What Intelligence Agencies Concluded About the Russian Attack on the U.S. Election

[primalmatter]

Because even if you leave your house unlocked, doesn't mean people have the right to rob you.

And riddle me this, why do sanctions against Russia have bi-partisan support? I understand "TEH EBUL LIBRULZ" of your fantasy world are always wrong regardless, but reality does not reflect your make-believe.

Because the USA is uncomfortable with a new rising super power entering the stage and upseting things?

[Zandalarian Paladin]

So again, it isn't really a hypocritical opinion change when you're talking about different people with different opinions. Attempting to conflate them into one party doesn't really address this foolishness.

It is, in fact, a fallacy. To assume that every individuals who belongs to a group are the same has a name. I'm sure our friend can google that, or he can even go on the website that Wells have in her signature. I go there very often personally.

And in that regard, to note that the person to whom you're speaking is very good at changing goalpost.

[NYC17]

So again, it isn't really a hypocritical opinion change when you're talking about different people with different opinions. Attempting to conflate them into one party doesn't really address this foolishness.

If it helps you to understand the discussion between Spectral and I, you can insert whatever label helps you. Would "trump supporters" have satisfied you? Or would we then get into a debate as to what constitutes a Trump supporter?

Or could you accept that the term, generally refers to those who support Trump? I know tediousness is your shtick. You just don't really have to use it every discussion. Or maybe you do. Either way, keep on keepin' on...

[belleflop]

I wasn't really bringing up the whole thing with Podesta making his password "p@ssword" or whatever, rather if the allegations are true, that Russia exposed a scandal in our government, why are those that claim to be seeking the truth now upset?

And if the article is accurate, and Putin is made because the US exposed him having a Panamanian bank account with $2 billion which tarnished his reputation, why aren't the liberals criticizing our own country for that?

Can you point to what scandal Russia exposed in our government?

[Daerio]

If it helps you to understand the discussion between Spectral and I, you can insert whatever label helps you. Would "trump supporters" have satisfied you? Or would we then get into a debate as to what constitutes a Trump supporter?

Or could you accept that the term, generally refers to those who support Trump? I know tediousness is your shtick. You just don't really have to use it every discussion. Or maybe you do. Either way, keep on keepin' on...

Again, you're attempting to assign a political philosophy to a chunk of voters that didn't exist before this election?

You say Trump voters are hypocrites because they're the same typical conservative voters that used to hate Russia, but that's total bullshit because they aren't the same voters and they aren't the same group of people and your argument falls flat on its face.

[Kiri]

Well, if there is no physical proof, how did they come to the conclusion it was putin? Probabilities?

There are several ways to provide physical evidence. Digitan fingerprints, for example. Another way would be to cite sources (agents, informants etc.) in russia. But they have none of that. What so ever. Or rather: they didn't present any of it, yet.

Digital Fingerprints are not physical per definition...

[NYC17]

Again, you're attempting to assign a political philosophy to a chunk of voters that didn't exist before this election?

You say Trump voters are hypocrites because they're the same typical conservative voters that used to hate Russia, but that's total bullshit because they aren't the same voters and they aren't the same group of people and your argument falls flat on its face.

Nope, I said trump supporters(who are generally Republicans). Actually, at first I said Republicans since, you know, they overwhelmingly supported Trump, and, you know, the chairman of their national organization became his chief of staff. The disconnect for you here would be that being a voter and a supporter aren't exactly the same thing.

Voters is the word you used, and it is inaccurate.

[RickJamesLich]

Can you point to what scandal Russia exposed in our government?

Things like the DNC going against Sanders and Hillary's team being leaked debate questions (and accepting them), apparently liberals are now pretending that this somehow swayed voters to the point where Donald Trump won.

[Spectral]

Because the USA is uncomfortable with a new rising super power entering the stage and upseting things?

Russian GDP by year:

Calling them a "rising super power" is top kek.

[Daerio]

Nope, I said trump supporters(who are generally Republicans). Actually, at first I said Republicans since, you know, they overwhelmingly supported Trump, and, you know, the chairman of their national organization became his chief of staff.

No, semantics nonsense aside, your argument is that Trump and the "people who support him" are hypocrites because they "like" Russia now and they "hated" him before. That argument is total and complete bullshit; additionally, the confusion on your end seems to stem from the fact that you think Trump has the same support base as say, Bush did.

