Holinka's interview

[rda]

Summary of Holinka's interview (see the front page - permalink):

* We are looking into A, B.
* We are thinking about C, D, E.
* We don't think we are going to do F. <Spends tons of time mulling over the complexities that are so first-level basic that it becomes clear this is the first time Holinka thinks about the topic.>
* That thing you are worried about is working fine, we just have to do a better job explaining how it works.
* We aren't sure about doing G, please send more feedback.
* We sometimes think about H. Don't know if we are going to do it.
* J is a real challenge. No commitments.
* The team is aware that you don't like K.
* By the way, it's all good. We found a metric on which PVP ladder in Legion looks fine compared to ladders of previous expansions. (Or maybe this is false and we just think nobody would pin us on the numbers.)

The only things Holinka said like "here, we did / are going to do this" are:

* Leveling PVP is going to reward more experience (a change of a multiplicative factor, 5 minutes of dev time).
* Rated weekly quests will have bonus rolls (a change of a flag on several quests, same as above, requires next to no time to do).
* They will show the title cutoffs by themselves (at best this is a very minor addition to the bnet API, at worst just a blog post).
* They are extending PVP cups (e-sport, bla bla bla, not something the dev team even does, but whatever).

These guys are officially doing nothing. They have a whole team and the amount of work they can show after several months is less than half of a work day of a single dev.

Disgusting.

[BellicoseAxe]

The most interesting bit of the interview was when Holinka had to explain why Shroud of Concealment is disabled in PvP while Mass Invisibility is not. Lore pretty much had to bail him out on that one.

[FelPlague]

i think the issue is pvp is a smaller part of the game then pve
and evereyone wants different things, specially for pvp, people want to curb stomp people who have less gear ,well others want it to be more skill based...
and bgs.. they cant win... every new bg they add people will hate, because people will just stick with warsong gulch and arathi basin...

but yeah pvp has been having alot of issues that could get easily fixed

go back to currency, the rng is horrible
make a pvp focused area in the hub (not underbell,y like a place where you can duel and hang out with pvp training dummies and such)
honor talents are cool, i like the idea of having your class changing in pvp, but balance classes by changing templates/honor talents, dont touch pve talents to pbalance pvp... that was the whole point of the template/pvp change

[Krusza]

The most interesting bit of the interview was when Holinka had to explain why Shroud of Concealment is disabled in PvP while Mass Invisibility is not. Lore pretty much had to bail him out on that one.

Lore threw him into that one, he brought up that as an arcane mage he still has mass invis.

It was funny as fuck.

- - - Updated - - -

i think the issue is pvp is a smaller part of the game then pve
and evereyone wants different things, specially for pvp, people want to curb stomp people who have less gear ,well others want it to be more skill based...
and bgs.. they cant win... every new bg they add people will hate, because people will just stick with warsong gulch and arathi basin...

but yeah pvp has been having alot of issues that could get easily fixed

go back to currency, the rng is horrible
make a pvp focused area in the hub (not underbell,y like a place where you can duel and hang out with pvp training dummies and such)
honor talents are cool, i like the idea of having your class changing in pvp, but balance classes by changing templates/honor talents, dont touch pve talents to pbalance pvp... that was the whole point of the template/pvp change

None of those things are at the core of what makes PVP gameplay terrible. They could add all of those things and it would be better, but still terrible because the core issue is not being addressed which is excessive ability pruning and the dumbing down of gameplay.

[Deleted]

So...vote with your wallet instead of blabbling your mouth off?

[rda]

So...vote with your wallet instead of blabbling your mouth off?

You think that's some kind of a great "counter"?

I already did. Feel better?

They continue to have a whole team with nothing to show for it in the way of actual work.

[saradonin]

Not even sure what he was talking about.
What was that?
Oh, right, that thing called "PvP" ceased to exist after infamous Lolherald had been invented.

[anaxie]

Not surprising.

The fact they let incompetent people like this develope the game is why I will never play WoW again. it's beyond saving because the developers are fucking idiots. You can't fix the game when the B team working on it are halfwits

[MeinKyzr]

Was really hoping this was going to be more apologetic. Something like, "We haven't been listening to you guys and we're sorry. We're not just going to do better, here's what you said and here's what we're doing to address that. Let us know what you think."

Instead they dodged the most popular questions on the QA thread and still failed at some of the softballs they tossed themselves.

Such a shame, was really hoping they'd give me a reason to come back.

[Gatsbybutters]

I read the summary, can't listen to those guys talk anymore. Using google and previous discussions and patches you can counter every point and idea they tried to make using previous ideas and changes.
A person, that I can see. But an entire team of people working on a project for a multi million dollar international company with neither hindsight or foresight? Not even a tiny bit of either of them!? It's just amazing. Must be a perfect storm of ego and stupidity.

[rda]

I read the summary, can't listen to those guys talk anymore. Using google and previous discussions and patches you can counter every point and idea they tried to make using previous ideas and changes.
A person, that I can see. But an entire team of people working on a project for a multi million dollar international company with neither hindsight or foresight? Not even a tiny bit of either of them!? It's just amazing. Must be a perfect storm of ego and stupidity.

I am honestly trying to imagine what their PVP team is doing - and I am failing, because their work is nowhere to be seen. We just have some fallback from class changes plus we have that guy, Holinka doing contentless interviews from time to time and tweeting garbage. That's it.

