Highkeeper VS Prime Designate

[MechaCThun]

Just trying to understand the difference between these two titles.

Both are given to titan-forged Keepers but I find it hard to distinguish which one implies leadership over the titan-forged OR distinguishes the "strength" level.

If I remember correctly, Odyn was first selected as the "prime designate" all the way back during the war against the Black Empire and over time Loken did his manipulations to steal the title.

However, from what I've read is that Ra was always going by "Highkeeper" ever since the Pantheon empowered the Keepers. And also, Ra and Odyn are the only 2 blessed by Aman'Thul.

Was just seeing if any of you could enlighten me as to why Ra isn't the actual leader of the Keepers?

[Aucald]

Insofar as I understand it, "Highkeeper" is less an honorific and more a role or even a class of being - it doesn't imply leadership, per se; but perhaps more along the lines of a specialization or specific structure of Keeper lifeform. Prime Designate is an honorific and signifies leadership or command over the forces of the Keepers. Odyn was awarded the title for his distinction in the wars with the Old Gods and Elemental Lords, and it was usurped by Loken on the occasion of Odyn's imprisonment in the Halls of Valor by Helya.

[Lupinemancer]

I wonder just what kind of powers those two have?
We do know the rest, but not what Odyn and Ra can do.

[Dalheim]

Didnt Ra walk around the Titan cities and checked up at the Forges (or whatever) to make sure it was all working? Maybe a more literal take on the word ''keeper.''

[Mehrunes]

To paraphrase the greatest mind this forum has ever seen: you're confusing "Highkeeper" with "Prime Designate". I can't help you with your expectations, unfortunately; I can only advise you seek the assistance of a confidant or therapist depending on the severity of your disappointment.

In all seriousness, think of it this way. Highkeeper is to Keepers what crown prince is to princes. It's a more important title, but in the end they are in the same category and normal princes aren't subjects of the crown prince. We know for a fact that Prime Designate was put in place to lead the Titanforged (which the Keepers are as well), so it'd be the king in this comparison. Judging by the case of Loken (though then again it was rather special circumstances) the Highkeeper isn't a heir apparent like a crown prince though. A second-in-command is likely though. Especially since Ra-den is the only Keeper Loken was afraid of when he was committing his coup.

[micwini]

I thought Azeroth was the "prime designate" as in "MOST IMPORTANT TARGET", and highkeeper was just a titan title.

[Kralljin]

Highkeeper possibly refers to the fact that Ra-den was the Master of Elemental spirits banished to the Elemental Plane the Leader of the Titanforged forces known as Mogu & Tol'vir.

Also possible that Ra-den was supposed to be "leader" of the Keeper Forces, yet Odyn was promoted over Ra-den due his...valorous actions against Yogg-saron.

Didnt Ra walk around the Titan cities and checked up at the Forges (or whatever) to make sure it was all working? M

Ra-den was the only keeper that went South, any other keeper stayed in the north around Ulduar (or the northern reaches of Azeroth).

[Aucald]

I thought Azeroth was the "prime designate" as in "MOST IMPORTANT TARGET", and highkeeper was just a titan title.

Prime Designate was a title/honorific granted first to Odyn, then stolen by Loken later when he attempted to hide his corruption from the Pantheon out of fear. Previous passive-aggressive claptrap aside, what the title "Highkeeper" means is pretty nebulous - it's a distinction above and beyond Keeper, but it apparently didn't grant temporal power to Ra over the other Keepers. Highkeeper Ra was special in some sense, but what that implies is left open to speculation. Both he and Odyn were the only Keepers empowered by Aman'thul, the Highfather of the Pantheon (and perhaps Highkeeper is meant to parallel Aman'thul's role as Highfather in some sense).

