It seems WoD didn't do that bad

[Ehuehuecopter]

Thanks for proving my point.

You welcome Eeyore

[shonist]

Or maybe, just maybe, a lot of players nowdays (that games in general and especially multiplayer games are a lot more common and high-polish than in 2004~2008) are not interested in staying months on end in the same game repeating the same content for slightly better gear, and would rather subscribe to check the new content and then unsubscribe to go play or do other things?

Maybe, in Vanilla, TBC, and WotLK, there were a lot more people who hadn't tried WoW yet, and by now most of the people who might try it already did? And that means there's a lot less input of players to cover for the output now.

'Cause that sounds pretty reasonable to me.

yeah, lets play another mmo in 2016 with more content than wow haha.
forget it. You will run 4 dugeons until your eyes bleeds.

[Deleted]

WoD was an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.
Legion is an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.
No, the playerbase is not cyclical. Blizdevs, however, are retarded.

You're always gonna have kids like this guy right here who believe their wishes and needs are vastly more important than everyone else's and if not everything is exactly the way they want it, they're gonna throw a tantrum. So when a game ain't fulfilling their every need, they'll call it shit and quit. Simple as that, the playerbase is cyclical.

[shonist]

But then what am i supposed to do? Oh farm m+ all day instead?

maybe having fun? how sounds that?

[anon5123]

WoD was an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.
Legion is an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.

How are we defining "overhyped" ?

No shit a game dev is going to "hype" its own game.

[Ehuehuecopter]

yeah, lets play another mmo in 2016 with more content than wow haha.
forget it. You will run 4 dugeons until your eyes bleeds.

Pretty that.

Also don't forget that in the last 12 years there was a bunch of WoW killers MMO and all got fucked hard and nearly disappeared

Because Wow is still and prob will continue to be the most played mmo rpg

Only game that can compete and is actually stealing players is

League of Legends

That because now people want fast packed game, you enter do a fast game 30 40 minutes and Gg bye

Nobody seems to have time to play 8hours per day wow like in vanilla or tbc

[shonist]

WoD was an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.
Legion is an overhyped piece of shit, so it spiked and dropped.
No, the playerbase is not cyclical. Blizdevs, however, are retarded.

i just seen your signature.

SWTOR? CABAL 2? HOLY SHIET.

the only decent there is GW2 and its one that i like to play. but they let me down with the new fractal and no new raid. so nope. theres never a choice.

[lazzy]

True, save for the fact it was Vanilla-TBC. WotLK was actually the beginning of this very system you're criticizing.

Na, WOTLK was still a very good xpac. It was the best PvP xpac by a mile.

Cata is when the system I criticize comes into play.

-Class pruning started
-LFR was added
-Heroic became a joke after first month since Blizzard nerfed it into the ground
-RBGs were added to mask the imbalances of PvP
-Arena started to get bad because Blizzard decided to stop balancing it after WOTLK

Quote from Blizzard- Arenas were the single biggest mistake in WoW's history. "We didn't engineer the game and classes and balance around it, we just added it on, so it continues to be very difficult to balance. Is WoW a PvE cooperative game, or a competitive PvP game? There's constant pressure on the class balance team, there's pressure on the game itself, and a lot of times players who don't PvP don't understand why their classes are changing. I don't think we ever foresaw how much tuning and tweaking we'd have to do to balance it in that direction."

[Jewsco]

For all things PVP Wod was miles better than Legion. For all things ALTS, Wod was miles better than Legion.

In other all other things Legion is better, though, and it's still going so I'll reserve my judgement untill we see what's in 7.3.

Was it? I seem to recall most pvpers switching to humans for the racial as it was huge.
Thus causing a huge imbalance between horde and alliance that blizz had to go as far as to change the human racial.
But that was so much better?

[Deleted]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's why the number of people who PVP shrunk to about half of what it was in *WoD* (the ultimate floor).

The exact numbers:

3v3 ladder in Legion season 1 is 64% that of WoD season 3 on EU, 56% on US.
RBG ladder in Legion season 1 is 43% that of WoD season 3 on EU, 37% on US.

In rated, sure. Now that you can't roflstomp everyone with gear, the true PvP'rs are the ones that are shown. Thats ok, we don't need the griefers and PvP is actually fun to play for everyone. The random queues are much healthier in Legion aswell. Thats because theres moe people PvP'ing than before.

Besides i'm unconvinced the drop in players is due to the gear but more due to the AP grind having power creep. Many PvP'rs are casual players.

[Arvandor]

Then you didn't play vanilla because most classes were broken then. Almost as if blizz has always had the problem of tuning toons

every core game had design fails, but man where are the glory days of mana hunters?.. this was special! this was wow!

