Take a step back

[Killface1]

So 7.1.5 dropped, and people should have had time to get used to a few of the changes. I've seen a lot of bitching on the forums, which is surprising to me, because I think 7.1.5 was one of the best patches they've ever done in terms of keeping everybody happy.

They managed to address and adjust quite a few things without majorly fucking up everything else, which is pretty legit.

Complaints they addressed:

Mediocre single target damage: The buffs to several abilities (annihilation and chaos strike), and to blade dance increased our single target dps pretty substantially; most people seem to be reporting 30-40k dps increases (or more in some cases) which is very noticeable. This puts us in line with the other good classes and specs, rather than feeling like a red headed step child. If were being honest. I'd way rather feel like the red headed step child for emereld nightmare and feel awesome for the actual raid they spent a bunch of time on - make no mistake, EN was the highmaul of this expansion, and the fights were blah, boring, easy, and it was a pretty meh raid overall.

Cookie cutter builds: there are currently two completely viable raiding builds right now. I don't have the ring or belt or shoulders, the three largest single target dps legendaries available for demon hunters right now, and I just did 513k dps on heroic guarm in a 3:40 fight while testing demonic. There are THREE completely viable mythic + builds right now, and room to swap them for eachother based on what legendaries you have.

Legendary disparity - AotHG is an awesome legendary, but the disparity between the haves and have not's was way too large - getting to have full fury and never running out at all times when others had to deal with that was way too strong - you literally could not be competitive without the ring. It's still an awesome legendary and it still puts you significantly ahead of others, but its no longer a flat 10% + to your damage. The most frustrating thing about legendaries was huge dps differences based on completely uncontrollable RNG, and bringing them closer to eachother is only a good thing.

Fury generation - lots of people who haven't done the math are pretty upset right now, but right now if you're playing havoc correctly, you should have less downtime than you did in 7.1. Dead spots of "welp, guess DB hasn't procced for 8s during meta, guess I might as well run off into a corner and die because my damage is gonna be useless now" are fewer and further between, and that's not even accounting for the two set, which is a large fury generator.

Basically, we have more available talent choices, we have more completely different ways to play the spec, were doing extremely good damage (even with the 2% flat nerf to all our abilities, which honestly, I'm surprised that's all that they hit us with). It's no longer quite as crucial to have the "correct" legendaries, because you can adjust the build your running based on whats available to you.

All in all, I think 7.1.5 was a really really nice patch, and I'm very surprised the DH forum is so doom and gloom about it. The only really true complaint that I've seen from people so far is that all the talent trees are really easy, but the fact of the matter is, demon hunters have never been difficult and if you wanted a complex agi melee spec you should have been playing a hit combo monk or a feral druid from the getgo.

Edit: Not to mention from a pvp standpoint, even with the changes were still really strong, and demonic is hilariously good for mythic + right now. Was running 13-15's yesterday in demonic, and the modifers are bolstering/skittish/fort, which meant there were several AoE pulls where I'd snag aggro on 5-6 mobs and it just didn't matter even a little bit...Think about that for a second - it doesn't matter that were pulling aggro on 15 bolstering/skittish/fortified because were outhealing the damage. Not to mention, regularly finishing bosses in the 900-1.2m dps range doesn't suck either.

[Segus1992]

Let's be honest here, DH players complain because DH players are LoL players. Salty, toxic, and childish people.

They were so upset about the nerfs early PTR that they were talking about attacking Blizzard employees and boycotting the company etc.

[Deleted]

Glad to hear you're happy about it, me personally I haven't touched my DH since the patch launched after trying it out.
Just about everything rubs me the wrong way, together with Blizzard's design choices, I miss momentum.

Personally I would love if they gave us 3 specs, one stand still demon centered one, one like an ADHD kid on speed jumping around all over the place while doing damage, get both factions happy.
Or just you know, actually give momentum something back after removing demon speed so it held a chance against no-skill nemesis, rather than nerf momentum AND buff Nemesis.

Things about this patch just don't make sense.

[Meanshield]

Let's be honest here, DH players complain because DH players are LoL players. Salty, toxic, and childish people.

They were so upset about the nerfs early PTR that they were talking about attacking Blizzard employees and boycotting the company etc.

More bcos they used to be Mages, and we all know Mages have been whining to Blizzard on forums since Vanilla..

[Segus1992]

More bcos they used to be Mages, and we all know Mages have been whining to Blizzard on forums since Vanilla..

Even Mages aren't this bad, and I've seen a lot of Mage whine.

[Dextar]

I'm going to start of by saying I'm enjoying the 7.1.5 DH changes. I was never a fan of the Momo build, I played it but I didn't enjoy it. It did add to what made the class different but you still get to FR/VR.

That being said, I have AotG and I'm getting a lot of points where I'm energy starved. Sometimes I've got it flowing really well but there have been a LOT of times since the patch where I'm in meta and I'm not able to do anything. I'm thinking that might be fixed with the 2pc but I don't even want to imagine what it's like without the ring.

I don't think the nerfs they just did for DHs were nessicary in PvE. I'd rather them wait and see how things play out once NH has been out and people start getting the set pieces.

[Killface1]

It makes me cringe every time I hear somebody talk about how momentum is dead.

