Will WoW Ever See 13 Million Subs Again?

[Jyggalag]

Name one MMO with more concurrent users than WoW. The genre is dying off because the market is saturated and MMOs released recently have not lived up to expectations.

What are you even talking about? What's that got to do with anything? Just because the best MMO available is a garbage shadow of its former self that doesn't attract 13m players, and the rest have also been shit, doesn't mean MMO's aren't popular, it means no one wants to invest their time in shit games. I'm not playing any MMOs. Looking forward to the day where they make one I want to play.

[Eleccybubb]

What are you even talking about? What's that got to do with anything? Just because the best MMO available is a garbage shadow of its former self that doesn't attract 13m players, and the rest have also been shit, doesn't mean MMO's aren't popular, it means no one wants to invest their time in shit games. I'm not playing any MMOs. Looking forward to the day where they make one I want to play.

Again name an MMO with more players. Oh wait you can't. That's what I thought.

[Jyggalag]

Why do suddenly people think a WoW 2 is a good idea? What can you possibly expect from a sequel of a very successful game, better graphics? 1 or 2 new features and just call it a sequel to WoW? but still with the same old gameplay much like Call of Duty series have been doing for years now?

Never got this either. If it's still ran by the same team, with the same setting, progression, and reward system that turned away their existing 13m players, they'll appeal to the same players who are playing it now. Like every expansion, the hype will inflate the numbers for a few months until people realise how garbage it actually is.

[Eleccybubb]

Never got this either. If it's still ran by the same team, with the same setting, progression, and reward system that turned away their existing 13m players, they'll appeal to the same players who are playing it now. Like every expansion, the hype will inflate the numbers for a few months until people realise how garbage it actually is.

This I agree with. People keep thinking WoW 2 will be a big deal. It'll be the same thing with upto date graphics unless they reinvent the wheel.

[Jyggalag]

Again name an MMO with more players. Oh wait you can't. That's what I thought.

You're right! I can't argue with that factually correct statement, despite never saying I was going to, nor implying that I needed to in order to support my argument, which still stands btw. There are more people playing Dota 2, HS, and LoL. Does that make them better games? No, because the better game is up to individual opinion. Does that make them more popular? yes. The award for the most pointless counterargument goes to...!

In what world does any MMO have to have more players than WoW to make it a shit game? There are no decent alternatives, been around the longest, and has the least p2w elements. Of course it's going to be the best when the rest are fundamentally worse? Does that make it a good game? Of course it fucking doesn't.

Man I don't drop "retard" here often, but you've earned it. Worth the infraction.

[Eleccybubb]

You're right! I can't argue with that factually correct statement, despite never saying I was going to, nor implying that I needed to in order to support my argument which still stands. The award for the most pointless counterargument goes to...!

In what world does any MMO have to have more players than WoW to make it a shit game? There are no decent alternatives, been around the longest, and has the least p2w elements. Of course it's going to be the best when the rest are fundamentally worse? Does that make it a good game? Of course it fucking doesn't.

Man I don't drop "retard" here often, but you've earned it. Worth the infraction.

Well yeah it does. So thanks for proving yourself wrong for me and saving me the hassle.

Bit silly you feel the need to insult someone over a disagreement though.

[Saverem]

Problem with WoW 2 would be that they'd be in direct competition with each other... WoW 2's biggest competitor would be WoW...

If they make another MMO, they'll need to make something unique, because if all they offer is a "reset" with better graphics, it's not going to pull enough people away from WoW. People like me who has a 12 year history of WoW, with 12 years worth of memories, achievements, etc on my characters would never leave WoW to go play a WoW 2 just because it looks prettier.

It's just dumb... Would be like if the owner of a McDonalds franchise decided to open an In N Out across the road from himself...

[Jyggalag]

Well yeah it does. So thanks for proving yourself wrong for me and saving me the hassle.

You are literally the least intelligent person I've ever encountered here. Do yourself a favour and back away from the keyboard before you hurt yourself and/or others.

[Eleccybubb]

You are literally the least intelligent person I've ever encountered here. Do yourself a favour and back away from the keyboard before you hurt yourself and/or others.

My point proven. You have nothing to debate/discuss with so you resort to insults. When you want to have a mature discussion then let me know.

