Unerring Arrows nerfed from 10% to 4%

[digitalskill987]

I have had a hunter since vanilla but stopped maining him after black temple in bc because i hated always getting the shaft and the fact there has never been a time where i felt all the specs were good, i was looking forward ro melee hunter this xpac but never did it and went demon hunter

[Okatan]

I have had a hunter since vanilla but stopped maining him after black temple in bc because i hated always getting the shaft and the fact there has never been a time where i felt all the specs were good, i was looking forward ro melee hunter this xpac but never did it and went demon hunter

How is this revelant?

[HappyLuckBox]

It's Azor, he pads an immense amount, and his raid team is okay with it, he does majority of add dmg on fights by far. Really not the best idea to see what he does and follow it blindly. He does what he does cause it will get him in his personal situation the most dps. There's a reason why people meme about him padding a lot.

I've killed Mythic Bot, and for our raid team, lashers didn't live over 3 seconds, making being able to hit them with PiS a waste, just wasn't needed. And the movement isn't that high. In p3 you have almost all of lust stand still to burn, then 40seconds of high movement where you can still cast a lot of aimed shots because the movement is so predictable, and then you're back to standing still till it dies because the rest calls kill themselves. Assuming you're one of the 2 even being asked to do it. There are better people to do it, like BM hunters and resto druids.

Again, it all comes down to your raid team and comp, which is why Botanist is one of the "sometimes" ones.

I dont see what he does and follow blindly. I use my own spec and strategies, however, I do like to compare and contrast my logs with other hunters, particularly those who use the meme spec, since I vastly prefer it to the trickshot build. In my opinion, due to movement, the meme spec is superior on m botanist. But we can agree to disagree

[Khrux]

Maybe you or @Khrux can provide more insight for me then, because I find it to be illogical.

First, it uses the false assumption that artifact tuning isn't apart of "general class balance". Considering the reliance specs have on their artifacts, with some passive been moved baseline to artifacts, it's absolutely is part of class balance.

Second, it acknowledges that MM is underperforming in ST but then agrees with the nerf by reasoning of trait balance. Trait balance shouldn't even be considered. You wouldn't give the top dps spec the same increase as the lowest dps spec.

Firstly, this isn't a balance patch. Its a content patch, nobody was suppose to be moving up or down relative to others except the specific people they directly buffed (Ferals) in an additional patch note right before launch. If they were trying to buff Marksman in this patch, you'd be in the same patch note as ferals with "all MM skills now does X% more damage" and you weren't. Everyone would naturally get stronger from the new traits, thats obvious but they were never supposed to shuffle the hierarchy of specs or patch up holes in your classes balance weak spots.(which is what you all seem to be droning on about)

As you can see from the blue posts today/yesterday, 7.2.5 (which myself and others already called out) is the balance patch just like 7.1.5 was, thats where Blizzard will make class changes and balance classes overall.

In a perfect world, all the new traits would be equally powerful. The 4/4 trait would be worth X dps, the 1pt would be worth Y dps and the Golden would be worth Z dps. No class gets a stronger 4/4, 1pt or Golden than another and balance remains consistent to what it was in 7.1.5 so Blizz can balance in 7.2.5 accordingly.

In reality, the 4/4, 1pt and Goldens were not all equal. As the hotfix showed, Frost DK was completely over the top on their Golden and 1pt(both of which nobody had at the time), Warlocks Golden was over the top(which nobody had at the time), MM's 4/4 was over the top(everyone had it at the time) and a few others were weak(Boomkin/Warrior).

Unfortunately MM got a new 4/4 trait almost twice as strong as its closest competitor, it needed to be reigned in. They also reigned in the other outliers(which nobody even had yet) and in the end nobody changes position on the warcraftlogs meters until 7.2.5 when Blizzard decide to balance the classes the way they want to.


Footnote: we know, we know, your 3min cheetah dodge is a shitfest worth zero dps. They obviously need to put additional power into your 4/4 or Golden to account for this(Like Rogues 1pt is a heal!) so maybe thats why you ended up with a super power 4/4, then it gets nerfed by 60%(a bit much imo) but your Golden is still incredibly strong and scales with multiple targets.

