Frost 7.3

[Baddok21]

Source?

Also switching HRW and glacial advance seems nonsensical.. HRW's only point is to funnel resources into BoS, now it's in the same tier as Obliteration and does something very similar.. oO. Fucking with freezing fog just hurts our aoe even more again. Putting runic attenuation next to the babysitting talent also seems rather.. pointless.

yeah i think blizzard simply said "what are the most used talents" and decided to change them around instead of saying "why are these talents used". it would only take 5 mins of in game testing to say "why would i ever, ever use HRW if im not using BoS"

the lvl 100 Tier is basicly saying

Obliteration - for the next 10 seconds you will be RP/Rune capped BUT with some more crits (but you stack crit... and would be critting all the same anyways especially at ilvl 975)

Hungering Rune Weapon - for the next 10 seconds you will definitely be RP/Rune capped, but heres an extra 20% haste.... for reasons

Breath of Sindragosa - every 2 mins you will have demon hunter levels of opening burst (that cleaves) may last 15-25 seconds

[RuneDK]

yeah i think blizzard simply said "what are the most used talents" and decided to change them around instead of saying "why are these talents used". it would only take 5 mins of in game testing to say "why would i ever, ever use HRW if im not using BoS"

the lvl 100 Tier is basicly saying

Obliteration - for the next 10 seconds you will be RP/Rune capped BUT with some more crits (but you stack crit... and would be critting all the same anyways especially at ilvl 975)

Hungering Rune Weapon - for the next 10 seconds you will definitely be RP/Rune capped, but heres an extra 20% haste.... for reasons

Breath of Sindragosa - every 2 mins you will have demon hunter levels of opening burst (that cleaves) may last 15-25 seconds

All I see is a cluster fuck of talents in worse off shape than we were before.....but your explanation of tier 100 is spot on.

[Darcyn]

I hate MG, its the most faceroll build ever. Hope MG won't perform better than both UH or BOS. I don't want to play a braindead carpal tunnel build, not saying UH / BOS is complicated but at least they are not as faceroll spamfest as MG.

[Super Kami Dende]

Thank fuuuuuuck. Might actually start putting time into my FDK again. BoS was mind-numbingly boring and by far the worst case of 1 talent overriding any other possible viable build for an entire spec..

[Cosmic Janitor]

All I see is a cluster fuck of talents in worse off shape than we were before.....but your explanation of tier 100 is spot on.

I think the last tier will just be fluff again with minimal differences (I do welcome GA fucking off though, it never belonged there). It essentially won't really matter what you take and only make slight differences depending on if you need burst/cleave or burst.

Obliteration and HRW in the same tier will just result in one of them never being taken, because we just calculate which gives us the better effect, since both do exactly the same thing (it's not like you can do something special with those resources now besides spamming more of the Ob/FS core loop..).

Edit: I just hope it won't end up like it did in nightmare and will fuck over unholy completely again by making faceroll frost outperform it by a 10% margin, with all these flat buffs.

[RuneDK]

Thank fuuuuuuck. Might actually start putting time into my FDK again. BoS was mind-numbingly boring and by far the worst case of 1 talent overriding any other possible viable build for an entire spec..

Cause MG took thought and challenged you? BoS at least had a high reward....MG was just awful...but to each their own...

[LCDArcade]

Sorry friends, I haven't played wow since the start of Legion like right before the raids came out. Can someone update me on whats been going with DKS? They just got a bunch of buffs last patch and now another round of large buffs in the next? Seems like Blizzard has failed to fix DKs onging problem they had since Catalcysm which is that they are strong at the start of an expansion and then become garbage towards the end with Unholy always being the best spec ( out of the 3).

I've always, and I really do mean ALWAYs hated unholy but was forced to play it when doing 25m heroics back in the day with my guild because of the huge disparity between the two dps sepcs. Going into Legion I was furious when I found out Frost was restricted to DW as I loved 2H way more. Just wish the class kept the variety they once had back in Wrath where they could do everything in any way and it just worked

Why does this continue to happen?

