Sorry America, Your Taxes Aren’t High

[Tijuana]

And yet, whenever the subject comes up, the right screams that socialist programs like universal health care means higher taxes... odd that.

Why on earth would you think that is odd? Stuff costs money. If you give people stuff, you have to collect money. What are you on about?

[Kujako]

Why on earth would you think that is odd? Stuff costs money. If you give people stuff, you have to collect money. What are you on about?

So does socialism cause high, or low taxes? Cause you've claimed both in a vary short timeframe.

[Tijuana]

Um, that list shows "socialist" countries below the US. I assume because they actually make their corporations pay taxes. Our corporate tax might be "high" on paper(it isn't), but that's no where near the rate they actually pay.

Or, since we are using the term socialist, we can assume that actual socialism is going on. They get revenue from government ran enterprises. That doesn't show up on your list.

[Wyrt]

Why on earth would you think that is odd? Stuff costs money. If you give people stuff, you have to collect money. What are you on about?

We already pay more per capita for healthcare than many of the countries with universal healthcare. Maybe we should follow one of their models since they seem to be paying less for more.

[Tijuana]

So does socialism cause high, or low taxes? Cause you've claimed both in a vary short timeframe.

You are mistaken. Re-read what I said. I said nothing of the sort.

[Acidbaron]

Top of the list and a lot of it is due to companies structure to avoid paying taxes here quite a few stories about those tax paradise systems.

Another is the social cost what includes healthcare and welfare before people start to argue this is why socialized healthcare is bad it isn't due to that, we had a lot of bad political avenues we went down in the past, what gave people a retirement, full retirement at age 45, my dad has that due to closure of the coal mines than some other companies and so a large debt was build up.

As for unions, i think it doesn't work in the US due to it being split up per state or even less, having large unions that represent more than a select few would do wonders that's how it's done over here.

All in all if your tax as a worker is high, it's generally the corporations paying too little so the common man has to chip in, here's hoping more of those constructs get destroyed eventually.

[Tijuana]

We already pay more per capita for healthcare than many of the countries with universal healthcare. Maybe we should follow one of their models since they seem to be paying less for more.

I agree. I support single payer and single provider over this regulation monstrosity that is completely devoid of any capitalist benefits.

[Acidbaron]

Comparing us to Socialist countries just solidifies our desire to not be like them. Our taxes ARE high, for a non-socialist country. Our corporate tax is just ridiculously high as well. What is the point of taxing the public until they bleed, only to take in less revenue?

Belgium is not socialist.

[araine]

The US had much higher tax on corporations and the economy was doing fine. Then Reagan came along and gave massive tax breaks to the wealthy and raised taxes for the middle class.

The US has never recovered from this and the middle class has been stagnating ever since.

And that is why Donny won the election since he pointed out how the working people and the middle class have been screwed for decades. but his solution is more of hte same trickle down nonsense that created the disaster in the first place. but gotta give donny credit he knows folks are pissed of at the rich and powerful and the system they have in place, which is a first step needed for the revolution to take place down the road

[Acidbaron]

And that is why Donny won the election since he pointed out how the working people and the middle class have been screwed for decades. but his solution is more of hte same trickle down nonsense that created the disaster in the first place. but gotta give donny credit he knows folks are pissed of at the rich and powerful and the system they have in place, which is a first step needed for the revolution to take place down the road

And he installed a cabinet what has no relation to the common working man at all. What the US could use is another Nixon, working class president but than without the paranoid behavior that everyone is out to get him. If they wanted a strong more right leaning republican government but i think all those republicans are all long gone or not edgy enough to get office.

[NED funded]

Among other reasons...

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So does every other nation with Universal Healthcare. We cover literally everyone regardless of pre existing conditions and age etc. Yet the US still pays double.

No, its really all about taxes. Canada gives massives tax breaks to R&D.

Btw I'm ignorong the not so subtle jab at America.

[Tijuana]

Belgium is not socialist.

If you say so.

This first rule of Socialism is that nobody admits it. The only nations that admit being Socialist, are usually Communist, which nobody ever admits either.

[Barnabas]

In numbers no but in feeling like your tax dollars are well spent is an entirely different concept. It's why Americans want to pay less. Some people don't want to pay for 10 proxy wars. Some people don't want to pay for abortions. Some people don't want to pay corporations for their screw ups.

[Heltoray]

See here's the thing. First off all america isnt socialist. So because of that we should have lower taxes than socialist/communist countries. No "free" health care and other BS that's been proven to fail.

So other wealthy western nations are doing it wrong when their citizens dont have to pay their whole life savings when they get seriously ill?
Are you really telling me treating the healthcare system like any other market to squeeze money from is "proven not to fail"?

[Varitok]

No, its really all about taxes. Canada gives massives tax breaks to R&D.

Btw I'm ignorong the not so subtle jab at America.

We lose business to the US all the time and yes it was towards Trump driving away your R&D. Not a jab, a fact. Vancouver is reaping the benefits of the lost tech companies coming over from the US.

[petej0]

So what about the people making the national Average (55k)? You are SOL?

If you want to make that argument then I am all for it. It would have to be subjected to regional cost of living, cuz someone making $50k in NYC is different than someone making $50k in Topeka.

[Acidbaron]

If you say so.

You can only argue that by changing the definition of what a socialist ran country is. I'll educate you a bit more at best you'll find a company like the post, delivery and such where the government is majority share holder, same goes for telephone companies due to infrastructure costs involved, both those markets however are completely liberalized, incase you are one of those who don't know what that means in english and not american it means the market is open for other competitors to compete on it.

You're free to make the case now that Belgium is socialist because we have social programs, i'll simply retort that the US is by that definition as well since you still have public transportation, libraries and a police force.

Now your turn to elaborate why you think Belgium is a socialist country, if you can

[Tijuana]

You can only argue that by changing the definition of what a socialist ran country is. I'll educate you a bit more at best you'll find a company like the post, delivery and such where the government is majority share holder, same goes for telephone companies due to infrastructure costs involved, both those markets however are completely liberalized, incase you are one of those who don't know what that means in english and not american it means the market is open for other competitors to compete on it.

You're free to make the case now that Belgium is socialist because we have social programs, i'll simply retort that the US is by that definition as well since you still have public transportation, libraries and a police force.

Now your turn to elaborate why you think Belgium is a socialist country, if you can

I'm not saying Belgium is socialist because it has social welfare programs, because that has absolutely nothing to do with socialism. If you have government ran businesses, you are a socialist country. Also, the revenue from those businesses does not show up on your list. Therefore, the list is pointless, in every conceivable way.

As far as Belgium is concerned, specifically, I don't really care. This isn't a Belgium thread, so...whatever.

[Jeezy911]

You take your taxed paycheck, leave your taxed home, drive in your taxed vehicle,drive through a toll tax, buy a taxed gallon of milk.

No everything is fine, we have it good.

[Perryn]

If you say so.

This first rule of Socialism is that nobody admits it. The only nations that admit being Socialist, are usually Communist, which nobody ever admits either.

Yes because the rest of the world shares the typical american view that socialist == communist == bad. Clearly.