[micwini]

Prime Designate was a title/honorific granted first to Odyn, then stolen by Loken later when he attempted to hide his corruption from the Pantheon out of fear. Previous passive-aggressive claptrap aside, what the title "Highkeeper" means is pretty nebulous - it's a distinction above and beyond Keeper, but it apparently didn't grant temporal power to Ra over the other Keepers. Highkeeper Ra was special in some sense, but what that implies is left open to speculation. Both he and Odyn were the only Keepers empowered by Aman'thul, the Highfather of the Pantheon (and perhaps Highkeeper is meant to parallel Aman'thul's role as Highfather in some sense).

TL;DR:
Highkeeper: Boss of all keepers?
Prime designate: Most powerful titanic being on Azeroth?

[Aucald]

TL;DR Highkeeper: Boss of all keepers
Prime designate: Most powerful titanic being on Azeroth?

I think the only technical benefit or result of being Prime Designate was a connection to the Algalon failsafe - tripped when Loken (who had somehow usurped the title) was killed in the Halls of Lightning. Not sure how either title relates insofar as relative power goes, I don't think I would say Odyn is the most powerful Titanic being on Azeroth (and Loken definitely not). "Highkeeper" might've been a function of Ra's creation of the Titanforged Mogu as well as installing the Forges used to create the Earthen, Vrykul, and other beings - his charge may have been the creation of Titanforged entities thus effectively being their "father" in the proverbial sense.

[MechaCThun]

TL;DR:
Highkeeper: Boss of all keepers?
Prime designate: Most powerful titanic being on Azeroth?

On that basis then Odyn would have been titled "Highkeeper" but the lore since Legion has designated him as the original "Prime Designate" who even had the ability to call all the other titanic Keepers together via some "oathbound call" with a horn.

Further I've noticed the similarities of "powers over the storm" between Odyn and Ra, since both are considered "storm lords" but then you even have Thorim being known as a "storm lord" with power enough to render a whole continent barren if he was ever angered enough.

I do not believe Blizzard intended to have Ra and Odyn share similarities over power and stature within the Keepers, however, I would wager to believe that Ra will end up being distinguished as probably the most powerful.

[Aquamonkey]

TFW you next in line, but get passed over for promotion.

[Wildmoon]

Tyr was the greatest warrior of all titian-forged. All aesirs have power over the storm.

[Deleted]

My take on it is that originally Ra was the leader of the keepers, hence highkeeper.

But then after the war against the old gods, Odyn got promoted, but Ra was allowed to keep his title.

[Mormolyce]

Vs giant octopus?

[MikeBogina]

Prime Designate is what you are, by the Titans. But when speaking to lesser beings, they call you Highkeeper.

Look at it like a company, or a fastfood place. Your boss might call you the shift leader, but you want your peons to call you a manager.

So Odyn is and always will be Prime Designate, but others can take up the title of Highkeeper, cause peons/lesser races don't know any better.

[Aucald]

I'd love to at some point know what exactly Ra's relation is to the titanforged we unceremoniously slaughtered in the Halls of Origination. I'd assume they were titanforged at the level of Helya (so direct servants to the Keepers).

That would be my guess. Lower level functionaries whose purpose was entirely bound to the Halls of Origination and its various functions. Setesh, Rajh, Ammunae, and Isiset struck me more as devices than actual individuals in their way - they existed to embody Shadow, Light, Nature, and the Arcane respectively and little else.

[Andonais]

Doesn't Ra watch over the elemental planes while everything else was under Odyn maybe?

[Aucald]

Doesn't Ra watch over the elemental planes while everything else was under Odyn maybe?

Ra and Helya actually created the Elemental Plane from nothing to act as the prisons for the Elemental Lords who served the Old Gods. The territories he was charged with overseeing were "the southern regions of Azeroth that would later be known as Pandaria, Uldum and Ahn'Qiraj." His "Highkeeper" designation is still kind of nebulous and not directly defined anywhere I know of, even in "Chronicle Vol. 1."

[TheFirstOnes]

Odyn is the leader.

Tyr is the mightiest.