Flight Paths: Appeasing the Masses

[Ealyssa]

So you want instant teleportation whenever you need to do a 2-minute trip?

No I want to be free to go from point A to point B. And that's what 7.2 will give me.

Actually giving flight is the optimal way. You can still afk/seesighting while other may want to fast travel.

[gallamann]

Id be happy if blizzard did

Stop flying a circle around flight point before landing

Flew in a straight line

Put 113 level gaurds at all flight points, tired of world PvP being whatever flight point tht days emissary turnin is at

Qnd give these pvp fellow a reason to go to a frickin pvp wq

[Deleted]

Just give us flying and get rid of flight paths. It was good pre-cata, but right now people is just used to fly from point A to point B; everything else just feels like shit (even the suramar teleporters that save a lot of time).

[Thimagryn]

So alt tabbing on a flying mount is acceptable, but not on an FP. Gotcha. Seems a bit one-sided.

What is the alternative to alt tabbing on a FP? Sorting your inventory or interacting with the UI (from lack of any other world interaction) is antithesis to immersion; the entire reason for travel in the world.

On a flying mount, you are in direct control of your character. If you alt tab, it is your choice. It's not forced on you, and not everyone alt-tabs while flying. The problem of Flight Paths removing player interaction is universal, you just don't mind the problem being there.

Same thing exists with how Blizzard handles flight. You want flight and that makes it a problem and you acknowledge that it exists, but you don't mind that flight is taken away because you personally find other ways around it to enjoy the game. If there was no problem, you wouldn't have started this thread.

[-Joker-]

What is the alternative to alt tabbing on a FP? Sorting your inventory or interacting with the UI (from lack of any other world interaction) is antithesis to immersion; the entire reason for travel in the world.

On a flying mount, you are in direct control of your character. If you alt tab, it is your choice. It's not forced on you, and not everyone alt-tabs while flying. The problem of Flight Paths removing player interaction is universal, you just don't mind the problem being there.

Same thing exists with how Blizzard handles flight. You want flight and that makes it a problem and you acknowledge that it exists, but you don't mind that flight is taken away because you personally find other ways around it to enjoy the game. If there was no problem, you wouldn't have started this thread.

When questing, you are forced to complete the quest if you want a reward.

When raiding, you are forced to complete the raid if you want the achievement and reward.

When dungeoning, you are forced to complete the dungeon for the gear and achievements.

When leveling professions, you are forced to level to max in order to benefit from said profession.

When travelling, you are forced to go from A to B, regardless of the method of travel.

If you are concerned about being "forced" to do things in WoW, you have BIGGER issues than a flying mount.

[Coulrophobia1989]

I think having all 3 options would be fantastic. There are points in time where I need that extra minute or 3 to walk away and get a glass of water, bio break etc... but when I'm in the zone, I just want to get to where I need to go yesterday.

[Thimagryn]

When questing, you are forced to complete the quest if you want a reward.

When raiding, you are forced to complete the raid if you want the achievement and reward.

When dungeoning, you are forced to complete the dungeon for the gear and achievements.

When leveling professions, you are forced to level to max in order to benefit from said profession.

When travelling, you are forced to go from A to B, regardless of the method of travel.

If you are concerned about being "forced" to do things in WoW, you have BIGGER issues than a flying mount.

Wow, way to strawman the entire argument into something it was never about.

Yeah, and we're forced to log in to play the game, so your logic works perfectly doesn't it? "Let's ignore there's any problems with flight paths because anyone who has a problem with it should be concerned about BIGGER issues"

None of your examples apply because they do not take away player choice nor does it take player interaction away from the game. Turning in any quest requires direct input. Travelling on any mount or on foot requires direct control and tactile input. All of your examples are a direct result of your actions, and you are never taken out of control of your character through any of these interactions. Flight Paths are one of the only systems in the game that take away control of your character without any purpose. Ingame cinematics for repeatable content is also bad design, because it has no purpose past the first time it's shown. It's not about having to deal with UI's or being forced to do things you don't want to, it's about literally taking away purposeful player interaction.

Any feature or system that intentionally leaves you to distract yourself from gameplay (including purposeful interactions with UI) is bad design. Your purpose is to play the game, and any distractions (AFKing, checking bags, idling) should be a conscious decision by the player, not a byproduct of a badly designed system.

If you can't understand the most basic reasons behind the problems with Flight Paths, then really nothing you say will ever be a solution.

[Griffter]

This is a perfect example of how players will always choose the most efficient method, no matter how much it ruins the fun or immersion for them. They can't make flight paths instant because it would "shrink" the world too much just like the portals in Cataclysm did. Even if they make it an optional thing, almost everyone will pick the instant option even if they would like the game more as a big world that you have to spend time traveling through.