Is it really that the "PVP team" is just basically Holinka and that he might sometimes borrow a dev or two from other, normal teams? It definitely feels like it, and I am not saying that just to try and be edgy. No, it really feels like the number of Blizzard devs who come to the job to write code for PVP is zero, and PVP-oriented changes are done by people whose jobs are only tangentially related to PVP.

[Gatsbybutters]

I am honestly trying to imagine what their PVP team is doing - and I am failing, because their work is nowhere to be seen. We just have some fallback from class changes plus we have that guy, Holinka doing contentless interviews from time to time and tweeting garbage. That's it.

Is it really that the "PVP team" is just basically Holinka and that he might sometimes borrow a dev or two from other, normal teams? It definitely feels like it, and I am not saying that just to try and be edgy. No, it really feels like the number of Blizzard devs who come to the job to write code for PVP is zero, and PVP-oriented changes are done by people whose jobs are only tangentially related to PVP.

The team size, work ethic, and what's been produced are moot at this point. They can't even be bothered to have an intern cross check current ideas with previous changes at this point. They are skipping the initial steps of brainstorming, of course everything after comes out looking like shit. People under the impression that these guys are under the boot of the shareholders are just laughable anymore.

[Hashtronaut]

None of those things are at the core of what makes PVP gameplay terrible. They could add all of those things and it would be better, but still terrible because the core issue is not being addressed which is excessive ability pruning and the dumbing down of gameplay.

People are still bothered by pruning? Don't think I'll ever understand why more buttons = more skill...

[effs]

People are still bothered by pruning? Don't think I'll ever understand why more buttons = more skill...

It's not the number of buttons that's the issue, it's more of what was removed or lazily put into talents.

[Gatsbybutters]

It's not the number of buttons that's the issue, it's more of what was removed or lazily put into talents.

And this ^ You don't take rock away from someone while playing rock paper scissors.

[Deleted]

If you "read between the lines" in many of his interviews and even his Twitter posts, you already know he isn't getting much enjoyment out of his work.

All that we ned for PvP is someone that actually likes PvP and plays PvP (and WoW for that matter) himself/herself.

[Deleted]

Solo Queued in RBG is a must to grow. Every other "esports" game as this yet Wow falls down on it. hard.

solo queue for Arena 2v2 I feel is a good idea, easy to put filters on e.g I'm a fury warrior, I only want to be matched with x healer, x healer etc at 2.2k + MMR.

Solo queue arena 3v3 would be a lot harder to master, due to active viable comps Buffs and nerfs ruining certain comps (insert RMX here). But if they could make it work, it would be good.

but then again, why stop there, solo queue pve could work like LFR, certain ilvl / achievements etc could be potential.

[Torais]

I know the WoW developers cop a lot of flak but I am being completely honest and unironic when I say I have absolutely no idea what the devil Holinka does all day to draw a pay-cheque.

I mean look at the PvP side of things; No new BGs since Mists of frigging Pandaria. Lousy PvP balance that keeps getting worse, not better. A whole lot of hot air about having all these "knobs to turn" while being too damn lazy to do anything but the most token amount with them. Melee absolutely stomping anyone who isn't with nothing but disinterest at best and contempt at worst.

It's clear the man has little joy for his job. The only thing he seems to have any interest with is Arenas which are the powered bones of a dead horse Blizzard just cannot stop trying to hammer away at. (You know your pathetic attempt at an e-Sport is bad when your company has to buy an entire damn network for it to get any airtime.) Anything else is beneath his concern and he has skillfully wiggled his way in to a position that lets him get away with doing the bare minimum while reaping the perks of high level Blizzard job. Rather contemptuous but you can't blame him too much if he gets away with it time and time again.

I just wish Blizzard would switch in someone that actually has some joy and love left for the PvP element of the game but I suspect anyone of any actual talent and drive is working away at whatever is going to eventually replace WoW. Hell knows the game has been left in the hands of the definite B-team for years now.

[Hashtronaut]

And this ^ You don't take rock away from someone while playing rock paper scissors.

This is a terrible metaphor...did they remove a class? Or a whole damage dealing type (i.e. melee)...no. They're transitioning from having buttons that are situational to actually having to use all the buttons you have, again I don't quite understand what people are complaining when they say "lolz pruning sucks" feel like that's just a meme at this point haven't seen an actual GOOD example in months (and a lot has changed since then).

Solo Queued in RBG is a must to grow. Every other "esports" game as this yet Wow falls down on it. hard.

Solo queue arena 3v3 would be a lot harder to master, due to active viable comps Buffs and nerfs ruining certain comps (insert RMX here). But if they could make it work, it would be good.

Yeah solo/duo q RBGs would be awesome and should've been implemented a while ago, I'm completely on board with it.
As for solo q 3's, this should never be a thing.

[Matthias]

Solo Queued in RBG is a must to grow. Every other "esports" game as this yet Wow falls down on it. hard.

solo queue for Arena 2v2 I feel is a good idea, easy to put filters on e.g I'm a fury warrior, I only want to be matched with x healer, x healer etc at 2.2k + MMR.

Solo queue arena 3v3 would be a lot harder to master, due to active viable comps Buffs and nerfs ruining certain comps (insert RMX here). But if they could make it work, it would be good.

but then again, why stop there, solo queue pve could work like LFR, certain ilvl / achievements etc could be potential.

Really on the fence with Solo Queue. I think for Arena it would be fine, but the ladder should be based on Class/Spec not overall since some classes can just perform far better independently. I shudder at the idea of RBG solo queue >.<. The one thing I can't stand about BGs is how low an impact you seem to have unless your super geared and the other team isn't (or when you have 0 healers -_-).