[satimy]

Firstly, this isn't a balance patch. Its a content patch, nobody was suppose to be moving up or down relative to others except the specific people they directly buffed (Ferals) in an additional patch note right before launch. If they were trying to buff Marksman in this patch, you'd be in the same patch note as ferals with "all MM skills now does X% more damage" and you weren't. Everyone would naturally get stronger from the new traits, thats obvious but they were never supposed to shuffle the hierarchy of specs or patch up holes in your classes balance weak spots.(which is what you all seem to be droning on about)

As you can see from the blue posts today/yesterday, 7.2.5 (which myself and others already called out) is the balance patch just like 7.1.5 was, thats where Blizzard will make class changes and balance classes overall.

In a perfect world, all the new traits would be equally powerful. The 4/4 trait would be worth X dps, the 1pt would be worth Y dps and the Golden would be worth Z dps. No class gets a stronger 4/4, 1pt or Golden than another and balance remains consistent to what it was in 7.1.5 so Blizz can balance in 7.2.5 accordingly.

In reality, the 4/4, 1pt and Goldens were not all equal. As the hotfix showed, Frost DK was completely over the top on their Golden and 1pt(both of which nobody had at the time), Warlocks Golden was over the top(which nobody had at the time), MM's 4/4 was over the top(everyone had it at the time) and a few others were weak(Boomkin/Warrior).

Unfortunately MM got a new 4/4 trait almost twice as strong as its closest competitor, it needed to be reigned in. They also reigned in the other outliers(which nobody even had yet) and in the end nobody changes position on the warcraftlogs meters until 7.2.5 when Blizzard decide to balance the classes the way they want to.


Footnote: we know, we know, your 3min cheetah dodge is a shitfest worth zero dps. They obviously need to put additional power into your 4/4 or Golden to account for this(Like Rogues 1pt is a heal!) so maybe thats why you ended up with a super power 4/4, then it gets nerfed by 60%(a bit much imo) but your Golden is still incredibly strong and scales with multiple targets.

Most classes didn't get a worthless 3rd trait

[Captain Proton]

Firstly, this isn't a balance patch. Its a content patch, nobody was suppose to be moving up or down relative to others except the specific people they directly buffed (Ferals) in an additional patch note right before launch. If they were trying to buff Marksman in this patch, you'd be in the same patch note as ferals with "all MM skills now does X% more damage" and you weren't. Everyone would naturally get stronger from the new traits, thats obvious but they were never supposed to shuffle the hierarchy of specs or patch up holes in your classes balance weak spots.(which is what you all seem to be droning on about)

As you can see from the blue posts today/yesterday, 7.2.5 (which myself and others already called out) is the balance patch just like 7.1.5 was, thats where Blizzard will make class changes and balance classes overall.

In a perfect world, all the new traits would be equally powerful. The 4/4 trait would be worth X dps, the 1pt would be worth Y dps and the Golden would be worth Z dps. No class gets a stronger 4/4, 1pt or Golden than another and balance remains consistent to what it was in 7.1.5 so Blizz can balance in 7.2.5 accordingly.

In reality, the 4/4, 1pt and Goldens were not all equal. As the hotfix showed, Frost DK was completely over the top on their Golden and 1pt(both of which nobody had at the time), Warlocks Golden was over the top(which nobody had at the time), MM's 4/4 was over the top(everyone had it at the time) and a few others were weak(Boomkin/Warrior).

Unfortunately MM got a new 4/4 trait almost twice as strong as its closest competitor, it needed to be reigned in. They also reigned in the other outliers(which nobody even had yet) and in the end nobody changes position on the warcraftlogs meters until 7.2.5 when Blizzard decide to balance the classes the way they want to.


Footnote: we know, we know, your 3min cheetah dodge is a shitfest worth zero dps. They obviously need to put additional power into your 4/4 or Golden to account for this(Like Rogues 1pt is a heal!) so maybe thats why you ended up with a super power 4/4, then it gets nerfed by 60%(a bit much imo) but your Golden is still incredibly strong and scales with multiple targets.

You completely missed my point and drone on while addressing strawmen. Bravo.

