7.2.5 Fury Guide & FAQ

[Deleted]

I just recieved [Umbral Moonglaives] 930ilvl from Sisters of the Moon and it seems like a good replacement for my 900 DoS even on pure single target.
But I'm still figuering out how to best use with Battle Cry. The trinkets damage duration is 8 sec with a large last tick - that is more than double the damage then the first 7 ticks. Since Battle Cry last 7 seconds, is it worth using the trinket first and let it tick for 1 second and then use Battle Cry, Avatar etc? So the last big tick also gets in the Battle Cry window.

[Arbiter]

I just recieved [Umbral Moonglaives] 930ilvl from Sisters of the Moon and it seems like a good replacement for my 900 DoS even on pure single target.
But I'm still figuering out how to best use with Battle Cry. The trinkets damage duration is 8 sec with a large last tick - that is more than double the damage then the first 7 ticks. Since Battle Cry last 7 seconds, is it worth using the trinket first and let it tick for 1 second and then use Battle Cry, Avatar etc? So the last big tick also gets in the Battle Cry window.

Mentioned in the guide. Use it one GCD before BC.

[Deleted]

Mentioned in the guide. Use it one GCD before BC.

Oh right, thanks!

[Archimtiros]

Live testing showed, that with a tiny bit of RNg help (convergence and artifact trait) you can pop BC on pull(hold OF) and it will come back by the time reflections spawn. Not soaking first Armageddon somewhere in china also helps. After that it should line quite well. Last phase is execute galore if you can move properly. Ended at around 800k, but ilvl is only 909, was also calling a lot of stuff and soaking everything possible.

Mechanics-wise avatar felt WAY shittier as a fury war.

Yeah, it's that RNG part that fucks it up. Far better to ensure a good BC against multiple targets, than to ensure a half-assed BC against one. I'm more than familiar with the pacing of the encounter, I ended at around 1.2m.

I don't know why you thought Avatar felt shitty, it's about as straightforward as an encounter can be.

[Tang0]

Yeah, it's that RNG part that fucks it up. Far better to ensure a good BC against multiple targets, than to ensure a half-assed BC against one. I'm more than familiar with the pacing of the encounter, I ended at around 1.2m.

I don't know why you thought Avatar felt shitty, it's about as straightforward as an encounter can be.

Well, i'll try to get to tose numbers when i cross that 15ilvl gap and get t20. Still, attempts when i didn't soak first Armageddon i got almost a guaranteed uptime on BC when reflections spawn.

As for avatar - i just can't get the stacks rolling with all the downtime boss has standing in the mid of lava after the break. And running in from of boss with headless chickens for melee dps doesn't help with boss uptime. Even if i didn't die on the kill attempt to Grazing a random whirlwind while leaping (wasn't even close) i still would'nt manage more then 700k i reckon. And that's putting it generously. You gotta feel the clunkiness, you finished that one with 800k yourself

[Archimtiros]

Popping BC on pull, I was able to get it back up for reflections ~4/5 pulls. It definitely hurts damage on the first set of reflections when it fails to come back up in time, but overall I'd say its worth using BC on the pull.

With the length of the fight, it's going to have a very small impact in the long run. Similarly, I never use BC on the pull on Gul'dan, because my tanks pull him out far too quickly, and it's too unreliable to get back up before the first set of eyes. Doesn't stop me from getting plenty of orange parses.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, i'll try to get to tose numbers when i cross that 15ilvl gap and get t20. Still, attempts when i didn't soak first Armageddon i got almost a guaranteed uptime on BC when reflections spawn.

As for avatar - i just can't get the stacks rolling with all the downtime boss has standing in the mid of lava after the break. And running in from of boss with headless chickens for melee dps doesn't help with boss uptime. Even if i didn't die on the kill attempt to Grazing a random whirlwind while leaping (wasn't even close) i still would'nt manage more then 700k i reckon. And that's putting it generously. You gotta feel the clunkiness, you finished that one with 800k yourself

That was the result of a sloppy kill and bad decision making on my part, rather than clunkiness. I think the fight is fine if approached and executed correctly.

Again, it's that "almost guaranteed" part. Realize that you don't lose anything by not using BC on the pull, aside from minor potion damage (and you can always pre-pot Prolonged Power instead of Old War). If all you care about is getting the highest possible parse, sure you can try to game it until it works out for you, but you're just as likely to end up with pulls/kills where you didn't get BC back up in time, ruining your average.

It also won't matter on Mythic, so most of us will stop caring after a week, just like we did with Gul'dan.

[Murloch]

So I got a 915 moonglaives, is that better than a 920 draught? I know, sim sim sim but is the damage difference big enough?

Simmed: Lose 20k DPS on ST with Umbral

[Hoeth]

So I got a 915 moonglaives, is that better than a 920 draught? I know, sim sim sim but is the damage difference big enough?

Simmed: Lose 20k DPS on ST with Umbral

Incredibly unlikely that a 915 UM is worse than a 920 DoD.

[Arbiter]

So I got a 915 moonglaives, is that better than a 920 draught? I know, sim sim sim but is the damage difference big enough?

