Disc nerf

[Supliftz]

Definately.

Really just arrogance at this point.

Holy priest got one of the best healer 4pc's, and got one of the best golden dragons. Paladins lost their overpowered t19 4pc (when they upgrade 30 ilvls to mythic), got nothing out of new traits (the gold is a 1% hps increase LOL), and gained a new set bonus that only really increases their tank hps. Rdruid's have suffered direct nerfs and their new 4pc is really bad.

The only thing resto druid has over holy priest right now is a slightly better universal toolkit. But in terms of hps, holy priest will likely be equally as strong, or perhaps better than resto druid hps wise.

The doom and gloom around priest is so stupid honestly. The class is in its strongest state the whole expansion and people are qqing that it will be bad???

[Deleted]

Really just arrogance at this point.

Holy priest got one of the best healer 4pc's, and got one of the best golden dragons. Paladins lost their overpowered t19 4pc (when they upgrade 30 ilvls to mythic), got nothing out of new traits (the gold is a 1% hps increase LOL), and gained a new set bonus that only really increases their tank hps. Rdruid's have suffered direct nerfs and their new 4pc is really bad.

The only thing resto druid has over holy priest right now is a slightly better universal toolkit. But in terms of hps, holy priest will likely be equally as strong, or perhaps better than resto druid hps wise.

The doom and gloom around priest is so stupid honestly. The class is in its strongest state the whole expansion and people are qqing that it will be bad???

You still don't get it or you don't at all read what I write.

It's.
Not.
About.
HPS.

It's mobility and utility that makes a healer irreplacable, and we can't compete with the holy trinity in this regard, because we have seen no changes to this.

[MendUS]

You still don't get it or you don't at all read what I write.

It's.
Not.
About.
HPS.

It's mobility and utility that makes a healer irreplacable, and we can't compete with the holy trinity in this regard, because we have seen no changes to this.

Disc Mobility:
PWR ramp up goes from 12 seconds to 4 seconds.
Plea mana cost changes mean it's always a good on-the-go Atonement applicator.
Penance still can be cast on the move

Disc Utility
Pain Suppression (best single target DR of any healer)
Power Word: Barrier (best multi-target DR in the game)
Ability to cover several raid wide damage mechanics (still, even after the 7.2.5 changes)

Sure, some of our toolkit requires us to stand still, but we now have the potential to move as needed for sustained periods of an encounter and not be limited our mobility. In terms of utility, Disc offers just as much if not more utility as Holy. Divine Hymn and Symbol of Hope aren't terrible, mind you, but in terms of mechanics you want to bring on progression Disc is very well equipped.

I really think you either:
A.) Want to troll people here.
B.) Are misunderstanding what Disc does today, and what it can do in 7.2.5.

I'd recommend to read over some update info regarding the spec and get back to us. You seem misinformed.

[Deleted]

Disc Mobility:
PWR ramp up goes from 12 seconds to 4 seconds.
Plea mana cost changes mean it's always a good on-the-go Atonement applicator.
Penance still can be cast on the move

This doesn't help you teleport across the room to soak a falling orb on mythic Elisande, like a Hpala or Rdruid can do for instance. You have no mobility that can help the raid deal with boss mechanics.

Disc Utility
Pain Suppression (best single target DR of any healer)

This is true.

Power Word: Barrier (best multi-target DR in the game)

This is false. One SLT is worth 5 barriers.

[MendUS]

Disc Mobility:
PWR ramp up goes from 12 seconds to 4 seconds.
Plea mana cost changes mean it's always a good on-the-go Atonement applicator.
Penance still can be cast on the move

This doesn't help you teleport across the room to soak a falling orb on mythic Elisande, like a Hpala or Rdruid can do for instance. You have no mobility that can help the raid deal with boss mechanics.

Disc Utility
Pain Suppression (best single target DR of any healer)

This is true.

Power Word: Barrier (best multi-target DR in the game)

This is false. One SLT is worth 5 barriers.

