RIP Elite Sets

[Sencha]

Understanding human behavior is understanding that not everyone has competition in mind. Don't pretend humans are that simple.

A lot of players play for various reasons. Some play because they like the story, some play because they like collecting, some play because they want to be the best, and some just roleplay. Any person can play for multiple reasons or a single reason. Either way it's not as simple as, "everyone who plays this game is competitive" because that's a broad generalization that is not true.

OK but if you want to have a competitive part in WoW, you need unique rewards to attract those competitive players. Otherwise they will just move to another game where they can satisfy their ego and Blizzard will lose a lot of players.

Not sure that giving a chance for everyone to have every item is a good move in the long term.

This point is also valid for the PvE competition, despite what Krassz thinks.

[Krusza]

We've seen how competitive PvP is. They can't even get through heroic raids on their own

Meaning what?

[darkwarrior42]

Meaning what?

Meaning that he doesn't understand different types of gameplay require different skills, really. Plenty of PvPers suck at raiding, plenty of raiders suck at PvP. The best of the best tend to do well in both, but that's because the type of player who becomes the best at either side typically has plenty of skills that transfer well.

Not that I agree with you, mind; I hate exclusive rewards, think they feed into a culture of bragging and arrogance, and emphasize the fact that a lot of (quite possibly most) serious PvPers care more about throwing their superiority into the face of everyone around them and the appearance of victory than they do about actually competing. I just don't want to see that comment turn into another excuse to talk endlessly about how much better PvPers are, how much PvE players suck, about how carebares have no real skill, etc....

Not that I expect I can actually prevent it. I've long since accepted the negative and condescending attitude of PvPers, and the fact that my lack of desire to brag, or to insult others, means I just don't have a place in PvP in WoW, even when I find the rare occasion where I actually PvP against similarly geared/skilled opponents (which, to my surprise, has happened a few times this expansion.)

So, despite the fact I don't agree with you, I hope you and those like you win your argument. I hope PvP sets are kept exclusive. It has always been one of the most important aspects of PvP to the community, if not the most important, and thus it should be preserved.

[Enter Name Here]

OP - please! PLEASE tell me you did never and won't ever use any instance of disc or streaming media to watch movies of any sort as they should be entitled only to those who have seen them in the cinema when they where curr...i mean prestigious. thank you

[Adlian]

Not really, more ppl will come back to farm those sets because they love them and they missed out on them.

So make your competitive and dedicated players quit PVPing or even the whole game just to make a few people happy. Interesting trade off.

[Melkorr]

i don't really see how it excists in pve, the challenge mode sets are the closest thing to the elite sets, and those are NOT available to any player who hasn't done the content when it was current.

Tier sets are comparable to the regular PvP sets, which are all available to purchase from a vendor.

I thought about Mythic raiding not Challenge mode sets. Also challenge mode sets are ugly lol

[Deleted]

Meaning that he doesn't understand different types of gameplay require different skills, really. Plenty of PvPers suck at raiding, plenty of raiders suck at PvP. The best of the best tend to do well in both, but that's because the type of player who becomes the best at either side typically has plenty of skills that transfer well.

Not that I agree with you, mind; I hate exclusive rewards, think they feed into a culture of bragging and arrogance, and emphasize the fact that a lot of (quite possibly most) serious PvPers care more about throwing their superiority into the face of everyone around them and the appearance of victory than they do about actually competing. I just don't want to see that comment turn into another excuse to talk endlessly about how much better PvPers are, how much PvE players suck, about how carebares have no real skill, etc....

Not that I expect I can actually prevent it. I've long since accepted the negative and condescending attitude of PvPers, and the fact that my lack of desire to brag, or to insult others, means I just don't have a place in PvP in WoW, even when I find the rare occasion where I actually PvP against similarly geared/skilled opponents (which, to my surprise, has happened a few times this expansion.)

So, despite the fact I don't agree with you, I hope you and those like you win your argument. I hope PvP sets are kept exclusive. It has always been one of the most important aspects of PvP to the community, if not the most important, and thus it should be preserved.

What I understand is that both have their challenges, strengths and weaknesses.

They are difficult and easier for various reasons.

[Nnyco]

if u can do it in pve i dont see why you shouldnt be able todo in pvp, would suck to have some nice sets go to waste because 1% want to be a special snowflake

[Krusza]

OP - please! PLEASE tell me you did never and won't ever use any instance of disc or streaming media to watch movies of any sort as they should be entitled only to those who have seen them in the cinema when they where curr...i mean prestigious. thank you

Try an analogy thats relevant to the topic at hand.

[Deleted]

Shit like this is what makes it more casual.

wow has been casual, by design, since the day it was launched.

[Deleted]

And the cosmetic rewards (titles, mounts) should stay exclusive to people who got them in the relevant tier.

If the gear is so "irrelevant" why do people want it?

The exact same reason ppl want elite pvp gear, for a different look.

