Rest in peace, Unholy.

[Deleted]

I have the unholy shoulders as my legendary and my dps as frost is STILL much better. Even in a perfect sim as unholy where I get amazingly stupid RNG frost still outperforms.

Accept that unholy is dead already. It's too RNG, too many buttons, undertuned spells, etc.

Out of all the specs this game unholy is most likely the most complex class there is. It doesn't help that the reward for such a spec is negative.

[Akakishin]

I don't think dk community is loud enough. This comes to from an ex-warlock and i still remember the noise we made when they decided to remove KJC entirely in 5.4. Hint: They listened and brought it back with even better function, but only after we talked about it on every twitter account any blizzard employee ever had. Thats not mature i know. but thats how it is. Warlocks priests and mages get things done this way.

[Heavenshand]

Well they said that they will look into our problems and then buffed death coil.
I don't have the bracers, and still rape myself with trying to play unholy.
So ye.

Very well said. Thats exactly how it feels to play unholy atm...

[Kerathyl]

Yeah nerf the bracers and post nothing about buffing unholy to make up for it. Does blizz want all unholy players to reroll to frost? They are doing a real good job in making us the worst dps spec in the game. Blizzards logic is "if the spec don't work, don't fix it just buff their counterpart immensely so everyone rerolls and that way we don't have to put time/resources into a spec that needs attention. Great job with "spec diversity" this expansion blizz.

Meanwhile at Blizzard HQ:

dev1: The 7.1 buffs to Frost should make DKs change specs and start grinding AP and legendaries all over again, thus extending the life of our content.
dev2: Sir, our plan is not working, there are still a fair amount of players playing Unholy because it's still viable with the legendary bracers and they prefer the playstyle.
dev3: These players are getting dangerously close to finishing their artifact, some are already over 31 traits.
dev1: Time for more extreme measures, nerf those bracers! Not getting into groups anymore should be enough to make them bend the knee.

Not sure about other classes, but I'm seeing parallels with mages, where the spec that was best initially is being overtaken. This directly goes against Blizzards original claim of not changing specs balance in such a way that players would be forced to respec.

[Direpenguin]

Very well said. Thats exactly how it feels to play unholy atm...

If you cared about your guild and people you play with, you wouldn't waste their time by playing Unholy.

#karma

[RuneDK]

the unholy tears are delicious. With that said...they dropped the ball hard on these legendaries. No legendary should feel mandatory, but none should make you feel upset or even frustrated that you got one. If they nerf the UH bracers they better damn well buff the shit out of the spec. Because right now it's the only way unholy is even semi-relevant right now.

- - - Updated - - -

I have the unholy shoulders as my legendary and my dps as frost is STILL much better. Even in a perfect sim as unholy where I get amazingly stupid RNG frost still outperforms.

Accept that unholy is dead already. It's too RNG, too many buttons, undertuned spells, etc.

Out of all the specs this game unholy is most likely the most complex class there is. It doesn't help that the reward for such a spec is negative.

it's really not the most complex spec..

[Cosmic Janitor]

Yup I agree. I think some people without bracers think it will suddenly make them some kind of walking unholy god.

Raiding wise I think it has more to do with making the cleave/aoe oriented specs more viable in single target scenarios, therefore boosting the overall performance of the spec since most encounters do have a cleave phases and currently you loose out by either chosing best single target performance or best cleave performance. If nothing else, getting rid of the feeling of inadequacy for 50% of an encounter is a considerable boon and lessens the annoying talent changing before every encounter...

[Schizoide]

People are exaggerating. It´s around 6% dps from the bracers effect, which is good but hardly gamebreaking.

Who said they were gamebreaking? Indeed, the bracers are the only way Unholy can be competitive right now. That's the problem.

[Deleted]

The insane impact of the bracers is a myth.

People are exaggerating. It´s around 6% dps from the bracers effect, which is good but hardly gamebreaking.
The ring and the belt effects give around a 2-3% dps boost, so the difference is even smaller when you have one of those instead.
There are other legendaries for other speccs that are way stronger (>15%dps).

However, the bracers should still be nerfed, because:

1) it´s the only real option
2) it makes you waste wounds no matter what
3) it´s effect is too RNG, one try you barely get any benefit, the next try you get +15% dps because you're lucky...

I think making it 1-3 wounds, would be a nice solution to counter all those 3 effects.

From sims and live testing i deal 8-9% more damage with bracers. They really are insane. And that is just single target. In aoe burst scenarioes they are even stronger because you can pop all the wounds extremely fast for more festerings quicker and get on a roll.

[Schizoide]

Yes, but his point is that there are stronger legendaries. That is true, and they should be nerfed too. Legendaries shouldn't be spec-defining as long as they're gated by very low chance RNG. This isn't Diablo3, where you can get your full set in a day or two.

[Deleted]

The insane impact of the bracers is a myth.

People are exaggerating. It´s around 6% dps from the bracers effect, which is good but hardly gamebreaking.
The ring and the belt effects give around a 2-3% dps boost, so the difference is even smaller when you have one of those instead.
There are other legendaries for other speccs that are way stronger (>15%dps).

However, the bracers should still be nerfed, because:

1) it´s the only real option
2) it makes you waste wounds no matter what
3) it´s effect is too RNG, one try you barely get any benefit, the next try you get +15% dps because you're lucky...