Note: I was comparing Disc utility to Holy Priest utility (I misread your post as "holy trinity" being "holy", gg reading comprehension), not pallies or shaman.

Now that I've owned up to not reading your post properly, sure, other specs are more mobile and the healing meta isn't completely balanced unfortunately, not sure what you want me to say here. HPal and RSham are extremely powerful for progression content. Also, you disregard the fact that Disc can handle multiple raid wide abilities, so maybe you're just picking and choosing what you reply to. In regards to SLT, sure, but it's not all DR. I was referring to the raw DR from the ability, not an additional effect.

I also forgot to add: Disc also does 200-250k dps in addition to healing, and if you think that a healer contributing that kind of DPS won't help you on encounters like M Krosus or M Elisande, you're kidding yourself.

I guess my point is: don't discount what Disc can bring to a raid. If you have a good Disc Priest, they can earn their raid spot just fine. Sure, if you're in a competitive progression setting, you're always going to have a RSham and HPal, but the third / fourth spots can be rather flexible between other healing specs such as Druid / Disc / Holy Priest. Unfortunately, for MW Monks, I would probably never consider bringing one.

[Deleted]

Note: I was comparing Disc utility to Holy Priest utility (I misread your post as "holy trinity" being "holy", gg reading comprehension), not pallies or shaman.

Now that I've owned up to not reading your post properly, sure, other specs are more mobile and the healing meta isn't completely balanced unfortunately, not sure what you want me to say here. HPal and RSham are extremely powerful for progression content. Also, you disregard the fact that Disc can handle multiple raid wide abilities, so maybe you're just picking and choosing what you reply to. In regards to SLT, sure, but it's not all DR. I was referring to the raw DR from the ability, not an additional effect.

I also forgot to add: Disc also does 200-250k dps in addition to healing, and if you think that a healer contributing that kind of DPS won't help you on encounters like M Krosus or M Elisande, you're kidding yourself.

I guess my point is: don't discount what Disc can bring to a raid. If you have a good Disc Priest, they can earn their raid spot just fine. Sure, if you're in a competitive progression setting, you're always going to have a RSham and HPal, but the third / fourth spots can be rather flexible between other healing specs such as Druid / Disc / Holy Priest. Unfortunately, for MW Monks, I would probably never consider bringing one.

Mostly, I agree with you. I'd still say that the amount of unhindered healing that druid brings, they're still almost always part of any serious raid comp.

Like I have said many times, I ain't saying priests are shit. I'm just saying that the holy trinity healers are (almost) irreplacable in a serious progression guild. For 7.2.5 Blizzard have only tweaked HPS numbers for Holy priest for instance, but Holy HPS is fine, they need something else like Symbol of Hope baseline to make them attractive as that fourth or maybe even third healer. Honestly Disc might get there in Tomb with all the changes but we'll have to wait and see.

But you know something is very wrong with healer balance when most, not all, serious raiding guilds bring a second shaman or druid over a priest or monk.

[MendUS]

Mostly, I agree with you. I'd still say that the amount of unhindered healing that druid brings, they're still almost always part of any serious raid comp.

Like I have said many times, I ain't saying priests are shit. I'm just saying that the holy trinity healers are (almost) irreplacable in a serious progression guild. For 7.2.5 Blizzard have only tweaked HPS numbers for Holy priest for instance, but Holy HPS is fine, they need something else like Symbol of Hope baseline to make them attractive as that fourth or maybe even third healer. Honestly Disc might get there in Tomb with all the changes but we'll have to wait and see.

But you know something is very wrong with healer balance when most, not all, serious raiding guilds bring a second shaman or druid over a priest or monk.

I agree, utility isn't equal among all healing specs and it's pretty apparent with Holy Priest / MW Monk that they didn't really balance it well at all. I think out of the remaining 3 specs (HPriest, Disc, MW), Disc is the most likely to see action in ToS progression, but again I agree with you, we'll have to see. I'd argue that a good Disc Priest will bring nearly equal numbers of raw healing as a RDruid of the same skill level (maybe slightly less in terms of HPS, but then again you need to take into account added DPS, DR trait, DR cd's, etc that Disc can bring to justify its raid spot).

