Sargeras is not on/near Argus

[Dagoth Ur]

Three factions with the Illidari being the third one. That's how it should have went imo

I was sure this is how they were gonna go when WoW was first announced. Frozen Throne set it up perfectly to have Horde, Alliance and Illidari faction with naga, belves, broken and demon hunters.

Never was sure why they decided to go full villain with Kael, Vash'j and Illidan in TBC. They were the most interesting characters in TFT imo.

Maybe 3 factions would be a little to much but I don't know, ESO for example is doing fine with it.

[Friendlyimmolation]

I was sure this is how they were gonna go when WoW was first announced. Frozen Throne set it up perfectly to have Horde, Alliance and Illidari faction with naga, belves, broken and demon hunters.

Never was sure why they decided to go full villain with Kael, Vash'j and Illidan in TBC. They were the most interesting characters in TFT imo.

Maybe 3 factions would be a little to much but I don't know, ESO for example is doing fine with it.

Because the writing was god awful in Burning crusade.

[Dagoth Ur]

Because the writing was god awful in Burning crusade.

Yeah.
Really shame how even after Illidan novel trying to somewhat make sense of all of it, Kael still drew the shortest straw and got butchered the most.
His whole campaign in TFT is awesome, but in WoW god help.

[Selastan]

Because the writing was god awful in Burning crusade.

The writing was good, execution was bad. Illidan's tragic fall at the hands of those too ignorant to understand was a great story, one they are dangerously close to fucking up right now if Illidan doesn't get screwed over by the end of Legion.

[therealbowser]

Yeah that's a solid possibility. Maybe he's in some semi-coma state & weakened and can only talk to Kil'Jaeden through that thing on the ship. Than it really makes sense blowing up Argus if that's now Sargeras.

The more I think about it, it really makes sense. Why else would Argus had to be sacrificed if Eredar who stayed joined willingly. Could be that's him lying dormant & recovering.

Wow, I never considered this possibility. Things are getting interesting.

[Friendlyimmolation]

The writing was good, execution was bad. Illidan's tragic fall at the hands of those too ignorant to understand was a great story, one they are dangerously close to fucking up right now if Illidan doesn't get screwed over by the end of Legion.

I cant find a single way the writing for Keal and lady Vashj "OH THEY ARE BAD NOW" was ever good.

[Selastan]

I cant find a single way the writing for Keal and lady Vashj "OH THEY ARE BAD NOW" was ever good.

Kael's betrayal was logical, the guy had no loyalty to Illidan and only followed him because he was the best solution to his people's magic addiction. If Kael had survived and served the Legion long enough to learn about the Void Lords and it's true purpose, he would have joined the Void Lords. Wherever the power lies, Kael and the blood elves would follow. As for Vashj, she and Illidan were in the same boat, since she stayed loyal. We learn WHY we are fighting Illidan and Vashj from Altruis, what was the point in fighting the Burning Legion when you were becoming just as bad? Illidan enslaved Outland, pumped orcs full of MORE demon blood, summoned demons, horded the planet's limited water, and was in general...crazy. Kind of obsessed. His death and resurrection seems to tampered that a bit, but from what I've seen in game and read in the book, Illidan became one of the few JUSTIFIABLY (No magic or corruption) insane characters. From the events of the War of the Ancients to BC, he went through a LOT. Everything he tried to do to help, his brother (who he still loved, despite their history) viewed as evil and PUNISHED him for his sacrifices. So on Outland, Illidan has nothing to do but give in to his visions of the Burning Crusade wiping out world after world. The guy becomes paranoid and desperate. He sacrificed his eyes, his soul, his freedom. He tried to sacrifice Northrend, what was it to sacrifice the people of Outland as well? One world was a small price to pay for stopping the conquest of thousands. Its not right, but he's not wrong. We couldn't let him rule there.

[Funky Kong]

Isn't Sargeras supposed to have a mane of fire and big horns and shit

[Friendlyimmolation]

Kael's betrayal was logical, the guy had no loyalty to Illidan and only followed him because he was the best solution to his people's magic addiction. If Kael had survived and served the Legion long enough to learn about the Void Lords and it's true purpose, he would have joined the Void Lords. Wherever the power lies, Kael and the blood elves would follow. As for Vashj, she and Illidan were in the same boat, since she stayed loyal. We learn WHY we are fighting Illidan and Vashj from Altruis, what was the point in fighting the Burning Legion when you were becoming just as bad? Illidan enslaved Outland, pumped orcs full of MORE demon blood, summoned demons, horded the planet's limited water, and was in general...crazy. Kind of obsessed. His death and resurrection seems to tampered that a bit, but from what I've seen in game and read in the book, Illidan became one of the few JUSTIFIABLY (No magic or corruption) insane characters. From the events of the War of the Ancients to BC, he went through a LOT. Everything he tried to do to help, his brother (who he still loved, despite their history) viewed as evil and PUNISHED him for his sacrifices. So on Outland, Illidan has nothing to do but give in to his visions of the Burning Crusade wiping out world after world. The guy becomes paranoid and desperate. He sacrificed his eyes, his soul, his freedom. He tried to sacrifice Northrend, what was it to sacrifice the people of Outland as well? One world was a small price to pay for stopping the conquest of thousands. Its not right, but he's not wrong. We couldn't let him rule there.

