Healing comp and innervate

[Iatros]

Hey guys,
Im the healing officer of a small guild (15 raiders), we r 7/7 (H) and 2/3 (H) trying to recruit new players to strat EN (M).

Our healing comp right now is:
- Resto druid
- Disc main/Holy off (me)
- Holy Pally
- Resto Shaman (currently playing enhc, because we dont need 4 healers in a 15man)

We have 2 moonkins raiding with us. I set one boonking to innervate me (when i am disc) the other mookin to innervate de resto druid because the resto druid is our top healer and can make a good use of the innervate and disc priest is an awsome target for it.
Recently our holy palladin and resto shman started arguing that its not a fair distribution of innervates, and that we just have good numbers because we have it.
I think thats the best distribution for the raid, but im not a neutral opinion because im receiving it, i would ur opion about htat, what would u do if u were the healing officer?


Some logs of our raids:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KXhQJAa7BmW9DfTg (ToV (H) - Odyn and Guarm)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/92NM4FQ3gnRTAqHf (ToV (H) - Odyn)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/2VNFPkr8m9gvbwtx (ToV (H) - Guarm)

*On the first log i was comparing my mana gain with mana loose and seven spine.
*My healing is lacking on guarm, im finding dificult to time the attonoments to heal the charge

[Deleted]

I would tell your healers to grow up. 2 innervates, 4 healers...... not rocket science to figure out 2 people wont get innervate. Disc priest is a given for innervate, its a mana draining spec in raids. Is your top healer struggling for mana? In all honesty the the shammy and pally should not struggle with mana. Are they taking mana pots? Are you syncing CD's properly.
My advice, give innervates to the peeps who oom the fastest without trying to oom, if that makes sense.

Also, each fight is different for different healers, you may need to look at it on a fight by fight basis.

Not sure if that helps but it's my 2 pennies in.

[Deleted]

Hey guys,
Im the healing officer of a small guild (15 raiders), we r 7/7 (H) and 2/3 (H) trying to recruit new players to strat EN (M).

Our healing comp right now is:
- Resto druid
- Disc main/Holy off (me)
- Holy Pally
- Resto Shaman (currently playing enhc, because we dont need 4 healers in a 15man)

We have 2 moonkins raiding with us. I set one boonking to innervate me (when i am disc) and another mookin to innervate de resto druid because the resto druid is our top healer and can make a good use of the innervate and because disc priest is an awsome target for it.
Recently our holy palladin and resto shman started arguing that its not a fair distribution of innervates, and that we just have good number because we have it.
I think thats the best distribution for the raid, but im not a neutral opinion because im receiving it, i would ur opion about htat, what would u do if u were the healing officer?


Some logs of our raids:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KXhQJAa7BmW9DfTg (ToV (H) - Odyn and Guarm)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/92NM4FQ3gnRTAqHf (ToV (H) - Odyn)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/2VNFPkr8m9gvbwtx (ToV (H) - Guarm)

*On the first log i was comparing my mana gain with mana loose and seven spine.
*My healing is lacking on guarm, im finding dificult to time the attonoments to heal the charge

Well, without knowing everything about healing, I was under the impression that the best targets for Innervates were disc priest, as this allows them to buff the whole raid with Atonement through radiance, and in turn heal a shit ton at clutch moments (and x2 during barrier).

Otherwise I don't think its very important who gets the innervates.

[Deleted]

While they're right in that your healing amount will be higher because you have innervate, it does not mean you outheal them because of it. It also doesn't mean that using it on the highest healer is always the best idea.

You should look at the highest healing per global for the duration of innervate and possible mana saved. Disc priest with atonement spam is definitely the best on possible healing throughput per global. Mistweaver monk is also really great.

I haven't looked at your logs, as I am on my laptop. Perhaps someone else can.

[Deleted]

If we talk purely theorycrafting. You should get both innervates as disc, and non as holy.
The holy paladin with benefit the least from it, and the shaman will end up somewhere slightly below the druid IMO.

The reason disc benefits so strongly from innervate is because of how atonement and Radiance works. You can set up atonement on an entire raidgroup when you get the innervate, and you'll be able to cover all healing for the next spike after that. Which essentially makes Innervate = Raid CD, when cast on a dics priest.

Innervate on a resto druid should be used when he has his flourish and weapon ready so he can cover the entire raid with hots and then use weapon. this will also make him spike a lot.

Resto shamans don't really have any kind of rampup like disc priest and resto druid, but they do however have a shitton of throughput CD's, if you simply chain it with an ascendance or AG, they'll save a lot of mana and do a bit more healing aswell.

Holy paladins are nearly always casting their least mana efficient heal (flash heal), and an innervate on a holy paladin won't matter much. They should be able to maintain mana without it.

Holy priest ends up somewhere between holy paladin and resto shaman IMO, I havn't played it a lot, so i don't really have a lot to say about it.

[Deleted]

You really should be just giving all innervates to disc. The amount of healing disc can get out of it is not comparable to any other healer.