[Deleted]

Legion is better than WoD except for certain specs in matters of gameplay. Content wise its definitely better. However its still not quite there yet. Worldquest are not particularly fun or interesting,they are just rehashed daily quests. Mythic + is good, raiding is raiding, pvp is pvp.

They need to add more fun, side stuff to do that is actually compelling to play, not just collecting mounts or having achievements that most of the time require zero gameplay. The pvp brawls is something they should have added a loonnnnggg time ago, since long people asked to add new effects/conditions within existing battlegrounds. Or just add content not to be taken seriously where the all mighty "balance requirement" doesn't ruin the creativity in a game. Brawls are a good example, now whether they are actually fun or just some lazy work like we often saw in Blizzard's history, thats too early to tell.

You cannot sustain people on a game with treadmills and linear progression for years. Some believe that repetitive tasks are the core of MMOs. I don't think its necessary. Sure the "endgame" raid, daily stuff won't change but adding many different/various things to do and make the open world actually alive and interactive would allow players to generate content by themselves without waiting for developers to release the new raid to be farmed for months or the new dungeon.

[Deleted]

It think this data shuoldn't be a surprise in 2016.
We need to understand that a of lot people now play casually. And for casually i mean people that nowadays can easily clear Heroic Raids and Myt+10 dungeon. A lot of this people just quit until new content comes out.
This "casual" are actually the larger playerbase, and today we have access to huge pletora of other games you can play.
This is why we got those spikes. The larger playerbase is just not costant in term of subscription anymore.
It can sound strange, but now the most "loyal" playerbase are the 1) Hardcore top raider and 2) People that play WoW below the "casual", the so called (in this forum at least) noob, plebs, or LFraid heroes.

TLDR: we will NEVER go back to the TBC/WOTLK number of costant subscribe, Blizzard cuold release the best WoW ever recorded, but people will always quit for a while after the first 2/3 months.

[rda]

In rated, sure. Now that you can't roflstomp everyone with gear, the true PvP'rs are the ones that are shown. Thats ok, we don't need the griefers and PvP is actually fun to play for everyone. The random queues are much healthier in Legion aswell. Thats because theres moe people PvP'ing than before.

Besides i'm unconvinced the drop in players is due to the gear but more due to the AP grind having power creep. Many PvP'rs are casual players.

Any proof of this ridiculous idiocy? Or is that you inventing things because you have no other arguments?

[lazzy]

It think this data shuoldn't be a surprise in 2016.
We need to understand that a of lot people now play casually. And for casually i mean people that nowadays can easily clear Heroic Raids and Myt+10 dungeon. A lot of this people just quit until new content comes out.
This "casual" are actually the larger playerbase, and today we have access to huge pletora of other games you can play.
This is why we got those spikes. The larger playerbase is just not costant in term of subscription anymore.
It can sound strange, but now the most "loyal" playerbase are the 1) Hardcore top raider and 2) People that play WoW below the "casual", the so called (in this forum at least) noob, plebs, or LFraid heroes.

TLDR: we will NEVER go back to the TBC/WOTLK number of costant subscribe, Blizzard cuold release the best WoW ever recorded, but people will always quit for a while after the first 2/3 months.

We will never go back to those numbers constantly because WoW just isn't as good now as it was in TBC/WOTLK. Lets not pretend that the 12 million people that came back in WoD came in with the expectations to quit in 1-3 months. They all came back hoping for WoW to be amazing again and play all the time like Vanilla-WOTLK.

WoW could have 12 million constant players if they just release good freaking content. We've had the same recycled shit for 12 years now and people realized that in WoD/Legion and have left in droves again.

[Jewsco]

every core game had design fails, but man where are the glory days of mana hunters?.. this was special! this was wow!

I just want my traps back and other utility that made me a hunter.

[Kolvarg]

Or maybe a bunch of bootlickers circle-jerking each others don't actually define truth.

If it's so obviously wrong, why don't you go ahead and prove it wrong?

[Phuongvi]

I really like how Legion was the next best thing 3 months ago.

[Kolvarg]

I really like how Legion was the next best thing 3 months ago.

They all are. And it's not just with WoW either, it's with most popular games to be released nowadays. People hype things too much and forget most games are just more of the same, like they've always been. True classics/gems only show up every now and then, and many times they're not even anticipated to become such huge hits.


Personally I liked WoD, and I like Legion. Both do some things good and some things bad. Personally I believe Legion is overall a better expansion than WoD. But realistically, no expansion can remain fresh forever, no matter how much content they manage to stuff into it. Eventually people get tired, especially people who have been playing for years.

And that's my point: It doesn't matter if it's "good" or "bad", the subscription numbers will still fluctuate in a similar manner, because the "quality" of the expansion is only one small variable among many others. The number of subscriptions or active users doesn't prove how good a game is, at most it only proves how popular a game is at that point.

[Ehuehuecopter]

Quality of threads on MMO Champion is hitting a new low. Keep at it guys

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