Guild recruiters, please never do this.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

What you're describing is likely far more rare than what the guild I was in did. I know some guilds still do something similar but if it's a guild worth its salt they'll at least mention it somewhere either in the guild charter or in the application itself. (For example, the guild charter would say, "If you've read this, the special key word is banana and this is on the application.") What you're upset about is something far less common (and hell, might even specific to this one guild) so it doesn't make much sense (to me) for you to be as invested in what happened.

I didn't mean to make it off to seem like lots of people do this, to be frank, I didn't see any other guilds do this, but I heard similar stories of guilds doing it and was just trying to draw attention to people who might think of doing it.

Often times when something negative is spoken about, especially when you seem invested in it, people tend to think it's a big problem. This one isn't and it's rare, but it happens.

I'm invested because a somewhat long time ago, I did this too IRL and I lost so much because of it, trying to be smart gave me some opportunities, but made me miss on many more.

[StationaryHawk]

Perhaps bad wording, my post was more of a rant, but I did offer a solution and explained the situation briefly.

There's nothing I can realistically do, honestly, to change someone's views, but just hope that they'll see this and think again.

I generally find that not opening by bloating your own ego and belittling all those with views that oppose yours helps to encourage people not to brush your advice under the rug. And expanding your vocabulary beyond "circle jerk" can only improve your odds of being taken seriously.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but you're really not giving people much reason to agree with your perspective.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

I generally find that not opening by bloating your own ego and belittling all those with views that oppose yours helps to encourage people not to brush your advice under the rug. And expanding your vocabulary beyond "circle jerk" can only improve your odds of being taken seriously.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but you're really not giving people much reason to agree with your perspective.

Stop it.

You are sad because I disagreed with you and now you put words into my mouth. You got an emotional trigger set off, as does every human, to someone disagreeing with you.

Every single offensive reply I got, I replied as civilized as possible. Some guy said:

"
No you are not. You cannot even pass a simple retard check and you get angry over little things. I would pass on you in my LFR group. Who needs some bad that flies off the handle when the realise that THEY fucked up. I am glad that the guild who "did this to you" avoided the train wreck that you would inevitably be. Wow "...I wanted to see what kind of a circle jerk...". Just wow.
"

To which I responded "Uhm, good luck to you."

Nowhere in my last replies (besides the reponses to toxic idiots) was I even remotely aggressive or passive aggressive, except the initial post where I spoke about circle-jerks.

Because circle-jerks is what humans do, it's what breeds corruption is what stops you from growing, not accepting outside views due to "shit yea, we know better and my biases are affirmed by these who agree with me". It's a wonderful thing if kept in check, but it almost never is.

So ofcourse I'll say it.

I only met a guild that didn't have this phenomenon and they were very bright people. They too spoke of this and understood that just because you're in a group, it doesn't mean you should be a sheep and jerk each other off, which I really liked, but for the average Joe, you need confirmation and warmth from others to stay alive.

I perhaps chose the wrong way to put it. Why would I want to genuinely help a bunch of idiots who don't know any better? It's their jungle, they do whatever, my goal is to, for these who want, help them understand that their decision of not putting this shit up is a good one and I applaud them and to these who do it, to shame them.

So while I do hope to influence, I'm more of a, if you listen to my reasoning and can see what I mean, good, if not, that's also good. "Help" wasn't exactly the word to coin this.

I only write because, while most replies I read often makes me wonder why I even talk to others, there's sometimes a good suggestion or a good reply that sparks thinking in my mind, so, while jesus, man, can you not be a kid with "you hurt me, I hurt you", I'm thankful for the talk.

But I get you, love to blast some toxic shit's ass into oblivion, everytime. I blocked 3 people in this thread who went harambe. So, you'll see me being close to ghetto when it comes to toxic idiots. Never sorry for telling an uneducated brat that perhaps he shouldn't splurge his erection on a forum post.

[Saybel]

now you put words into my mouth

You are sad because I disagreed with you

You got an emotional trigger set off

lul

OP I'm pretty sure people aren't arguing with you specifically because of the content of your posts, but rather your holier-then-thou attitude. Your posts come across as very condescending, maybe turn it down a bit.

[StationaryHawk]

lul

OP I'm pretty sure people aren't arguing with you specifically because of the content of your posts, but rather your holier-then-thou attitude. Your posts come across as very condescending, maybe turn it down a bit.

It could stand to be brought down a notch or two for sure.

Best of luck to you OP.

[babalou1]

I strongly dislike "tests" like this during the application process and generally wont apply to guilds that do this. Even casual ones.

However, I also think that they dodged a bullet with this particular applicant

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

lul

OP I'm pretty sure people aren't arguing with you specifically because of the content of your posts, but rather your holier-then-thou attitude. Your posts come across as very condescending, maybe turn it down a bit.

Oh, that's a trained set. It served me well, actually, in filtering out people who get easily offended or care about appearances from my life and for me, it's worked out. It took me a while to develop this type of interaction.

Also, I use "I" a lot or refer to myself a lot.

Why you exactly think this is because:

(1) I express and let others know of how I "saw" through their actions.

