Windpeasant now.

[Slappadappa]

The combined damage of both strikes was only doing 900-1100k. Felt like not using the 2 chi at the start of the fight to stack up my SCK and instead using it on SotW was just delaying any meaningful AoE damage by multiple GCD's that I could have used getting more SCK stacks/uses out.

I'll be honest, if they added something to SotW that made it apply the SCK buff to all targets it hits, that would be pretty amazing. Otherwise it feels like Strike of the Windpeasant now.

It does more than 1m single target lel.