pvp talent builds

[Proskill]

im curious as to what ppl play pvp with. what talents do they pick, both main and honor talents

also post wether its for 1v1 (dueling), 2v2 or 3v3 arena, or maybe rbg

[Resentless]

I'll give this a shot. I can give something of a guide for all the brackets you've suggested, each one has a different style with different potential talents depending on who you are against, but I'll give a general overview then a bit more detail.

Generally your talent build will look something like:
Felblade
Demon Blades
Bloodlet
Netherwalk
Momentum
Master of the Glaive
Fel Barrage

Honor talents:
Medallion (any of these are good though and you should pick according to situation. vs rogue always go 2 min trinket no matter the bracket. vs mage+resto druid or mistweaver+arms warrior in any bracket its usually going to be relentless. most of the time i'll take adaptation for 2s and rbgs though. So yes, this row is 100% enemy dependent but medallion is always a safe choice).

Reinforced Armor (sparring against double melee or 1 melee in 2s/duels/melee cleave rbg team).
Solitude
Reverse Magic
Demonic Origins
Detainment

These talents+honor talents will get you sorted for basically any general situation. You will put out good damage both single target, cleave and AoE for all brackets. There are specific builds for specific situations however. I mentioned the first tier of honor talents and reinforced armor vs sparring already, as they are basically entirely dependent on what you are against. Now for some specifics:

For the first tier of talents, Felblade is what you will take 90% of the time. The additional mobility + reset potential + reliable fury gen are all incredibly welcome in pvp and in arena especially its very hard to play without in my experience. (this wasnt on this tier prior to 7.1.5 so I know exactly how it feels!). However, fel mastery is decent in rbgs to pad the meters. Fel Rush actually does tonnes of damage and increasing that damage in a place where you can hit multiple targets all the time is actually quite good, though you will already be near the top of the leaderboard with the main spec playing dh. I play fel mastery vs big melee cleaves in rbgs, and its also good in some specific situations in 3v3 arena. You will need to be vs another melee cleave with very little mobility, I.E. death knight + ret paladin, and be playing a comp that is going to be rotting people down (with an affli lock, unholy or frost dk or fire mage), where additional damage on multiple targets like fel mastery gives is very beneficial to the overall goal of the comp. Keep in mind this should only ever be used vs melee cleave teams where the targets will be close together all the time. Blind fury is pretty terrible in both arena+rbg+duels. Infrequent fury gen and can be interrupted so... yeah. Never pick that. If they make legendaries usable in pvp then it would be ok in RBG with the helm.

Controversial tier around demon blades. I'm not 100% on what is the best now with the 46% demons bite buff and the prepared buff to 100 fury (there is a nice little build with prepared+desperate instints+glimpse for a tankier dh build). Generally demon blades just feels better as during meta you can spam chaos strike and throw glaive while still generating fury, doing higher passive damage and resetting felblade (for more fury and chase potential if they run away). Also combos very well with solitude so id say its a must have in 1v1/2v2/random bgs (where you wont be fighting with the team a lot... probably). If you are not running solitude or youre in 3v3, its quite possible to take prepared for the extra momentum uptime+mobility (if you are good with backflipping ), 70% slow on multiple enemies, snare break and potentially activating blur if you take glimpse, all on a 15 second cooldown ability. It has a lot of power but it does feel a bit clunkier to use in my opinion. Demonic appetite seems like the best on paper as the additional souls are both a source of self healing (great for any bracket of pvp really, shining in the brackets where individual play matters more though), fury while attacking (like demon blades) and cooldown reduction on chaos nova+ eye beam (great for your burst when meta is down). However, as with prepared, it just feels a bit clunkier compared to demon blades. Sometimes i'm completely overflowing on fury, sometimes im completely starved during an entire meta when not a single soul pops out, at which point youre forced to use the wet noodle generator (still dont know if the 46% is a decent buff or not). While demon blades has some issues, it does seem more consistent than the other 2 options in general, but ive yet to try prepared properly.

As First Blood is only 200% increased damage in pvp, down from 300%, a single throw glaive with bloodlet will do more damage over its duration, thus bloodlet is taken for the majority of organized pvp.
Death sweep is still heavy burst damage with First Blood especially if you have chaos blades up however, which makes it a viable choice for 1v1 and certain cheese strats in 2v2. I've also been looking into using it with a demonic build or against teams where my only opportunity to kill is when I have meta and chaos blades up, but not seen a huge amount of success. Still an option for those who like that playstyle though.
Bloodlet is especially powerful when combined with master of the glaive (of course) as you'll want to be keeping up the slow quite frequently and it can be very good in 3v3 and rbgs with its heavy cleave damage when people stack up, especially combined with chaos nova+eye beam+fury of the illidari (your burst outside of meta). It also works well with momentum as you can nearly always fel rush+throw glaive so it will always be 20% increased damage.
Chaos cleave can be considered with a demonic build with demonic appetite as well and will perhaps be quite good now that they have given a 10% buff to chaos strike (damage reduced was lowered from 15% to 5%), but I havent tested it.