The thing is you are trying to conflate the current gear and its relevancy with old outdated gear.

Just like with high arena rating, you need a certain level to obtain Mythic clears during the relevant patch.

And as you stated, only the gear is available, just like how it will be for the elite gear, just cosmetic t-mog. I'l ignore the fact that many mythic mounts just get an insanely low drop-rate once its old content.

[Enter Name Here]

Try an analogy that's relevant to the topic at hand.

try to give prestigious reason why this isn't

[Silveroc]

I understand that pvp players are concerned about this change that would come to question their achievements. Personally I always find silly the fact that locked skins at a certain time of play, kind had to play this extension to have it.

If instead of giving access to all the sets with just a rating, we did as the mounts, accessing a certain rating in a season gives a token that allows you to buy an elite set, only one. That preserves the prestigious side, without undoing everything.

[Deleted]

Unique rewards are essential for pvp/pve HL. Most people (myself included) will never have access to those rewards and that's fine. You can call that elitism, special snowflaking or ego flattering, but those rewards are what drive competition, especially in pvp. Failing to understand that is failing to understand how human behaviour works.

how does a reward that you cannot currently get drive competition? how does me seeing you in your gear from years ago make me play pvp? specifically compared to something like mythic raiding mounts, that shifts over time from taking high skill to high time commitment to get?

[TriHard]

You can get old raid tier sets and heck, they even let you obtain Tier 3 again, so why shouldn't we get the same option with the old pvp gear? Your post makes no sense.

[Krusza]

try to give prestigious reason why this isn't

Oh, you're not trolling and you actually think it's a relevant analogy. Okay, baby steps.

OP - please! PLEASE tell me you did never and won't ever use any instance of disc or streaming media to watch movies of any sort as they should be entitled only to those who have seen them in the cinema when they where curr...i mean prestigious. thank you

How is this even remotely the same as my point? This is nearly as bad as the one earlier that was comparing my point to "a girl that cares about what people dress like"

You're probably just strawmanning my argument as you're not capable of argumentation.

I'm arguing that rewards, such as elite gear, should stay exclusive to the players that earned them when they were relevant. Their worth improves with their rarity, and as such will be devalued just because some random 2k legion mongo can get it again.

They are purely e-peen items and should remain as such.

Letting more people have the previously exclusive reward devalues the worth of the reward for the original people that got the reward, which had something incredibly rare.

Elite sets are rewards for reaching a certain rating IN THAT SEASON, that's the whole point of them. Let's say you get an elite set when you're an underdog class, you see literally no one with that set as a result. Cut forward 10 seasons later and some random 2k mongo who played your spec when it was OP has your set. Yeah, fair.

Watching a movie is not a credible analogy for reward exclusivity, go back to school.

- - - Updated - - -

You can get old raid tier sets and heck, they even let you obtain Tier 3 again, so why shouldn't we get the same option with the old pvp gear? Your post makes no sense.

If you actually read my whole post and perhaps the thread, you'd realize that point has been addressed about 60 times and it would probably make sense to you.

[Terahertz]

Seriously? That's really fucking lame. Whenever you see someone with an elite set from the past you know what kind of player he is/used to be and there's most definitely prestige in having older season 2.2k transmog.

If they were to do this, then there'd be even less reason to actually try for 2.2k every season for the less hardcore PvPers. You could simply wait till the end of the expansion and get 2.2k then and you'll have all the transmog.

Definitely a bad decision and it's really sad to see that people would for this kind of change.

Oh well, if they do actually do this then maybe also release old Challenge Mode gear again for everyone who has done a mythic+10 dungeon? It's only fair :^)

[Xisa]

you got to rub them under everyones nose for the past months/years. so what? does this devalue your achievements from back then?

Yes. The reward for the achievement was the gear. If other people can have it now, it by definition lessens it.

[Sencha]

how does a reward that you cannot currently get drive competition? specifically compared to something like mythic raiding mounts, that shifts over time from taking high skill to high time commitment to get?

You may need to read my previous posts, but I repeat it here : competition is driven by unique rewards. Once the season ends, those rewards should never be obtainable, in order to make them more prestigious and giving more incentive to get them when they are available. A lot more people would be interested in rated pvp this way.

[Inukenshin]

Let's say there's a night elf male DK called "deethkinght". For years he had played arena, but never got higher than 1700 because he's just not good at games, and also lacking in intellect.

Legion hits, he plays WWDK at the start of season and gets 2.3. He never improved as a player, he just played an insanely retarded comp in a retarded expansion.

Now deethkinght has every elite set in the game despite going back to being stuck at 1700 every season after.

Remember your elite set that was pretty damn hard to get in season 11? 5 years ago that barely anyone got? Yep, this guy has it.

Deethkinght in his previously highly prestigious transmog then proceeds to run around in BGs saying stuff like "kill heler noobis" and "omg why no heal".

Your rewards are now worthless.

Complains about legion 2.3, achieved 2.2 once in a shitty expansion.