(2) I mainly don't express emotion trough my writing, due to saving space, given my posts are usually long.

(3) I express an alledgedly deeper understanding

This reply itself has it the 3 points too, now your opinion is even more founded.

You feel this way because of our innate need to feel important, when someone else takes the spotlight or seems like they put it on themselves, others feel threatened and not okay.

While they are motivational writers, Dale Carnegie in his "Win Friends & Influence" and Napoleon Hill in his "Think and Grow Rich" speak of this as being the one most important thing to interaction.

Nobody likes the feeling of others being above them, even if untrue, therefore, you drag them down.

Naturally, I don't have that. If you think yourself smart, without hurting others, good for you mate, tell me more.

You're the result of millions of evolution. Act like it. (Not you, but generally people who respond to these small, childish outside inputs.). Your goal in life is to make this world a better place and make sure you did right by nature and those around you.

Thank you for the talk. Boy this derailed.

Hello.

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I strongly dislike "tests" like this during the application process and generally wont apply to guilds that do this. Even casual ones.

However, I also think that they dodged a bullet with this particular applicant

I've been to three guilds in my entire life.

Even the one I left recently had members asking me why and adding me as friend. Never ever have I created drama or even spoke bad of anyone, don't really speak too much and whenever there's need of help, I'm there. I even passed on loot for others to get it.

I don't think they "dodged" any bullet.

Now then, not to hurt you, but for you to be influenced by someone's willigness to call bullshit on and bring to the light the reality of how we're still pretty much monkeys that have their ideas confirmed by others, rather than facts, that's on you, mate. They do teach logical paradigms in like 7-8th grade. I wonder why many people skipped them.

I love me a good discussion about regular things, such as this, but as long as I'm respectful and not throwing swear words around, that's up to you to really look inside and see if having a skewed opinion just because someone's personality might be too straight-forward is really a way to live life.

[Halicia]

We use the same thing in my guild. Its a very quick & simple way to test for red flags. Not even for people's attention to detail, but in how they handle getting caught. It's always a huge relief to me when people explode over something so minor as this, and reassures me that "things are working as intended".

[Deleted]

Telling an app they're fucking terrible is more offensive (and more importantly, time consuming) than simply ignoring them.

Oh, that's just chickenshit, man. "Telling a girl which I don't want to see anymore, that I don't like her, is just more offensive and time-consuming than simply ignoring them."

Yeah, or you could just... you know... tell them politely that they aren't a good fit. Or that they are just not up to the standards the guild is looking for, but good luck finding another guild. You know, like actual companies, the thing you elitist guilds are trying to emulate, are doing. They have the decency to send you a letter. But yeah, writing one sentence is asking too much. That just would take too long.

What an excuse.

And it's not even related to what I said in the post you quoted. The point is that the whole method isn't even doing anything for you, when the deciding factor is whether the application was good or not.

[Moozart]

Edit: Seems some people didn't understand. The problem is that this is on the application page, as a hidden thing, that is basically just LUCK if you see it. If you want people to confirm they read the rules, put it on the rules page, in the middle and then ask them there to put it randomly on the app, so you know they read rules. This is just randomness you're asking for and is simply idiotical.

I applied to a guild, as with every guild, I go through their roster, their rules and generally to see what kind of circlejerk is going on (because there's always one).


So I decide to hop in and have a chat with the officers. All good and I talk to them exactly about their rules, which I had by my left.

Writing my application and hit submit. Silence after 2 weeks, ofcourse it was a no, but felt like I needed to ask.

The answer is, apparently I missed a "hidden text" that says "Remove to show you read rules".

I know, starting out good. Here's how it look looks: http://prntscr.com/f7jqa5

The text is innoculous and is right next to a captcha and looks totally different from forms, without any form of "hey, I'm here", therefore, as someone that works in tech and had even contributed to some versions of captcha, I say, after seeing it "what? am I to be punished 'cause of retarded design? there's a 50/50 chance you'd see it for me."

Let's assume that for most people, it's visible, even so...

They were trying to be smart, witty, they think of themselves as intelligent when they do this, this method yields and shows absolutely nothing.

Apple, Google & other companies have used this way in the past and realized how simply idiotical these are.

Please, if you're a fucking casual guild, don't make people fill long forms (1) and don't put any (2) unecessary obstacles. All you really care about is numbers. I understand the need to yaddy-yadda about personality and stuff, but it's just "this guy doesn't seem like an asshole, let's probably accept him into our inner circlejerk, since we're still animals bound by antique traits that we no longer need".

If you really DO care about people reading rules, which you shouldn't, unless you're a very top high-end guild is add a keyword and ask people on the same page to add it to their application somewhere, it's the only way to make sure rules were read, which by the way, for most guilds, they're obnoxious, stupidly long and all the same.

They'd lost a 9/10 + 10/10M player that not only he was helpful towards everyone and always showed up, but engaged in tactics and was well-rounded.

Ofcourse I went to obliterate the officers' asses. Imagine how they are on Discord, jerking each other off to the thought of how sweet that system is.

It hit personally, because I had someone that should've recruited for me do this EXACT thing, in a company, he got fired under the spot, that same second I found out. This is extremely stupid and it made me rage to the sky and back, because it comes from a desire to be acknowledged, which shows a rotten personality.