[-Joker-]

Wow, way to strawman the entire argument into something it was never about.

If you can't understand the most basic reasons behind the problems with Flight Paths, then really nothing you say will ever be a solution.

The only real issue with flight paths is the looping. Not everyone is a fan of indirect scenic routes. Personally, I find it to be a basic facet of the game and of every design change so far, the only things to change were the graphics of the birds and the new ones added to each zone.

Flight paths, much like some of the fights in the game, are essentially a countdown clock. There is a 5 minute countdown clock from the time you talk to Mograine until the Battle for Light's Hope begins. There is also a 3 minute delay in Tempest Keep when fighting the final boss between phase 2 and 3. There are several "pauses" that occur in gameplay, and flight paths are simply another pause. You are given the chance to:

- Alt/Tab to research your destination, or simply just to view the web
- Go to the restroom
- Have a smoke
- Nuke some food
- Answer the phone
etc, etc.

Yeah, what you call a Strawman, I call a prime example of how players are forced into situations in order to complete objectives within the game. What you call being removed from the world, I call a "game pause" allowing me 60 seconds to 15 minutes to go do what I need to do. I once went to get gas and smokes while flying from Silvermoon City to Booty Bay. I landed just as I came in the door.

This constant apophenia about flight paths is really starting to get old. Creating a problem where none truly exist seems to be a theme for some of you.

[Thimagryn]

The only real issue with flight paths is the looping.

As well as the time spent flying A to B if the course is a long one. If you're going to deny that this is a problem, you're not going to fix anything just by only addressing the looping. How many people chose option B again?

I once went to get gas and smokes while flying from Silvermoon City to Booty Bay. I landed just as I came in the door.

This constant apophenia about flight paths is really starting to get old. Creating a problem where none truly exist seems to be a theme for some of you.

I haven't seen anyone so proud of being unable to play a game they logged in to play.

You might be the kind of guy who appreciates getting more sun from having to walk to work after your car just got stolen, but I don't think everyone in the same situation feels the same way about that.

[Grythletubs]

OP, World of Warcraft players are the biggest hypocrites in this world, so this thread is pointless because:

1. They claim on flight paths you get to see the scenery, even though flying allows you to actually control your path, whereas flight paths do not, in any shape or form.
2. They claim flight paths allow you to see the scenery, yet many of them will admit in other threads to alt-tab during flight path flight.
3. They claim flight paths allow you to see the scenery, but that they'd rather use a port once they've taken it a few times.

The list goes on to bout #25, but the point is: in conclusion, they themselves admit indirectly that flight paths are pointless and that flying mounts themselves would ruin nothing when it comes to the "advantages" of flight paths, which is just another argument for why flying mounts ruin nothing except world PVP to some extent.

All those options are of course very rational, well rounded and reasonable to appease all the groups (read: the vocal minority and the rest of the sane people).

The problem? They're a very, very vocal minority, and they have a lot of time to waste defending one of the only things they have power over in their lives: negating quality of life decisions on the basis that it makes the game "harder" which in turn makes them think they're more resilient and "better".

Spot on. Sadly most of the people left in this game are the "zomg grund mount so guuud lol *blows whistle to go back to fp*" twits who think that's somehow better than flying.

[McCrazy]

In Lord of the Rings Online there is no flying. You need to unlock (most) stablemasters first on your own before you can rent a horse.

For traveling with rented mounts you have these options:
1. for short distances you ride with horse (or goat) on the streets from A to B*. Costs a few coppers.
2. for long distances you ride fast with horse (or goat) on the streets from A to B*. Costs some silvercoins.
3. for long distances (and really far places) you ride a few strides from A -> loading screen -> arrive at B. It's a lot faster, but this costs you more money.

*Since you ride always the whole distance with options 1 and 2 you can stop the ride where ever you want, get off the mount and travel from that point on your own. You can't get back on the rented mount when you decided to stop your ride until you travel to the next stablemaster. This is a good shortcut, if you need to go someplace between or far away from stablemasters, since the rented mounts are faster then your own.

Sometimes you have to change mounts, because you can only travel from A to B and from B to C, but not directly from A to C. In most cases this is when traveling to places located in other expansions. (Like portals from Stormwind to Shattrath or Pandaria).