Netherwalk is the best talent for 1v1, most 2v2s and random+rated bgs. Its a movable ice block on a 2 minute cooldown... the only downside compared to iceblock being that you can use it while stunned but its still saved me countless times since it was changed. That being said, desperate instincts is the default choice for a lot of people due to ease of use and that it works while youre stunned. A 50% damage reduction in a stun might not be enough to save you sometimes but it can give you that chance. Certainly its a playstyle thing, id rather have more defensives than just one powerful one. Desperate instincts also works well if you want to play prepared or you KNOW you are going to be trained all game (many comps in 3v3 will train the dh) so you can take the honor talent glimpse as well, thus giving you a 50% damage reduction every 15 seconds for 3 seconds, ontop of proccing when you get to 35% hp. Seems very good but you have to give up netherwalk and solitude which is hard to do sometimes. Again, need to test this :d. Soul rending is only usable if you have taken demonic+awaken the demon within so you can actually get some use out of it rather than a small amount every 1.75 minutes with the meta cd when you will likely want to go OFFENSIVE rather than defensive. Also 40% leech is nice but 50% damage reduction is far better and isnt affected by dampening.

With nerfs/changes to nemesis in pvp, momentum is pretty much the default choice unless you are going to have 30 seconds of straight uptime on a target and will kill them every time you have nemesis up. Momentum works very well with bloodlet, can be improved with prepared and it gives more damage than nemesis in pvp. Overall just a solid choice. I would only pick nemesis in the situation I mentioned above which is extremely rare, maybe in duels but thats about it. Fel Eruption has seen more play since 7.2.5 as we no longer stun on meta, so an additional micro stun is quite nice. it is usually 5th/6th most damage done in an arena game as well so its certainly a good ability, but the lost cleave damage from no momentum is certainly felt in 3v3 and bgs. In 1v1/2v2 its quite a good ability and is nice when bursting for any situation. Momentum will give you more overall damage though.

Master of the glaive is the only mandatory talent on this list for 1v1/2v2/most 3v3/random bgs/most rbgs. Even moreso than felblade, the slow on throw glaive is so needed in pvp where even with our increased movement speed the server sometimes wont register that you are standing ontop of the target. Its annoying cause the other talents on this tier are pretty good, but without an applicable slow, even at 25%, we need this slow. It's also a good way to peel for allies, we have no other way to peel without hard cc or standing ontop of them and vengeful retreating. I'd love to see us get even a 25% slow on throw glaive baseline to open up this talent row, but especially with bloodlet being the best pvp choice, master of the glaive will remain the only go to here. Despite all that I just said, unleashed power is very nice when playing with a frost dk or in rbgs where your own slow isnt that necessary. Even there though, something feels missing from the dh kit without master of the glaive slowing.

Fel barrage is the best talent overall on this tier just for sheer damage and frequent use, but as its channelled you have to be cautious about when you use it. Generally wait for chaos nova to come up (they both have a 1 minute cooldown) so you can burst hard with double throw glaive->chaos nova+fury of the illidari (same global), fel barrage -> eye beam. It's pretty straightforward in its use, try and do it when people are grouped up but its tonnes of damage even on 1 target and that damage went up with 7.2.5.
Chaos blades lost 2% damage but gained 6 second duration in pvp with 7.2.5, which is a net buff and definitely feels strong when bursting with meta. Chaos blades can certainly be taken in 1v1/2v2 and possibly rbgs when you need to burst someone down in a short period and its more unlikely you will be ccd through its duration. General rule is to wait for meta to come up to use it, but you can use them separately (at least in 2v2) where you can get some defensives with meta and then finish them off with chaos blades. Considering every 2nd burst with double throw glaive+nova+foti+eye beam can be done with chaos blades up, if it suits your playstyle then feel free to use it.
I've been testing demonic at 2200 mmr in 2s recently and you can actually get loads of pressure out with it, especially if people dont expect you to be playing it. I still felt demon blades was better when playing this spec, but demonic appetite is of course better on paper (reducing the cd of eye beam with the souls to get into demonic more, same as in pve). Once people started to expect it though, it became harder to accomplish anything during the cooldown. I did feel like it was very good vs rot teams (boomkin/affli/uh dk) where you can use the unending hatred honor talent and awaken the demon within and just spam annihilation every single global when you are in meta. Very good counter pressure (with soul rending so youre healing the whole time as well). Haven't tried it in 3v3 yet but am considering it. Possibly with chaos cleave as well with the damage buffs this week. If you are unsure though, stick to fel barrage/chaos blades because its a strange playstyle.