Simmed: Lose 20k DPS on ST with Umbral

You sure you're not using an old SimCraft iteration before the nerf? It shouldn't even be less damage on single target. At the very least roughly even. Umbral should 100% pull ahead on AoE though and scales with the number of mobs while DoS damage is split.

At the very least, there should be no way DoS could possibly be better after you drop T19 4pc even on single target.

[Murloch]

You sure you're not using an old SimCraft iteration before the nerf? It shouldn't even be less damage on single target. At the very least roughly even. Umbral should 100% pull ahead on AoE though and scales with the number of mobs while DoS damage is split.

At the very least, there should be no way DoS could possibly be better after you drop T19 4pc even on single target.

Currently using 4p T19, so that's most likely why my DPS is lower with Umbral for now. Also gotta get the timing of Umbral down - I'm presuming that using it earlier is better than later to get that last tick in BC

[Jastall]

The 2pc alone seems to be a marked improvement on single target. I dropped my T19 4pc and gained a good 40-50K dps in single target situations. Raging blow went from roughly 15% of my damage to a solid 20% on most pulls. Pretty stoked to see how the 4pc fares.

[Arbiter]

Currently using 4p T19, so that's most likely why my DPS is lower with Umbral for now. Also gotta get the timing of Umbral down - I'm presuming that using it earlier is better than later to get that last tick in BC

Still really doesn't make sense for it to be a 20K single target increase even with 4pc. I don't know your warrior, but I simmed mine with 4pc T19 and a 920 DoS against 915 glaives and the DoS was only roughly 1K dps higher in comparison. I currently use Rethu's and Angry hat legos. Perhaps maybe you're mastery is incredibly high compared to mine or something. Even with that 1K dps though, DoS lost value the moment you introduced 2 or more targets while Moon Glaives continuously scaled in value. If you really are simming 20K higher in actuality, I would consider using glaives at least on any fight that's more than 1 target at times where CDs would be used and see to it that you drop your T19 4pc for the T20 2pc as soon as possible (T20 2pc and T19 2pc have been a pretty good combo for me with glaives) and drop DoS completely for glaives.

[orgonutil]

Still really doesn't make sense for it to be a 20K single target increase even with 4pc. I don't know your warrior, but I simmed mine with 4pc T19 and a 920 DoS against 915 glaives and the DoS was only roughly 1K dps higher in comparison. I currently use Rethu's and Angry hat legos. Perhaps maybe you're mastery is incredibly high compared to mine or something. Even with that 1K dps though, DoS lost value the moment you introduced 2 or more targets while Moon Glaives continuously scaled in value. If you really are simming 20K higher in actuality, I would consider using glaives at least on any fight that's more than 1 target at times where CDs would be used and see to it that you drop your T19 4pc for the T20 2pc as soon as possible (T20 2pc and T19 2pc have been a pretty good combo for me with glaives) and drop DoS completely for glaives.

check the version of your simcraft, i had one that wasnot using the Umbral (check the actions or the graphic with damage distribution)

[Arbiter]

check the version of your simcraft, i had one that wasnot using the Umbral (check the actions or the graphic with damage distribution)

?

My SimCraft version is fine.

[Murloch]

I think my issue is I literally have every legendary but the two BIS, so that's holding me back significantly. I have the cape and a non-DPS legendary. Been pushing over and over for angry hat, but getting nada. My gear specifically is probably why I get more out of draught than umbral, for now. I can't even go to 2T20 because one of mine is the cape and that's the only DPS legendary I have haha

[Cybyz]

What relics are you using for the trinket simulations? I feel like Battle Cry relics may affect the numbers/rankings significantly when considering on-use trinkets vs stat sticks. Could you consider updating the BiS/sim gear list with the relics being used? (I'm assuming 3x BC, but it might be nice to see a comparison without as well).

[newfury]

Hey Arch, I just got a 930 Fel Oiled Infernal Machine trinket from my class hall chest. How does that compare to a 910 Umbral Moonglaive? Would the Umbral Moonglaive still be better for single target due to its interaction with all of our buffs? The amount of haste a 930 Fel Oiled Infernal Machine is not accurately shown in armory. Its actually 4224 haste not 3107, and if the Fel Oiled Infernal Machine is better do I use it off cooldown or line it up with battlecry/buffs?

[Archimtiros]

Hey Arch, I just got a 930 Fel Oiled Infernal Machine trinket from my class hall chest. How does that compare to a 910 Umbral Moonglaive? Would the Umbral Moonglaive still be better for single target due to its interaction with all of our buffs? The amount of haste a 930 Fel Oiled Infernal Machine is not accurately shown in armory. Its actually 4224 haste not 3107, and if the Fel Oiled Infernal Machine is better do I use it off cooldown or line it up with battlecry/buffs?

Sim it, use it with CDs as normal.

[newfury]

Is simcraft 7.2.5 out? I've been looking everywhere if there was an update for it. Or is the 7.2.0 release 2 version accurate?

[Arbiter]

Is simcraft 7.2.5 out? I've been looking everywhere if there was an update for it. Or is the 7.2.0 release 2 version accurate?

http://downloads.simulationcraft.org/?C=M;O=D

Closest .exe to the top.