The "Aha, see, I got you? " line.

All in all, I'm so happy I didn't get accepted and would I have seen it back then, the site and the guild would've been blocked.

Look, I understand most people will disagree with me and see this as a good idea, but please, for the love of all that's good, these things show nothing and experienced interviewers, when they want to see certain traits in someone, they employ methologies that have certain hit-points, not just a global one, don't miss on people that are actually good.

You missed it, that is on you not on them. Want to know who didn't miss it? All of their current raiders.

[xGLxAnubis]

You're being ridiculous. He's not good enough for the guild because he missed one subtle line right above a captcha? Yeah, keep him out of the guild. No big loss for them. Not like that line could've been missed by accident by someone who had actually read the rules.

It's weeding out people with lower attention to detail. Trust me, most Mythic raid teams don't want those people. Is the system perfect? Unlikely. But it weeds out more people than it omits on accident, guaranteed.

[Deleted]

It's weeding out people with lower attention to detail.

No, it's weeding out no one because the application decides anyway. If the application is good but the test is failed, the application is accepted. If the application is bad but the test is failed, the application is rejected.... THEN WHY DO THE TEST? How do you not see that that makes no sense?

[xGLxAnubis]

As per one of the officer's line, they're interested to see if people read rules.

They're not even close to high-end, not even remotely close.

As for its purpose being attention to detail, I couldn't say exactly how this helps you decide that.

I didn't say they're sad they "lost" me, which they didn't. It's their right to deny me as it is my right to speak, on an anonymous note, out of respect for their players.

I am 10/10M on my other main and 9/10M on my other one. It would've been a somewhat down-grade for me to apply, when I could've just showed my 10/10 char and get into any guild, but I liked their players, numbers and such, so then, by no means it affected me with a "how can they deny me? I'm so good", lots of fish in the sea, but it just seemd super dumb.

Oh. My. God. Can I just say, right off the bat. Respect. A mature and thought out post in reply to someone who disagreed with you. Props man, for real. I tip my hat to you good sir.

OT: Again, from my experience, it's rarely ONE thing. We used a slew of techniques in our application process. If someone missed the "GOTCHA!" task, that was simply strike one. I don't know this guild and everything else they do, but I ASSUME that you didn't simply have a perfect application but missed this one thing. Could be wrong, of course. They might be THAT pedantic, but my experience leads me to believe otherwise.

I think the other thing to consider here; if that's their attitude and you disagree with it, do you REALLY want to be in that guild anyhow?

- - - Updated - - -

No, it's weeding out no one because the application decides anyway. If the application is good but the test is failed, the application is accepted. If the application is bad but the test is failed, the application is rejected.... THEN WHY DO THE TEST? How do you not see that that makes no sense?

Because the test is PART of the application being good or bad. Failed test? Strike one. Fail other things? More strikes. Until eventually rejected.

[Deleted]

You missed it, that is on you not on them. Want to know who didn't miss it? All of their current raiders.

Yeah, you know what, I'm gonna run my own guild and put in a line right at the end before a capture that says that the applicant must face a trivia quiz over discord exactly 24 hours after he applied. If he fails to show up on time because he overlooked that line, he is not good enough for our guild. STOP WASTING OUR TIME.

- - - Updated - - -

Because the test is PART of the application being good or bad. Failed test? Strike one. Fail other things? More strikes. Until eventually rejected.

That's still dumb. Why would overlooking one intentionally tricky line be equivalent to other failed things? Imagine we had exams like that at university. It's retarded. Jesus one more reason not to be in one of these pretentious guilds.

[MrPaladinGuy]

You're the reason WoW's become what it is.

[Deleted]

Reading this hilarious thread I'm getting more and more convinced they simply didn't like you, and they just used the "didn't read the rules check" as an easy way to get rid of you.

I think you should try to move on and work on your anger issues if this triggered you so much.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

You're the reason WoW's become what it is.

I am positive about that too.

Since my influence and people like me have such big influence, Imma pm you some tips for the AVTI stock.

Jsut for you.

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Reading this hilarious thread I'm getting more and more convinced they simply didn't like you, and they just used the "didn't read the rules check" as an easy way to get rid of you.

I think you should try to move on and work on your anger issues if this triggered you so much.

I think I shouldn't work on anything, really. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Deleted]

I am positive about that too.

Since my influence and people like me have such big influence, Imma pm you some tips for the AVTI stock.

Jsut for you.

- - - Updated - - -



I think I shouldn't work on anything, really. Thanks for the suggestion.

Yes I guess this reaction is completely within reason

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

You missed it, that is on you not on them. Want to know who didn't miss it? All of their current raiders.

Kisses.

10char

- - - Updated - - -

Yes I guess this reaction is completely within reason

I'm on the same thought too.

[MrPaladinGuy]

I am positive about that too.

Since my influence and people like me have such big influence, Imma pm you some tips for the AVTI stock.

Jsut for you.

Might want to buy Hooked on Phonics® and some typing software during a Steam sale first.


I heard Typing of The Dead is pretty cool.