[Emerald Archer]

Most classes didn't get a worthless 3rd trait

No they don't, but most classes also don't have a golden trait as strong as ours, and a 4/4 trait as strong as ours (Yes, after the nerf it is STILL stronger than most peoples 4/4 trait)

[Redseal]

So we got the most powerful trait over anyone. For the 1st time in legion us normal 895ish + ( not 905, 910 ) got something that made us normal, able to not be bottom anymore. be equal with people the same ilvl's as us...
and that was wrong?
Hunters if you recall got a very major nerf when they NUKED Aim shot in what 7.1, there opsy.. sorry.. here is a 10% damage buff, which for those that keep count, still left if I recall AS down like 4-6% overall.
But we get something that the professionals know about from the ( now seems like useless PTR information no one looks at ) and 2 days later take it away. And grind XYZ millions AP for cheetah, really. I hear 7.2.5 is to be the patch that " balance the classes the way they want to" lol.. well.. it was nice to be balanced for 2 days. Not on top, not in the middle, for 2 days able to enjoy just playing.
No it was not over powered. We have been nerfed to the core so many times, not to mention, at the end of WOD, here learn this whole new play style and then switch it back. Come on.. yeah 40% buff seemed about right for what we needed to be equal overall. ( yeah, at the top end quilds maybe it would have been over powered.. wait.. how many of those are there world wide? Can not even get into a +10 again)
WE need ti be fixed.. no one seems to give a rats ass about it, and Blizzard show me the money... they could care less or they would listen to feed back and note, logs, but lol.. they will not even post in their own forums anymore. This is all pretty messed up
So.. up it bu 3% per point and we call it good.. because the 7.2.5 balance the classes the way they want to will be another nerf... you know it..

[munkeyinorbit]

That's it. I'm done. Fuck you Blizzard. We we're starting to do competitive single target damage and now you want to ass rape us even more. It's obvious we're going to be shit this entire expansion aside from aoe fights where fucking melee hunters can beat us most of the time. I'm done with this fucking class until next expansion where we hopefully get a decent rework.

Here's Krosus for 7.2 so far: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...842&dataset=95

Obviously marksman needed a nerf. Fuck off Blizzard.

I'm sorry man, your opinion is invalid. I don't normally reply to people with no badge but you are just being ridiculous. "OH I'M GOING TO QUIT!!!". No you are not. You are going to sit there, take your medicine and continue on in LFR like nothing has changed.

[Nythiz]

I think the nerf is fine. Not for the fact we didn't need the buff, I think everyone is in agreement that we needed buffs more than nerfs (talking 7.1.5).

But I don't think the buff to hunters (or MM more specifically) should come in the form of a single trait that is ridiculously powerful.
Should they have waited until 7.2.5 and then balanced this trait out with buffs on another front? Maybe. It would have given us a nice catchup to other higher dps.
I think they didn't want to risk messing things up big time with all the new variables and stuff though.

The Unerring Arrows and Windburst trait are crazy good; they still are. I'd rather take the "minor" hit now and be first in line for a series of buffs in 7.2.5 before ToS opens up, rather than end up receiving the short end of the stick again in the next patch because we're middle/top dps for a few weeks in Nighthold.

[Deleted]

First i have the right to make announcements when i am annoyed by the class i am playing being repeatedly gutted.
You can avoid whatever you like, including my post but you can't know me enough based on 1 post what to avoid and how to read forums.
After playing years this game as a hunter i am completely aware that i shouldn't expect to be best in ST, AoE, Cleave, Burst and Sustained DPS all at the same time but facts show that atm some classes are ALL OF THE LISTED AND AT THE SAME TIME (or at least can be with a change of few talents)
Where the hunter is neither
Many more classes have FAR FAR better Burst
Many more classes have far better ST
Many more classes have far better Cleave
Many more do much more than a pure dps class that can't do anything else

Like i said last night i felt ok with the dmg and as OP has linked: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...842&dataset=95
one can easily see that even with an OP talent we were still at the middle.

It is slightly frustrating when you invest enough time to farm up 9 legendaries. Doing endless Mythics and AP farms just so a guy that decides to reroll for Nighthold to DH can do better ST and AOE dmg than you in a month

It rly hurts. Sorry that i am complaining. Maybe i am that bad and i need to L2P ... but maybe it's more blizzard's way of ruining up things that is what is wrong with the class and not only me.

P.S. The trait is ok. It had to get nerfed . Yet it is still stronger than many if not all others even the nerfed deadly aim ... lol and we will still have to invest in them all pretty soon anyway. It's just the overall state of things that is pushing me and i guess many others.

It's pushing you because you wanted more damage and now it's still good, you're still viable, but it's lower. Even though you have no idea what is planned for the future nor how the ability may scale going forward, into future patches.

Hunters have excellent single target in survival. Some of the best. Your log even shows this.
Hunters have excellent AOE in MM. Some of the best.
BM has the lowest skill ceiling of any spec. You can have one button do 90% of the work if you wish.
They have an ability to ignore encounter mechanics.
An ability to redirect threat.
They have great CC for groups.
They can bring bloodlust or combat res.
They have excellent target switching.
Good mobility.