[Nurasu]

A lot of the old community that thrived on this game, changed. People grew older, matured, and started families, received a new job, or had some change in life that drew them away from the game. We've accumulated a lot of the toxicity that exists in the world, and slowly, but surely, the original (veteran) players are beginning to "hide" or quit.

This game will never see 13 million subscribers again, much like how America isn't the greatest country in the world anymore.

Oh please, I still to this day remember my first group experience in Vanilla, there was a group of players heading to RFK and I whispered one of them if they needed a healer. He told me "go fuck yourself and die." This idea that the community was nothing but the best humanity had to offer once upon a time is ridiculous.

[Jyggalag]

My point proven. You have nothing to debate/discuss with so you resort to insults. When you want to have a mature discussion then let me know.

The onus is on you to provide evidence to support your theory that modern day WoW isn't a shit game compared to when it had more than double the amount of subs, not on me to provide evidence to support the opposite, which the sub numbers already do. If everyone's living in cardboard boxes, and you're living in a tin shed, does that make it a good house? No, it makes it better than a cardboard box. Come back to me when you want to actually debate the topic rather than resorting to the same straw man argument.

[Eleccybubb]

Oh please, I still to this day remember my first group experience in Vanilla, there was a group of players heading to RFK and I whispered one of them if they needed a healer. He told me "go fuck yourself and die." This idea that the community was nothing but the best humanity had to offer once upon a time is ridiculous.

Indeed. Community was only slightly better back then. It still had it's toxicity back then as it does today. Thankfully there are a few MMOs and online games with amazing communities.

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The onus is on you to provide evidence to support your theory that modern day WoW isn't a shit game compared to when it had more than double the amount of subs, not on me to provide evidence to support the opposite, which the sub numbers already do. If everyone's living in cardboard boxes, and you're living in a tin shed, does that make it a good house? No, it makes it better than a cardboard box. Come back to me when you want to actually debate the topic rather than resorting to the same straw man argument.

Fact is it's the most subbed MMO on the planet. So obviously it's the most enjoyed. All your statement of "it's bad" is your entirely subjective opinion. Which you are entitled to as long as you understand that it is just an opinion. Which again you are entitled to and I wouldn't say otherwise.

Also I merely said if all you have to throw at me are insults then you have lost the discussion. Which you did earlier. Fact is it has the most subs. Name a game with more or close to the amount of subs WoW has and feel free to prove me wrong. I said I was happy to debate. You were the one throwing insults about and derailing the topic.

Little off topic here but love your Shaman's Transmog. One of my top 3 tier sets for Shaman. Behind Earthfury and the Malevolent set.

[Blackspiral]

Even with the lower subs, WOW still has subscriber numbers most online games would kill to try and get.
That said though, like many touched on already, there is no way we will see 13 Million subs in this game. You may see spikes when a new expansion is released, but the big number days for MMO's are gone now.

[Eleccybubb]

Even with the lower subs, WOW still has subscriber numbers most online games would kill to try and get.
That said though, like many touched on already, there is no way we will see 13 Million subs in this game. You may see spikes when a new expansion is released, but the big number days for MMO's are gone now.

This. People have just moved on from the game. Whether they were dissatisfied with it, started families, moved on to other games or so on fact is that WoW still remains the most popular and most subbed MMO to this day going in 13 years. Impressive feat.

I've moved on personally because other games have piqued my interest. Games that I have been waiting for such as PSO2, Skyforge and FF14. WoW is an amazing MMO and always will be for me but right now I have other games that interest me. Also another reason is I'm starting to go back to consoles since I spend less time on PC gaming these days. But alas that's another topic.

[Jyggalag]

Fact is it's the most subbed MMO on the planet. So obviously it's the most enjoyed.

Please quote where I've stated or suggested otherwise. Oh wait, that's right, you can't. You've lost the argument.

All your statement of "it's bad" is your entirely subjective opinion. Which you are entitled to as long as you understand that it is just an opinion.

I'm impressed you've managed to decipher my very secret opinion on the topic. Please tell me again what relevance this has to WoW having literally less than 50% of the player-base it had in 2010, effectively proving it's not as good of a game as it used to be. Oh wait, that's right, you can't. You've lost the argument twice in the same paragraph.