[Kellhound]

Because the USA is uncomfortable with a new rising super power entering the stage and upseting things?

Russia is not even close to being a super power. They are a regional power equipped with a nuclear arsenal, nothing more. The only country approaching the US in super power status is China.

[Deleted]

Russian GDP by year:

Calling them a "rising super power" is top kek.

Holy shitmother of skewed diagrams..... that thing is literally made to look catastrophic, it's bad, but not nearly as bad as the graphic tells.

Any statistics that doesnt start at 0 and ends at the highest number etc.... Point is, that thing is skewed to shit.

[Daerio]

Russia is not even close to being a super power. They are a regional power equipped with a nuclear arsenal, nothing more. The only country approaching the US in super power status is China.

Quibbling about the terminology is silly. I feel like any country armed with nukes in the modern age is a superpower. It's a designation of understanding that they have higher diplomatic bargaining power. That's the reality of it. That's what makes a superpower.

I think it's pretty silly to argue that America is the only superpower. We don't get to arbitrarily decide world happenings, despite what some people think.

[Bullettime]

Because the USA is uncomfortable with a new rising super power entering the stage and upseting things?

They're not even a fucking superpower. Russia is nothing more than a regional power that has nukes but is getting backed into a corner more and more each year by further globalization and a push towards green energy. Russia has only one thing the world wants, oil, and is becoming less and less demanded each year. They're just loudly bitching their way into becoming a footnote.

Putin is just obnoxiously vocal, in part to convince his own people that everything is awesome and how macho Russia really is. He's basically becoming Kim Jong-un lite.

[Spectral]

Holy shitmother of skewed diagrams..... that thing is literally made to look catastrophic, it's bad, but not nearly as bad as the graphic tells.

Any statistics that doesnt start at 0 and ends at the highest number etc.... Point is, that thing is skewed to shit.

I really can't be held liable for other people's inability to read axes, particularly when the relevant numbers are also above the bars.

[Wyrt]

So, what what is Putin getting from Trump?

[Kellhound]

Quibbling about the terminology is silly. I feel like any country armed with nukes in the modern age is a superpower. It's a designation of understanding that they have higher diplomatic bargaining power. That's the reality of it. That's what makes a superpower.

I think it's pretty silly to argue that America is the only superpower. We don't get to arbitrarily decide world happenings, despite what some people think.

Super power status is based on military, economic, and soft power. No other country in the world approaches the US in overall power, that is why it is the only current super power.

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So, what what is Putin getting from Trump?

The real question is what is Trump getting from Putin.

[NYC17]

Things like the DNC going against Sanders and Hillary's team being leaked debate questions (and accepting them), apparently liberals are now pretending that this somehow swayed voters to the point where Donald Trump won.

Once again, a democratic organization supporting an actual democrat over Sanders is not a scandal.

[NYC17]

No, semantics nonsense aside, your argument is that Trump and the "people who support him" are hypocrites because they "like" Russia now and they "hated" him before. That argument is total and complete bullshit; additionally, the confusion on your end seems to stem from the fact that you think Trump has the same support base as say, Bush did.

Incorrect. You're confusing voters and supporters. I voted for Clinton, but calling me a supporter of hers would be beyond stupid as I could barely find the motivation to do so. It happened to be when I passed the early voting station on my way to get a haircut and thought "I guess I should vote now because I most likely won't bother to any other time".

Trump supporters have a penchant for excusing and explaining away everything he says and does. These people are overwhelmingly made up of Republicans. They aren't moderates, they aren't swing voters, as those people almost by definition aren't activist enough to bother defending Trump to the last.

So there is definitely semantics nonsense taking place, it's just you are oblivious to the fact that it's you demanding a different label for it, which I said, you can assign as you wish. The Republican leadership has jumped on to Trump's bandwagon and tacitly endorsed his nonsensical crusade against common sense and reason as it pertains to the DNC hacking issue. Those Republicans who have voiced vehement opposition to that stance are relatively few. Basic stuff.

[belleflop]

Things like the DNC going against Sanders and Hillary's team being leaked debate questions (and accepting them), apparently liberals are now pretending that this somehow swayed voters to the point where Donald Trump won.

First that wasn't a government scandal, that was private institution (DNC). Second the only liberals I see still blaming the hacking of the DNC as the primary cause of the loss of the election are crazy people in denial. As in the same type of crazy people that still want to argue that Russia didn't do the hacking.