Brexit: UK must abandon 'fairy tale' ideas, says Germany's Europe minister

[Deleted]

what actual fact is that ? maybe I missed it, i tend to watch a lot of news outlets but maybe i did catch it.
Hope you aren't using PVV and our new alt right as a "clear majority" here.

Everyones an alt right to a lefty. Fact remains that they want to hold a referendum, and every pro european party doesnt.

[Deleted]

Again, id say that substantially growing your seats in parliament is a win. Also, the vote was on many many other things than just leaving the euro (i'd say due to his polarising stances this definetly works against him) .. One more reason to put it to an actual vote.. I mean, if - as you say a majority doesnt want to then theres nothing to worry about, right? Judging by every dutch referendum on europe however, aswell as pollings both in newspapers and other sources i think its atleast close and imrtant enough to vote about it.

Because referenda about other things is totally the same as a referendum about leaving the EU. /facepalm
And yea, if you want to call this a win then you could also call it a win when you do not step in dog po.

[Deleted]

We can only hope Le Pen wins, so we can finally get rid of this shitshow called EU.

[Arunu]

Everyones an alt right to a lefty. Fact remains that they want to hold a referendum, and every pro european party doesnt.

I'm not that much of a leftie to European standards but ok. more center right.
so that means just the PVV then, hardly a majority. the new alt right is meaningless in political power.
voting against the Ukraine deal doesn't mean we want out of Europe.

It will screw us over much harder than Britain being a trade and service based economy.

[Kalis]

Really?

That was what you wanted?

So you wish death on your political oponents if they do not agree with you do you?

Also work on your wikifoo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Roth_(politician)

How did you manage to read that line, then read the last line and not realise I was taking the piss?

Why would anyone care about your general elections and and suddenly carter to your delusions because of those?
It is not like this is something new that only came up after your politicans suddenly decided to have snap elections.

Why would anyone care about any elections? Why should Russia not interfere in them as they see fit? I presume that nobody at all is bothered by Russia interfering in elections of other nations. Oh wait, they are. Hmm...it seems as if people are not too keen on outside interference in elections.

So whenever the UK decides to have "elections" all the world must stop whatever they are doing and silently wait for them to be done again?

Foreign politicians should not interfere in UK General Elections, just as British politicians should not interfere in the German elections, though there is absolutely no reason not to do that now.

If Putin openly comments on the upcoming German elections then that is expected, what they would complain about is covertly influencing it.

If anybody from the party of that politician complains, then they are hypocrites, Putin and every other foreign politician has free reign now to go to town on them and aid their opponents.

I didn't see any mention of May in that German quote either, so then you are reading something into his owrds that is not there?

He literally said "the British Government", and that is led by the Prime Minister. Or are you claiming that the British Government is not a direct reference to the British Government?

Why should the EU give a fuck? I mean, you have every right to be outraged about this "interference", but why should any of the remaining 27 care?

So you are fine with countries interfering in the Austrian elections then. Note that is not a question, it is a statement, you are saying it is perfectly fine for other nations to interfere in your elections.

Yet you're basically doing the same thing. Living in Malta and trying to be authoritative or what is best for Brits.

I am British, I pay taxes to Britain, I get a vote in British elections. I am also not a politician.

[Lodreh]

Some people really hate democracy.

Let's be honest here... everyone likes the idea of democracy until the majority swings the opposite way. At that point you start to question why X has any say over your life when X belongs to group Y and you belong to group Z. Y can't possibly know anything about Z so their opinion doesn't matter. Then the whole system breaks apart with Y looking after Y and Z looking after Z.

[Mayhem]

So you are fine with countries interfering in the Austrian elections then. Note that is not a question, it is a statement, you are saying it is perfectly fine for other nations to interfere in your elections.

That is not what i'm saying, not even close, how did you come to that conclusion?

Your lot also tweet and talk while other countries have elections, it's a bit hypocritical to be suddenly outraged about something that happened for years and was done by your own politicians.

[Kalis]

That is not what i'm saying, not even close, how did you come to that conclusion?

Your lot also tweet and talk while other countries have elections, it's a bit hypocritical to be suddenly outraged about something that happened for years and was done by your own politicians.

You said the EU should not give a fuck if foreign politicians interfere in the elections of an EU country.

[bufferunderrun]

Everyones an alt right to a lefty. Fact remains that they want to hold a referendum, and every pro european party doesnt.

because referendum on thing like that are always bound to how popular something is at the moment, few year ago a referendum on EU would have been a 60% pro victory; then let me ask this: if in a few year the UK perception of the eu regain support( lets say in 2026 a poll show that 70% UK citizens want to get back in the EU) did you think will be correct to bring a new referendum to get back inside?

[Mayhem]

You said the EU should not give a fuck if foreign politicians interfere in the elections of an EU country.

Still not what i said, but you're getting closer. However what i said was you have every right to be outraged and that this isn't something new. Are you going to hold british politicians that interfered in foreign elections accountable ?

[Xarkan]

How did you manage to read that line, then read the last line and not realise I was taking the piss?

Because more and more posters on these forums have been expressing death wishes on politicians left and right lately probably... Also possibly because you have been increasingly hostile towards anything EU to the extent that lately (last year or couple of years) you almost make Farage sounds like an EU fanboi

[Karon]

All Britain has to do is spend some money in Hungary and Poland to help them break the EU from the inside. Then the Germans won't be able to threaten them like this.

That leaves one of the economically strongest countries in the world without the dead meat like greece. Without the EU restraining us we could really threaten the rest of europe. It's just their luck that we are not the same germany we where 80 years ago.

[padie]

How did you manage to read that line, then read the last line and not realise I was taking the piss?