I shall refer you to the definition of a Straw Man argument at this point, just to show you what you're doing wrong because I feel kinda bad at this stage. I'm not one for making fun at the expense of the disabled.

Also I merely said if all you have to throw at me are insults then you have lost the discussion. Which you did earlier.

If your earlier statement "Well yeah it does" is your idea of a "mature argument", then you've lost at least 3 times by now.

Fact is it has the most subs.

That is most definitely a fact. One which I haven't once disputed, one that is not a factor in this debate, in which I've expressed my opinion that WoW today is a shit game, and by comparing sub numbers today to 7 years ago have proved as much. The onus is still on you to provide any evidence to suggest otherwise. I'll throw in another example since I've just thought of one to help you keep up - Leeds united have one of the biggest cult followings in English football. Does that make them better than Manchester City, one of the most consistent top flight teams in Europe, who can't even fill their stadium with fans? (hint: the answer is 'no')

Name a game with more or close to the amount of subs WoW has and feel free to prove me wrong. I said I was happy to debate. You were the one throwing insults about and derailing the topic.

LOL! I don't need to! This is pathetic now. Your "debating" fuck all. I've never once debated that point. It has NO relevance in the given context. I can feel free to agree and admit that you're right as it's a fact but it still has 0 impact on whether or not at least 7 million players think it's a shit game who at one point did not.

[Eleccybubb]

-snip-

You said the game was trash. Your opinion. Fact is it is the most subbed MMO on the market aka the most popular. Just give up man. You have lost.

If you want to have an actual discussion with me from now then feel free to PM me. As for now I don't see any point in continuing with you. Good day to you.

[barackohmama]

#1 Highly unlikely

#2 Don't think there's anything they could do. Even if they made a whole new game around the same lore, I don't think people would be that interested honestly. Most people interested in mmo's have already tried wow at least briefly, and many have played it for several years. In other words there's not enough people out there who think's an warcraft mmo would be fresh and exciting anymore. The hardcore fans will probably stick around until the game dies, but i'm finding it hard to believe the game will attract new people. I don't think mmo as a concept is dead though. People still want to play together with other players in a game world, it's just that a new mmo needs to have something special like a new technology(VR, game concept, lore or other things) that can attract people that are not interested in the conventional/current mmo-style games.

[Jyggalag]

You said the game was trash. Your opinion. Fact is it is the most subbed MMO on the market aka the most popular. Just give up man. You have lost.

If you want to have an actual discussion with me from now then feel free to PM me. As for now I don't see any point in continuing with you. Good day to you.

Should have maybe considered getting out several posts ago. You've embarrassed yourself now and the damage is already done I'm afraid. I also can't fathom why you insisted on continuing this "discussion". You can't even seem to comprehend, nor address a single comment I've made, yet claim to want to have a "mature", "actual" discussion. Only thing you've done is avoid both and refer to the same straw man in every post.

Before you go, I'll refer you again to my last post where I've literally took a massive shit on every single non-argument you could come up with. Have a good day and wear plenty of reflective clothing and a hard hat. It's a big world out there!

[Eleccybubb]

Source or utter BS

Tom Chilton said 10.3 million mate. You calling Chilton a liar?

[Jaylock]

What are you even talking about? What's that got to do with anything? Just because the best MMO available is a garbage shadow of its former self that doesn't attract 13m players, and the rest have also been shit, doesn't mean MMO's aren't popular, it means no one wants to invest their time in shit games. I'm not playing any MMOs. Looking forward to the day where they make one I want to play.

Oh you mean an mmo where you get flying and there are buttons on the wall of a boss room that says "press for free loot" and the boss is killed and you get free raid gear?

Have fun in your fantasy fantasy world.

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Should have maybe considered getting out several posts ago. You've embarrassed yourself now and the damage is already done I'm afraid. I also can't fathom why you insisted on continuing this "discussion". You can't even seem to comprehend, nor address a single comment I've made, yet claim to want to have a "mature", "actual" discussion. Only thing you've done is avoid both and refer to the same straw man in every post.

Before you go, I'll refer you again to my last post where I've literally took a massive shit on every single non-argument you could come up with. Have a good day and wear plenty of reflective clothing and a hard hat. It's a big world out there!

Also, why are you here bashing WoW when you obviously still play it. Your signature is proof.