[Deleted]

There should be teleport to each zone. You would have to "find" that first to unlock it. Using it would cost 1g - 10g depending on level of content.
Inside those zones would be still flightpoints and all that. But youd get in the zone faster.
Hell, even cata had those portals to all zones not just Vashjir and Deepholme :|

I mean come on, most classes already have portals to each Broken Isle zone in their order hall. Like warrior just unlocks teleports around the isle while questing.
Some of us have to fly about 3 mins to get to high mountain. Not big on itself, but when you do that route 100 times its 300 minutes "wasted"/alt-tabbed for no reason at all (anymore)

[-Joker-]

As well as the time spent flying A to B if the course is a long one. If you're going to deny that this is a problem, you're not going to fix anything just by only addressing the looping. How many people chose option B again?

How many prefer Option C? Quick load screen and arrive at destination. How many others would prefer to use a Hearthstone to reach ANY Inn in the game? You're one to talk about giving people options... unless you don't care for the options being discussed.

I haven't seen anyone so proud of being unable to play a game they logged in to play.

You might be the kind of guy who appreciates getting more sun from having to walk to work after your car just got stolen, but I don't think everyone in the same situation feels the same way about that.

Actually, I'm just the kind of guy to find the upside to any situation and then use it to my advantage. Sometimes, the bathroom break is 6 or 7 minutes, and not just 15-30 seconds. The only thing wrong with Flight Paths are the people who bitch about using them. They were NEVER an issue until world flight unlocked. Still aren't an issue for some of us.

[Demeia]

This is where I wish they'd rob from FFXIV some, they at least let you simply warp to places (crystal to crystal, basically FP to FP) instead of having to waste time with this "scenic" flight shit.

Immersion or something? Ironically nothing makes me feel less a part of the WoW world than the stupid flight points; I just go AFK and do something else. They must have internal statistics proving this is the behavior of the majority of their player base. It's a fairly stupid, primative time sink at this point and in a game that is priding itself on things to do, well, perhaps one of those things to do shouldn't be going afk while we're on a damn griffin.

[Phuongvi]

I like to take the fly path from Dalaran to the edge of High Mountain, said no one ever.

Give me teleport and flying already.

The map of Legion's already obsolete, so at this point it's a waste of time and it's not even fun.
We got the message we saw the landscape and shit. We don't care anymore about those 87 AP quest or 400 ressources quest at the end of the world.
If you need answer on why they are losing subs, that,s one of them

[Thimagryn]

Actually, I'm just the kind of guy to find the upside to any situation and then use it to my advantage. Sometimes, the bathroom break is 6 or 7 minutes, and not just 15-30 seconds. The only thing wrong with Flight Paths are the people who bitch about using them. They were NEVER an issue until world flight unlocked. Still aren't an issue for some of us.

I do the same thing, but it doesn't mean a problem no longer exists or that it's the fault of every player that mechanics require to be worked around.

Ingame cinematics that are repeated in raids are bad as well. Deathbringer Saurfang is a prime example. Does it bother me? Not one bit personally. But things don't have to bother me personally to acknowledge a problem exists, and being aware that it is a badly implemented design decision is constructive towards avoiding needless repetition like that in the future.

And especially with WoW, a lot of its development is still happening in within a bubble. Where WoW excels is in its presentation and production value, where it falls short is its ability to evolve its systems and gameplay to meet more modern standards. I don't know how many other games you play outside of WoW, but to me it seems your vision of a better world is limited by only playing WoW. I believe many examples I've brought up in other games simply mean nothing to you since you haven't played or experienced any situation where open world design and travel can be better without flight paths.

Honestly, I'm not even complaining about flight paths. I've always maintained a stance that they are a flawed and archaic system. You yourself acknowledge that flight is a problem despite the fact you are pro-flight. Yet here you view this discussion on flight paths in the most hypocritical fashion, seeing anyone that points out the exact same problem existing in flight paths must be a result of butthurt or hatred for the system.

Flight Paths, just like Flight, is flawed. If you want to improve the system, then they should be removed because it literally does the same thing that flight does - remove the player from all world interaction. Instant waypoints are a proven alternative that work in many other open world and MMO games. There is no logical reason not to have them. The end result is - if you want to AFK, you can still AFK after taking the waypoint and be at your destination when you come back.

[Deleted]

Option 1: Standard - Flight path remains the same as it always has

Don't fix what ain't broken. Don't make it overcomplicated. Keep it simple.

[Deleted]

Just make it possible to drop off the flyer in mid air. Almost all classes and specs have an ability that can be used to avoid fall damage. I think only warlocks and dks don't have anything at all. Besides that, kites are a dime a dozen.

[-Joker-]

Just make it possible to drop off the flyer in mid air. Almost all classes and specs have an ability that can be used to avoid fall damage. I think only warlocks and dks don't have anything at all. Besides that, kites are a dime a dozen.

I make a pretty penny selling goblin gliders in the AH. That said, it would be awesome to have a mid-air dismount with a parachute, rather than just a requested stop.