Honor talents:
Already mentioned when to use tier 1 earlier. I use adaptation always in 2v2 unless vs mw+arms or mage+druid when you need relentless as you'll be in cc the whole game v mage+druid and the cc of arms+mw is too short to break adaptation. Medallion is the best vs rogues, though once you can consistently stop their opening sap its possible to go relentless. Good rogues will still manage to blind->sap even when taking relentless though. Medallion or relentless in 3v3.

Reinforced vs sparring, mentioned earlier, its pretty straightforward. Sparring vs melee cleave, armor everything else.

Solitude is best in 2v2 unless you are straight up being outdamaged (vs say a bm hunter) when glimpse is going to keep you alive more than solitude will help land a kill, especially after the solitude nerf in 7.2.5. Glimpse has good synergy with prepared and desperate instincts so think to take it if you are using either of those. Solitude works well with prepared in 2v2 as well, though. Never use solitude when playing a melee cleave because... well... it wont ever be active Cover of darkness is very very good in 3v3 and rbgs, and even 9 months in, rbg teams are still not used to having all their opening burst negated on half the enemy team when using this talent. Makes darkness a powerful teamwide defensive but the cooldown is quite long. Also quite good in 1v1 and 2v2s vs double dps. Can keep your healer (or yourself) alive through an entire burst cooldown of the enemy.

Reverse magic is the best vs anything where you can dispel a big cc. Polymorph, hammer of justice, chaos nova and frost nova are all major things you can dispel. It's a solid all-around choice that helps both you and your team a lot of the time.
I know some people like to use it to reverse 5x unstable affliction or all dots off them vs boomkin/lock/shadow priest, but I find vs teams like that, unending hatred is seriosuly seriously good. You basically have an infinite fury bar vs these teams with unending hatred which is significantly more counter pressure than dispelling their dots once a minute. I use unending hatred most of the time actually, but for teamplay a good reverse magic can be very clutch.
Eye of leotheras is only good against bad players who wont dispel it or wait for it to expire. Basically under 1700 ive seen this kill shadow priests and warlocks which is funny, but it stops working very quickly. Can sometimes be good vs disc priests or some healers who do damage frequently to heal. I know at one point using this talent when going offensive against casters would also increase its damage and make you do even more burst, but I think they fixed that. Quite a good ability in 1v1 though in situations where reverse magic wouldnt help you. Mainly vs mages or shamans.

Demonic origins 99% of the time. Unless you are vs double dps and want 30 seconds of meta in the opener along with awaken the demon within, or you are playing demonic (also using awaken the demon within) you will always play this talent. Its just far better than 1 30 second meta every 4 minutes. Mana rift sucks. I wish it didnt suck, but it does. Doesnt do damage half the time even if theyre standing in the circle, and the mana burn just doesnt seem to do anything either. Maybe bugged, probably just sucks. Only unusable talent in either of our trees.

Detainment half the time. Great in 3v3 and bgs. In 2v2 and some duels however, having a breakable, short cd imprison is better. It becomes another interrupt in 2v2 which is insane vs holy paladins and resto shaman. Detainment is better in this situation vs resto druids to stop their healing completely. Rain from above is great vs melee teams (including BM hunter here) that will sit on you the entire game. Beware of dks who can grip you down or druids who will vortex you back down though. The damage is also really quite nice, its my go to in rbgs where doing consistent 300k fel lances from 40 yards away while keeping you out of harm is really nice. Its also harder to hide in bgs while in arena people just go into LoS and avoid it, thus for arena its really only a defensive ability.
Mana break is only actually good vs affli locks and disc priests that will oom relatively quickly, and I only use it otherwise if i want a breakable, short cd imprison and need to pick another talent that helps killing healers (usually in dampening). Don't use it while they have any % damage reduction abilities up as it hurts this already pretty bad ability a lot.

Hope this helps!

[Resentless]

Side note, would anyone be interested in an updated dh PvP guide? The original one has been de-stickied and there is a disturbing lack of dh content/advice out there. I'd be happy to try my hand at one myself since I'm passionate about the class.

[Deleted]

Side note, would anyone be interested in an updated dh PvP guide? The original one has been de-stickied and there is a disturbing lack of dh content/advice out there. I'd be happy to try my hand at one myself since I'm passionate about the class.

Yes please! The more informative guides written by passionates to help our community, the better.

By the way, I stopped playing rated arenas after 2nd legion season started. How much has changed since then for DHs?

[Resentless]

Yes please! The more informative guides written by passionates to help our community, the better.

By the way, I stopped playing rated arenas after 2nd legion season started. How much has changed since then for DHs?

Sweet, I'll get on it ASAP

For your query, not much has changed in terms of rotation or talents. We're still running the bloodlet+momentum+fel barrage that was good back in S1/s2, but we have a lot more cc through imprison (though no more meta stun, but still a lot more since you last played). Meta on a 2 min cd is also awesome, definitely makes dh feel more fast paced in PvP.