Thus, hunter's have no trouble finding groups for any content. Which is the purpose of your DPS, btw. Not winning meters. Completing content.


It's also why Blizzard doesn't reign in the stupid numbers we are currently dealing, healing and having - that runs over their UI completely and is untenable. The game was far more comfortable to read when the values for damage were capping around 1k and our health was at 10k. But for some these numbers need to blend with infinity for them to serve a purpose. A rather, droll expectation of the game is that the numbers climb ridiculously.

I'd sooner they stayed the same and instead we had a new stat each expansion that broke down a resistance that the enemies had and provided resistance against the enemies attacks such that the values remained consistent but still had growth.

Because for some reason, some players can't handle going from 500k dps, down to 500 dps. It messes with them so badly, that you get posts like this, where you go from viable to viable and whine about it. I can understand if the gameplay gets significantly changed (*cough* survival) but this is a non issue, you even know it is a non issue.

[Deleted]

The Unerring Arrows and Windburst trait are crazy good; they still are.

Look at the BM traits if you want to know what crazy good is. And it seems blizz doesn't even look at them. Else they would have been nerfed already.

Hunters have excellent single target in survival. Some of the best. Your log even shows this.
Hunters have excellent AOE in MM. Some of the best.
BM has the lowest skill ceiling of any spec. You can have one button do 90% of the work if you wish.

AP farming and legendaries punish you when switching specs. AP farming won't be a problem in a few weeks, but legendaries still fuck you.

[Emerald Archer]

Look at the BM traits if you want to know what crazy good is. And it seems blizz doesn't even look at them. Else they would have been nerfed already.

Wut. For BM to be viable, and better than MM, you need the shoulders, and if you have the shoulders, their 4/4 trait is pretty shit. The 1/1 trait is eh ok. And the 1/1 golden is very good. So in all, we have it better with new traits.

Well we DID, until people found out the windburst one was bugged, so until that's fixed we have a very strong 4/4 trait, a 0 dps increase 1/1 and a potentially 0 dps golden trait. It depends how much extra effort your tank wants to go to, which they won't. So ST it's pretty much 0.

[Deleted]

I really dont get the nerf either! As far as i could see, for the few logs MM hunters parsed during the 24hours or something before nerf. We were top 10ish. Now, right back to lower midpack!!

[PBitt]

The trait itself was too powerful, sure, but that should have been extremely obvious and that power should have been spread around elsewhere before it went live, not nerfed to oblivion a day later. MM also got it's most powerful traits frontloaded, whereas just about every other spec has more powerful traits coming further, one day was just too soon to tell how anything would actually balance out. Aside from a fourth point in Quickshot there is really no other trait that makes much of an impact from 3/4 to 4/4 throughout the existing traits. And now apparently our golden trait doesn't even fucking work in ideal ST situations and I don't expect that to change so we remain low on ST which is frustrating for a spec that is pretty punishing on ST fights in particular. I don't think being being upper-middle of the pack with exceptional play is an unfair place for MM to be in ST.

[Kashey]

Oh yeah...last gold trait...it can't crit....and tank must move boss so it can hit it lol
4 tics=623.5k dmg

[Deleted]

Oh yeah...last gold trait...it can't crit....and tank must move boss so it can hit it lol
4 tics=623.5k dmg

Wait, so if you use it on lets say Krosus, the Boss will never even get a tick of the dot ? Would deff mean the Trait isnt as good as some ppl say it is.

[Shynzo]

Wait, so if you use it on lets say Krosus, the Boss will never even get a tick of the dot ? Would deff mean the Trait isnt as good as some ppl say it is.

Yeah, Krosus, Star Augur, Helya.... this trait does 0 damage. And every other bosses that tank dont move to trail.

[Deleted]

Yeah, Krosus, Star Augur, Helya.... this trait does 0 damage. And every other bosses that tank dont move to trail.

pity, was really hoping it would at least hit the Target we cast Windburst on WITHOUT the need to move the Target, makes it a pretty pointless Singletarget trait then imo.

[Kashey]

Wait, so if you use it on lets say Krosus, the Boss will never even get a tick of the dot ? Would deff mean the Trait isnt as good as some ppl say it is.

Yep. So i think it useless to put 2 points in these two new traits and put in -cd trueshot and +crit dmg\% aimed