Except That wasnt the case with Kael and Vasj, blizzards reasoning was "they drop epics" the still terrible constructed story was a shoddy attempt to justify it. The kaelthas from Warcraft 3 would have never did what he did in WoW.

[Selastan]

Except That wasnt the case with Kael and Vasj, blizzards reasoning was "they drop epics" the still terrible constructed story was a shoddy attempt to justify it. The kaelthas from Warcraft 3 would have never did what he did in WoW.

No, but people change. After loosing the Sunwell, Kael would do anything to give himself and his people as much magical energy as he could. Nothing was enough. So here comes Kil'Jaedin promising infinite power, Kael would sign right the hell up. Vashj was always loyal to Illidan, being his second-in-command meant she had to go too. The Cenarion Circle witnessed firsthand how she was destroying the already fragile ecosystem.

[gcsmith]

TBC was still in the phase of story writing at the beginning of "Lets give you cool fights"

[cparle87]

Three factions with the Illidari being the third one. That's how it should have went imo

Nah. Rather than go evil, Vashj and her naga and later Illidan, though very reluctantly, allied with Kael, who was undisputedly the leader of their new coalition. They cleaned up Outland, secured it, then worked to find a way back to Azeroth to ask Stormwind to assist them in reclaiming Lordaeron.

- - - Updated - - -

Correct me, but didn’t Kael’thas forces attack playable bloodelves, Horde and Alliance alike? At least in Netherstorm? He probably considered them and Quel’thalas as traitors. and his blood knights wouldn’t need to drain M’uru further if Kil'Jaeden gave them limitless demonic power.

At that point in time there were three factions of blood elves. The overwhelming majority were Horde-loyal blood elves, including the players, who didn't know what was going on in Outland for a while even after they got there. Remember how confused everyone was about Kael bombing the druid camp in Terokkar with the bomb. We didn't know he had turned yet. All they knew was Rommath delivered them M'uru on behalf of Kael who also brought them Illidan's mana sucking techniques. Then you have the Kael's forces who we later find have allied with the Legion. Thirdly are the Scryers who defected from Kael and warned Shattrath what little they knew about what he was up to. But most blood elves in Silvermoon didn't believe that their prince would side with the Legion until he led their forces in attacking the city. Kael considered anyone who stood in the way of him getting power as traitors. Silvermoon would've likely given him M'uru back if he asked for it, but he didn't he just attacked.

[THEORACLE64]

Sargeras' spirit inhabited Argus after WOTA portal destroyed his original body. Blizz has been dropping hints throughout the entire expansion.

-Approaching the Tomb portal as an Alliance during the Broken Shore scenario kills you immediately with the flavor text noting that Sargeras' presence is overwhelming
- Gul'dan later mentions in the Destro Lock artifact chain that the portal to the other side leads to Argus meaning that Sargeras must be somewhere near Argus if the portal leads to it and he is close enough to kill you with his presence
- this is further emphasized in the Nighthold. The entire purpose of the ritual was to place Sargeras' spirit into Illidan meaning that the portal had to be for Sargeras' spirit to enter through. Yet if you pause right at the scene with the portal closing in Gul'dan's death scene you only see a broken fel green planet which is undoubtedly Argus, Sargeras' is nowhere to be seen.
- In the ToS trailer Kil'jaedan angrily emphasizes to Sargeras that he had to sacrifice his world. This could refer to it being fel bathed but could also refer to Sargeras now using it as his personal incubator. Once again, Sargeras is nowhere to be seen in the shot showing Argus which wouldn't make sense given the previous references unless he himself was now Argus.
- This provides the means by which we kill him. As Illidan's original plan to destroy Argus was to open a plethora of portals and closing them to destroy Argus. This is how we beat Sargeras.

TLDR: Sargeras is Argus and we beat him by closing a portal on his ass

tbh. i'd guess that as Sargeras turned back into a soul form after his body was destroyed, so has kind of forced incubated himself into Argus to develop a new Titan form.

[tommyhil622]

I can't help but think if the ritual that Guldan performed in night hold actually succeeded. And Sargeras is currently inside of illidan much like he was in Medivh.

[Kazlofski]

My theory is still that Argus had a titan inside, world soul or however it's called.
After the WOTA portal incident, Sargeras lost his body and asked Kil'jaeden for help, that means sacrificing his own world - world soul titan to let Sargeras possess it.

Sargeras possessing a world soul that wasn't ready to be born by itself yet (Just like Azeroth still isn't ready otherwise it would become a huge titan :P) is why Argus the Unmaker is so small, treat it as a baby titan that well isn't even a baby, was abruptly born too early.
At the cost of a world turning into a titan like this, it probably caused that explosion that destroyed part of Argus and that's why Kil'jaeden says that his sacrifice cost him his own world, it's all destroyed + the legion being there just makes it worse.

I imagine if Azeroth would be fully born, the whole planet becomes the titan and there isn't anything left for anyone to live on, so I imagine that's why being born too soon
makes the planet just partially be destroyed/explode.

Also might explain why his new titan form doesn't resemble him at all, he is merely a soul that captured a completely different titan that was supposed to look like the one we are seeing from the data mining. It's either that or nothing :P

[Harbour]

Or Sargeras is already inside Illidan and Gul'Dan has succeeded. Possessed Illidan talked to KilJaeden through the fire, like possessed Medivh talked to GulDan before Dark Portal through the visions.