Its dead for every pure single target fight. Any fight with adds or cleave, it pulls ahead very quickly. Hell, with the fury gen buff to fel mastery, the EN build will probably be the go to build on a lot of NH fights, you wont even swap to felblade. Only change will be the bloodlet-blade dance, and lets be honest, that's awesome. (I have bracers, but blade dance and having two fury spenders makes for significantly more engaging gameplay)

Also, lol@ the ring comment, legendary differentials and the RNG aspect is one of the biggest causes of complaints with legion that there is.

Moral is, they sky hasn't fallen, and I'd be willing to bet you could put up some respectable numbers with momo

[Wardonis]

Glad to hear you're happy about it, me personally I haven't touched my DH since the patch launched after trying it out.
Just about everything rubs me the wrong way, together with Blizzard's design choices, I miss momentum.

Personally I would love if they gave us 3 specs, one stand still demon centered one, one like an ADHD kid on speed jumping around all over the place while doing damage, get both factions happy.
Or just you know, actually give momentum something back after removing demon speed so it held a chance against no-skill nemesis, rather than nerf momentum AND buff Nemesis.

Things about this patch just don't make sense.

momentum is still a thing, it's still raid viable. demonic is also a thing and hella fun, there is also another felblade build. there are 3 raid builds, all are viable. what is there to bitch about

[Lolsteak]

momentum is still a thing, it's still raid viable. demonic is also a thing and hella fun, there is also another felblade build. there are 3 raid builds, all are viable. what is there to bitch about

Clunky fury gen, Sure the damage is there but the rotations are pretty lacking.

[oneclosetothesun]

You are exaggerating
I don't know what wrong about people liking the old build gameplay.

As for legs, if you drop only crap ones, you will feel it more than before patch and your game experience might suffer.

Then the fury generation, well I have done the math to and the "time waiting" after patch is same maybe 1-2% higher before leg ring and set bonus. But if you just look at the changes, nerf DB, nerf ring, fel mastery same tier as felblade, beside higher proc chance on felblade it is big fury gen nerf, I assume as result of incoming tier set and to give option play other builds.

The last part totally got me. So you are outleeching lvl 13-15 keystone with fortified. I am pretty sure the monster will oneshot you if you have agro and atop of that if they get bolster. Feel free to prove me wrong, because I would totally like to see how you outleech hits that are bigger than your hp pull. This last part totally give me impression that your whole post is just emo burst. Try to be more objective next time and understand both why people like it or not...

[Deleted]

momentum is still a thing, it's still raid viable. demonic is also a thing and hella fun, there is also another felblade build. there are 3 raid builds, all are viable. what is there to bitch about

except Momentum isn't really a thing in ST/2 targets fight that goes for the entire ToV/EN Raid, dunno about Nighthold since I haven't seen the fights there, but I bet most of the bosses will be Nemesis, so Momentum won't be used so much in raids. I'm one of those who really dislikes Nemesis, but the rest of the gameplay is still okay

[Deleted]

Fury gen will be fixed come more itemlevel.

Do you all remember how funky the whole thing was when you were gearing up?
The error lies in the philosophy that this class should not be constrained by its resource from the very first tier, and it's been discussed endlessly: it's the reason the ring would have never gone untouched in the first place.

Once crit gets back up, haste catches up and we get our tier bonuses, Fury gen will be as good as it was if not better.
And if it gets better then something will be done, because a class with infinite resource is inherently imbalanced and not healthy for the game.

[glorf12]

I'm able to hit 1.6 million dps. Regardless of "fun" I am in love with this class. If Demon Hunters stopped existing I would never play WoW again.

[Super Kami Dende]

Let's be honest here, DH players complain because DH players are LoL players. Salty, toxic, and childish people.

They were so upset about the nerfs early PTR that they were talking about attacking Blizzard employees and boycotting the company etc.

Someone obviously hasn't seen the Hunter, Warlock or Shaman Forums.

[Deleted]

I love this patch. I went from middle of the pack to Top 3 on most raid fights. Being in top 3 DPS on a ST fight sure feels nice for a change. Yeah maybe I'm not always number 1 on huge AoE packs but really who gives a shit about trash in Raids. I still have decent enough AoE to be useful on AoE fights in nighthold so I'm perfectly happy with where DHs are right now.
My performance in M+ has also gone up by a metric fuck ton.

Maybe momentum was too high a skill cap for me; idk, idc, idgaf. Point is, I'm having way more fun now.

[Sosoulsu]

Anybody who can play DH to 110 and want to stick with the class has got issues.
What a horrible class. Zipping around constantly. It has 0 depth at all. True for a lot of specs in WoW now, but DH is just braindead with zero thought required.

[Deleted]

Tldr: DH is super OP has absurd high burst/sustained ST compared with absurd high AoE burst.
So if not nerfed, the all in one wondermachine
A AoE/ST burst spec shouldt have such a high ST sustained!

[Deleted]

Tldr: DH is super OP has absurd high burst/sustained ST compared with absurd high AoE burst.
So if not nerfed, the all in one wondermachine
A AoE/ST burst spec shouldt have such a high ST sustained!

Be more realistic next time.

[Deleted]

Anybody who can play DH to 110 and want to stick with the class has got issues.
What a horrible class. Zipping around constantly. It has 0 depth at all. True for a lot of specs in WoW now, but DH is just braindead with zero thought required.

Speaking of braindead...

[Synthium]

Agreed with the OP, was skeptical as fuck, now I'm really happy. Downtime is MUCH smaller than it used to be, all in all a great patch for us.