I think making it 1-3 wounds, would be a nice solution to counter all those 3 effects.

This defines the entire spec. But yes they are the only option which sucks but Ion also said some legendaries will always be better so...

[Baddok21]

I got a prediction...

Unholy will be the Top DK DPS spec by the time Nighthold is out

[Deleted]

Because you dont even know if they ARE doing something. Thats the point. Yes, complaining worked for us a while ago, but you dont see much complaining now that they have already announced that the next patch is going to bring a lot of changes. The most you can do is provide feedback (not in a whiney way obviously} and see what happens. Theres no point in complaining when were a few days away from a big class change patch coming to the ptr.

Maybe you are getting buffs, maybe some of your bad talents are getting buffs, maybe some bad talents that are never taken are being removed and replaced with better ones. Nobody knows yet because we havent seen the patch notes yet, all we know is that talents/abilities are changing and buffs/nerfs are coming out. Complaining for the sake of complaining isnt going to get you anywhere, wait till the patch notes. If you still dont like what you see, then complain.

But Paladins didn't know they had something in for them when they started complaining either. No one does, because no one has seen anything yet. And with the history Blizzard has of ignoring classes like DK, we can only assume that the "buffs" will range from not enough to nothing (and btw, there was a LOT of complaining before 7.1 landed, and all we got was a 2% ST buff that didn't fix anything). So yes, we tried waiting already, and we didn't get anything. For all we know, with how things have been going so far into Legion, 7.1.5 won't change anything meaningful either. But of course, you can't understand this, since Paladins were fixed early on, while DKs got bandaid fixes that we don't even know how long they're gonna last. Clearly didn't last long enough to keep Unholy worth a shit.

But don't worry, I'll be here to quote you again when PTR notes land and Unholy sees nothing. Just like last patch. I'll then ask you if it's time to start complaining. Let's see if your answer changes to "you don't know what's in patch 7.2".

[murbaez]

Word, them nerfing the UH DK bracers changes absolutely nothing for me, so tbh, it dont matter to me. At least it might motivate them to buff up other numbers to make up for it. It's such a crap idea to balance a spec around an item that only 10% of the DK even have anyways. Is it selfish of me to think that way, sure it is, but it's not my fault the system was made like that. All the legendaries should've been made with utility in mind and not spec defining damage boosts that alter the way the class has to be balanced.

[Heavenshand]

So i guess we can say a bursting sores/ss/festering wounds kind of buff is on the way :P

[Deleted]

Meanwhile at Blizzard HQ:

dev1: The 7.1 buffs to Frost should make DKs change specs and start grinding AP and legendaries all over again, thus extending the life of our content.
dev2: Sir, our plan is not working, there are still a fair amount of players playing Unholy because it's still viable with the legendary bracers and they prefer the playstyle.
dev3: These players are getting dangerously close to finishing their artifact, some are already over 31 traits.
dev1: Time for more extreme measures, nerf those bracers! Not getting into groups anymore should be enough to make them bend the knee.

Not sure about other classes, but I'm seeing parallels with mages, where the spec that was best initially is being overtaken. This directly goes against Blizzards original claim of not changing specs balance in such a way that players would be forced to respec.

I'd rather cancel and uninstall the game than ever play Frost.

[Deleted]

From sims and live testing i deal 8-9% more damage with bracers. They really are insane. And that is just single target. In aoe burst scenarioes they are even stronger because you can pop all the wounds extremely fast for more festerings quicker and get on a roll.

You probably didn´t test against regular 895 bracers and thus didnt only get the effect from the legendary effect but also from the ilvl upgrade.
Additionally stat weights shift when you unequip the bacers. So you have to adjust the stats too and then you only get around 6%.

[Grimdeeds]

The insane impact of the bracers is a myth.

People are exaggerating. It´s around 6% dps from the bracers effect, which is good but hardly gamebreaking.
The ring and the belt effects give around a 2-3% dps boost, so the difference is even smaller when you have one of those instead.
There are other legendaries for other speccs that are way stronger (>15%dps).

However, the bracers should still be nerfed, because:

1) it´s the only real option
2) it makes you waste wounds no matter what
3) it´s effect is too RNG, one try you barely get any benefit, the next try you get +15% dps because you're lucky...

I think making it 1-3 wounds, would be a nice solution to counter all those 3 effects.

Where, or how, are you able to get the % of how much impact each legendary has?

[Gangresnake]

The insane impact of the bracers is a myth.

The difference between the best bracers DK and the best no-bracers DK is 9% DPS on Mythic Ursoc
On heroic Ursoc (so ST only) the difference is 18%

It IS that insane

[Acidbaron]

I'd rather cancel and uninstall the game than ever play Frost.

I would rather reroll to another class and keep my dk as blood. Frost is a spec you can get good numbers with by just mashing buttons, the average player probably likes this but if there's no personal skill cap and way to screw things up in a spec you set yourself up for a very boring raid experience.

Luckily unholy still does well in 2's so we have that going.

In any case i expect some buffs coming our way, this is always the case. It's good that we had a mid tier now that really is punishing to play for unholy Odyn on heroic the amount of times i lost wounds merely since i had to swap due to movement, guarm is alright easy even to remain in the top damage done. (sadly off night heroic raid wasn't logged... to my frustration) Helya seems like another mess although more cleave friendly for unholy.