Why would anyone care about any elections? Why should Russia not interfere in them as they see fit? I presume that nobody at all is bothered by Russia interfering in elections of other nations. Oh wait, they are. Hmm...it seems as if people are not too keen on outside interference in elections.



Foreign politicians should not interfere in UK General Elections, just as British politicians should not interfere in the German elections, though there is absolutely no reason not to do that now.



If anybody from the party of that politician complains, then they are hypocrites, Putin and every other foreign politician has free reign now to go to town on them and aid their opponents.



He literally said "the British Government", and that is led by the Prime Minister. Or are you claiming that the British Government is not a direct reference to the British Government?



So you are fine with countries interfering in the Austrian elections then. Note that is not a question, it is a statement, you are saying it is perfectly fine for other nations to interfere in your elections.



I am British, I pay taxes to Britain, I get a vote in British elections. I am also not a politician.

I'm not 100% sure what you are saying. Anything ever published could be considered interfering with the elections...

Merkel tweeting she's going fishing could be called interfering... And since at any given time there is always an election about to happen we should all just stop with everything ?

Why would the British people care/listen to anything politicians from other countries say? When you voted for Brexit it was very clear you don't.

[Kalis]

Still not what i said, but you're getting closer. However what i said was you have every right to be outraged and that this isn't something new. Are you going to hold british politicians that interfered in foreign elections accountable ?

I think that British politicians who interfere in foreign elections should be censored, yes. They should never talk about policy that one side in the election is fighting on if our nation is involved, nor indicate a preference, as that would be outside interference.

And you did ask why the EU should give a fuck about foreign interference in the elections of an EU country, you presumably forgot that the UK is still an EU country, so I am using your own words to say that you do not think the EU should give a fuck about foreign interference in an EU election.

[Cybran]

That leaves one of the economically strongest countries in the world without the dead meat like greece. Without the EU restraining us we could really threaten the rest of europe. It's just their luck that we are not the same germany we where 80 years ago.

Without the Euro your currency would double in value, your exports would shrivel like berlusconi's dick at the mere sight of Merkel. As the export's shrink you would become as irrelevant as Poland.

[Xarkan]

Without the Euro your currency would double in value, your exports would shrivel like berlusconi's dick at the mere sight of Merkel. As the export's shrink you would become as irrelevant as Poland.

And as Germanys economy fell world markets would shrink and everyone would suffer and you'd smile as Bulgaria went further down financially into a deep black hole?

[Kalis]

Because more and more posters on these forums have been expressing death wishes on politicians left and right lately probably... Also possibly because you have been increasingly hostile towards anything EU to the extent that lately (last year or couple of years) you almost make Farage sounds like an EU fanboi

Hostile comments toward the EU like this?

I hope the EU reforms, the trade aspect is a decent idea, but the political union is a step too far. It is clear that some nations want to become a single state and others do not. Germany, Austria and Holland should merge if they want to, but do not try and push everybody into a shitty merger, otherwise the whole thing will collapse in acrimony.

They need to take a step back and actually see what people want, not what EU politicians want...

Or perhaps this?

...the EU has some good things going for it and I hope it can find a set of solutions that suit everybody, as the one size fits all approach is dumb...

They are not "hostile", I have always said the EU should reform as the basic idea is good, but the implementation is poor.

I'm not 100% sure what you are saying. Anything ever published could be considered interfering with the elections...

Merkel tweeting she's going fishing could be called interfering... And since at any given time there is always an election about to happen we should all just stop with everything ?

Why would the British people care/listen to anything politicians from other countries say? When you voted for Brexit it was very clear you don't.

Explain in full detail how Merkel saying she is going fishing could be construed as interfering in a UK General Election, then compare it to a comment that literally mentions the British Government.

[Mayhem]

I think that British politicians who interfere in foreign elections should be censored, yes. They should never talk about policy that one side in the election is fighting on if our nation is involved, nor indicate a preference, as that would be outside interference.

And you did ask why the EU should give a fuck about foreign interference in the elections of an EU country, you presumably forgot that the UK is still an EU country, so I am using your own words to say that you do not think the EU should give a fuck about foreign interference in an EU election.

Since this is a very special occasion and the UK seemed to not give a fuck if their politicians interfered in foreign elections i don't see why suddenly the EU should care. That doesn't mean i'm ok with it. So since your politicians did this as well in the past that means going by your own words there are no reasons to not do that to you too.

[padie]

Hostile comments toward the EU like this?



Or perhaps this?



They are not "hostile", I have always said the EU should reform as the basic idea is good, but the implementation is poor.



Explain in full detail how Merkel saying she is going fishing could be construed as interfering in a UK General Election, then compare it to a comment that literally mentions the British Government.

It doesn't , that was my point.
The whole EU tried when you voted for brexit. They tried for weeks. Every member of the EU.


You don't care what politicians outside the UK say, nor should you.
So you saying the Eu should stop interfering is a "silly" statement. They can't interfere.

[Kalis]

Since this is a very special occasion and the UK seemed to not give a fuck if their politicians interfered in foreign elections i don't see why suddenly the EU should care. That doesn't mean i'm ok with it. So since your politicians did this as well in the past that means going by your own words there are no reasons to not do that to you too.

The UK does care if our politicians interfere in foreign elections, it is typical for any state you are allied with to keep out of their elections. You not knowing that is your problem.

- - - Updated - - -

It doesn't , that was my point.
The whole EU tried when you voted for brexit. They tried for weeks. Every member of the EU.


You don't care what politicians outside the UK say, nor should you.

So you think it is acceptable for foreign polticians to interfere in elections then? Most people are not okay with it, hence the fuss over Putin.