I like to raid - I do not like beeing forced to do other content to be viable

[madmonarch]

you reap what you sow - raiders spend 12 + years constantly bashing any content in game that was for casuals while they were warning you to be careful what you wish for - well karma bit you back . you got expansion that is hardcore players dream - only suddenly a lot of people got brutaly exposed that they are in fact part of casual playerbase and were only pretending their hardcorness.

Well, what were raiders bashing? I am very rare guest to the english forums, so I don't really know.
And, I don't know, I always thought hardcore players are those who think, observe, calculate, create logistics and use their skills to complete the hardest tasks, casuals are those who don't want to push the limits of their minds and bodies, they just want to spend some time to have fun in game, and semi-hardcore are inbetween. Time is not important. Yes, there are games where hardcoreness means the hardness of your butt to sit through that endless xp or other points farm, but WoW was not that kind of game since vanilla until Legion.

no - 99 % of answeares on forums were some form of "git gud" or "unsub game will be better without you"

well guess what casuals can tell you now "git gud and play as hardcore if you want to be considered one"

So I guess nothing's changed, forums are still 99% full of assholes.

[Relapses]

and how is current situation different from 15 months of SoO where there was ton of guilds who spend over a year bashing their heads to clear that place - ToV has been for how long 3 weeks and you wanted to have it cleared by now ? jezus christ if anything you are the example of what you hate so much - aka greedy casuals who want eveyrthing right now. aka 'i want mythic cleared right now because i deserve it"

Did you even bother to read what I said? I'm not expecting anything. In fact, I completely empathize with the sentiment that I'm a fraction of a fraction of players. All I did is express the very personal reasons I felt the game was no longer suited for me and here you are lambasting me about my "right to clear content" when I mentioned no such thing.

[Deleted]

Mythic+ should have a loot lockout similar to what raids have. While you then still "have to" do some of them you won't feel forced to boost through them endlessly.
The current legendary system sucks. It might have been fun for the guys who got 4 in 2 days back when the bad luck protection was actually a good luck booster, but outside of that it's more of a frustration than anything else. Plus they feel bland since there's tons of them and they just randomly drop with no legend attached to them.

[KaPe]

Well, what were raiders bashing? I am very rare guest to the english forums, so I don't really know.

(...)
So I guess nothing's changed, forums are still 99% full of assholes.

There's always some asshole whose contribution amounts to "git gud". Usually it's some wannabe elite raider, who's not nearly as progressed as they believe themselves to be. But their opinion conveniently counts as "what raiders really think" and thus serves as a reason to treat them like jerks - and naturally, the other side is made of innocent people who just want to have fun, but suffer under the tyrrany of raiders.

This was true even way back in vanilla. I still remember "screw you elitists, casuals finally win" posts back when raids got reduced from 40 to 25 in TBC. And everytime something similar happens, it's considered a crippling blow struck agains the raiders - all while ignoring the fact that quite a few of them actually enjoy these changes. At the same time, there were people crying about every single boss nerf, even if they were nowhere near said boss or it was a bug/exploit fix. To them, "casuals" ruined everything.

This situation isn't really different. There's pseudo-hardcores who claim that people have gotten lazy in WoD and we always farmed the same amount. There's "casuals" (quote mark because it's too broad group to generalize) who couldn't care less and progress at their own pace. There's other "casuals" who believe it's raiders talking shit like usual, while trying to steal all the loot for themselves - some of them might dislike the current system, but they hate the raiders more. There's raiders who don't really like the new system, be it gearing, AP or legendaries.

So far, it's hard to say who's "winning". Blizzard did pretty much admit that legendary system wasn't very well thought out... but also didn't really change much. They are going to speed up AK progression for alts... but you'll still need months of farming to cap your artifact. No changes planned for M+ or gear system.

[Echocho]

Titanforging should be capped at heroic raid iLvls and dungeon bosses should only award AP once every reset.