[Deleted]

You still don't get it or you don't at all read what I write.

It's.
Not.
About.
HPS.

It's mobility and utility that makes a healer irreplacable, and we can't compete with the holy trinity in this regard, because we have seen no changes to this.

As soon as holy priests top overall hps by a significant margin, as they should, it does become about HPS since then they actually bring something other healers can't.

Healing in itself is utility.

[anon5123]

As soon as holy priests top overall hps by a significant margin, as they should, it does become about HPS since then they actually bring something other healers can't.

Healing in itself is utility.

Not really, no.

Unless Holy starts doing like, 15% more HPS than any other healer, no.

Utility > raw HPS

[Deleted]

reading some of the posts on this thread, im so glad i re-rolled back to my resto shammy this xpac.

[Deleted]

Not really, no.

Unless Holy starts doing like, 15% more HPS than any other healer, no.

Utility > raw HPS

that's what i said yes

[Deleted]

Rerolled to resto shaman on Friday last week.

Hit 880ilvl with 3 relics unlocked today and now on to the ap gain which will be a piece of cake with AK knowledge 35 in a weeks time.

Fuck the amount of time and effort I put into my priest the devs have absolutely decimated my raid spot and fucked it all up.

#restoshamanforthewin

[anon5123]

that's what i said yes

Except Holy is never going to have that much of an HPS advantage over other healers.

And even if it did, you still have almost no utility compared to druid/shaman/paladin.

[Deleted]

well ok then?

[Supliftz]

You still don't get it or you don't at all read what I write.

It's.
Not.
About.
HPS.

It's mobility and utility that makes a healer irreplacable, and we can't compete with the holy trinity in this regard, because we have seen no changes to this.

yea all that resto druid utility is the reason why they're stacked atm. btw I don't disagree that holy priests "lack" utility, but I also think most healers "lack" utility compared to resto shaman. The entire reason why healers like Paladin and druid are so good, is because of their toolkit and high hps.

also healer mobility is a huge meme. Holy paladins in wod had 0 mobility and were the best healer.

- - - Updated - - -

This is true.

Power Word: Barrier (best multi-target DR in the game)

This is false. One SLT is worth 5 barriers.

I believe SLT is probably one of the most overrated abilities in the entire game.

Yeah SLT is really so much better than a spell that prevents 15% more damage, and increases the output of the disc priest by 100%. Every boss is exactly like eye of i'llgynoth where you take 100% of your hp every 1 second.

lmao most of the time SLT is dropped and it just reduces the damage you take by 10%.

[anon5123]

Holy paladins in wod had 0 mobility and were the best healer.

What WoD did you play where holy paladins were the best? In the one I played, Disc was by far the best, to the point where the forums were constantly ablaze with cries of "DISC OP! DISC BROKEN! NERF NOW!!"

[Deleted]

I believe SLT is probably one of the most overrated abilities in the entire game.

Yeah SLT is really so much better than a spell that prevents 15% more damage, and increases the output of the disc priest by 100%. Every boss is exactly like eye of i'llgynoth where you take 100% of your hp every 1 second.

lmao most of the time SLT is dropped and it just reduces the damage you take by 10%.

On beams Mythic Elisande SLT saves lives, barrier does not.

[Supliftz]

On beams Mythic Elisande SLT saves lives, barrier does not.

? Yea it does? You take 25% less damage and the disc priest does 100% more hps to people

[Deleted]

? Yea it does? You take 25% less damage and the disc priest does 100% more hps to people

Individual people risk taking unhealable sudden damage that damage reduction can't save, but the health distribution from SLT can.

[Supliftz]

Individual people risk taking unhealable sudden damage that damage reduction can't save, but the health distribution from SLT can.

Can you read that sentence to yourself. Just try again after you understand how damage reduction works for damage taken.

p.s that's not how slt works