[Supliftz]

the only thing innervate cares about is how much hps you can do in a 10 second window. It makes no sense to divide up innervates, it makes the most sense to give innervates to the target who can consistently do the most healing in that window.

[Memento1]

As everyone has said, in theory the Disc should get all the innervates, because you can add the most amount of healing in that space. LOGIC is on your side. Emotions of course will fight logic here.

[Cheze]

the most efficient thing you can do with them probably is to rotate both on the disc priest every ~1.5m to align with light's wrath setup. Depends on the fight though, there might be a burst every 3m that needs healed when you'd double them up.

between shaman and paladin, probably shaman I guess? Paladin doesn't want to dump mana as predictably as shaman, aside from during aura of sac or something I suppose. But the real answer is tell them to sack up and stop whining about who's getting the innervates

[KrazyKraka0]

Hey guys,
Im the healing officer of a small guild (15 raiders), we r 7/7 (H) and 2/3 (H) trying to recruit new players to strat EN (M).

Our healing comp right now is:
- Resto druid
- Disc main/Holy off (me)
- Holy Pally
- Resto Shaman (currently playing enhc, because we dont need 4 healers in a 15man)

We have 2 moonkins raiding with us. I set one boonking to innervate me (when i am disc) the other mookin to innervate de resto druid because the resto druid is our top healer and can make a good use of the innervate and disc priest is an awsome target for it.
Recently our holy palladin and resto shman started arguing that its not a fair distribution of innervates, and that we just have good numbers because we have it.
I think thats the best distribution for the raid, but im not a neutral opinion because im receiving it, i would ur opion about htat, what would u do if u were the healing officer?


Some logs of our raids:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KXhQJAa7BmW9DfTg (ToV (H) - Odyn and Guarm)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/92NM4FQ3gnRTAqHf (ToV (H) - Odyn)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/2VNFPkr8m9gvbwtx (ToV (H) - Guarm)

*On the first log i was comparing my mana gain with mana loose and seven spine.
*My healing is lacking on guarm, im finding dificult to time the attonoments to heal the charge

As a holy paladin main (7/7M, 3/3H), I can honestly say I have never needed an innervate over the other people in our healing comp (monk, disc priest, resto shaman, resto druid). With our setup we only have 1 innervate to work with which typically goes to our disc priest or monk. Personally I feel like its wasted on a holy paladin due to the minimal number of heals you will be able to get off in that time frame as compared to the other healing classes. In addition, from my experience paladins have less of a mana issue than other healing classes currently (I'm typically top heals with ~500k mana more than other healers in our group), so using it for mana reasons seems to me like your holy paladin might not be using efficient spells in the right situations.

[Pearl1717]

I'll just leave this here (shown with 10% rapid innervation):

[callipygoustp]

@Iatros : Looking at your stated progression you're clearly not a hard core progression group. And, to be clear, in no way do I think that's a bad thing. The reason I call that out is because the first thing that came to mind after reading your post was "well, fuck, spend a weak shifting innervate to the other two healers and compare the numbers." In a non-progression guild that suggestion should not be an issue and it will provide you with some further, guild specific, data. Be a little flexible, give them a chance. See what happens.

[Jimjam38]

Hey guys,
Im the healing officer of a small guild (15 raiders), we r 7/7 (H) and 2/3 (H) trying to recruit new players to strat EN (M).

Our healing comp right now is:
- Resto druid
- Disc main/Holy off (me)
- Holy Pally
- Resto Shaman (currently playing enhc, because we dont need 4 healers in a 15man)

We have 2 moonkins raiding with us. I set one boonking to innervate me (when i am disc) the other mookin to innervate de resto druid because the resto druid is our top healer and can make a good use of the innervate and disc priest is an awsome target for it.
Recently our holy palladin and resto shman started arguing that its not a fair distribution of innervates, and that we just have good numbers because we have it.
I think thats the best distribution for the raid, but im not a neutral opinion because im receiving it, i would ur opion about htat, what would u do if u were the healing officer?


Some logs of our raids:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KXhQJAa7BmW9DfTg (ToV (H) - Odyn and Guarm)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/92NM4FQ3gnRTAqHf (ToV (H) - Odyn)
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/2VNFPkr8m9gvbwtx (ToV (H) - Guarm)

*On the first log i was comparing my mana gain with mana loose and seven spine.
*My healing is lacking on guarm, im finding dificult to time the attonoments to heal the charge

Well, as you can see everyone's saying that from a mathematical viewpoint, Disc is the clear best choice for an innervate. On progression it should be kept that way.

However, from a fairness viewpoint, if your other healers are concerned about trying to rank, then on farm you should rotate the innervates around boss-to-boss or week-by-week, so that everyone can get a go.

If you look at the top rankings for any spec, not just disc, you'll see that they're usually being fed innervates. It's pretty obvious that with more mana you can do more healing, regardless of what spec you are. But for progression, you want to maximise your chances, and most effective usage of all utility will help do that - in that case you should be innervating disc and/or your top healer.

[Iatros]

Thank u for all the responses guys!!! Helped me a lot!!!
Very nice chart Pearl!!! TY