[RuneDK]

Sorry friends, I haven't played wow since the start of Legion like right before the raids came out. Can someone update me on whats been going with DKS? They just got a bunch of buffs last patch and now another round of large buffs in the next? Seems like Blizzard has failed to fix DKs onging problem they had since Catalcysm which is that they are strong at the start of an expansion and then become garbage towards the end with Unholy always being the best spec ( out of the 3).

Why does this continue to happen?

Because they refuse to do a complete redesign of the frost spec. Legion should have been the time they did it...they chose to revamp unholy....again. They think KM is fine...etc.

[Deleted]

OB/FS define FDK, I don't understand why BoS was really necessary. The point is, if you raid, you will see now everything is around BoS management sadly. I really want them to fix this.

[Super Kami Dende]

Cause MG took thought and challenged you? BoS at least had a high reward....MG was just awful...but to each their own...

Not really, but it was more fun than BoS since I still felt like I was doing something outside of the CD.

- - - Updated - - -

Sorry friends, I haven't played wow since the start of Legion like right before the raids came out. Can someone update me on whats been going with DKS? They just got a bunch of buffs last patch and now another round of large buffs in the next? Seems like Blizzard has failed to fix DKs onging problem they had since Catalcysm which is that they are strong at the start of an expansion and then become garbage towards the end with Unholy always being the best spec ( out of the 3).

I've always, and I really do mean ALWAYs hated unholy but was forced to play it when doing 25m heroics back in the day with my guild because of the huge disparity between the two dps sepcs. Going into Legion I was furious when I found out Frost was restricted to DW as I loved 2H way more. Just wish the class kept the variety they once had back in Wrath where they could do everything in any way and it just worked

Why does this continue to happen?

Basically they made the class so dependent on 1 Talent that by using any other build you effectively made yourself trash-tier and the class got balanced around that 1 talent. The Large Buffs are bringing abilities outside of that talent up to par whilst reining in the importance of the 1 talent in DPS.

[Marston]

I just talked with someone yesterday about Frost DKs. I do like Breath, but I enjoyed Machine Gun much more at the start of the expansion. Mainly because you are not totally fucked for 2 minutes if you start Breath and instantly get an ability on you wich forces you to run away from the boss (or all targets). I also liked the fast playstile of MG, even if you were rune starved every so often.

[Deleted]

I think they should have let Frost be the BoS spec until it is reworked to make sense since BoS is at least mildly interesting as a cornerstone of a spec.

Frost and especially Blood clearly have a lot of vestigial and ambitious but abandoned or underdeveloped elements like Volatile Shielding, Rune of Stoneskin Gargoyle, Soulgorge and the placeholder Heart of Ice and so on.

[Deleted]

I like these changes

[Deleted]

one thing that makes no sense to me is that hungering also gives... haste. it should give like mastry or something

[Cosmic Janitor]

one thing that makes no sense to me is that hungering also gives... haste. it should give like mastry or something

Since it's now exclusive with BoS they had nothing where they could actually spend all these resources, even with the nerf to it's activation speed. So they kinda need to make up in some way, I guess they think that with more haste you have at least a chance to spend the resources. They also can't really do anything sensible with the talent otherwise. If they just upped the duration but cut down the generation, it would essentially be even more obvious that it's just the same as obliteration.

I also love the comment about them potentially pushing the HRW nerf onto the live realms in a vaccuum. That's good night for frost until 7.3 hits then .

[Keren]

so long as they allow BOS to actually drain RP instead of scaling with how much RP you are able to spend on your own, BOS will be about how many runes you can spam and not any kind of rotation. If they would actually change it to scale with RP spend on your own, BOS would need 40% more gcds to build and actually getting rid of the RP to prolong the BOS. FDK's wouldn't no longer need less ressources, you could actually combine this with MG and would maybe end with a decent overall specc instead of forcing us to fight the RP drain and flush over with runes..

tldr: scale BOS lenght over how many RP you are able to spend on your own, thus reducing the need of Rune-builders and increase the need of RP spenders. Increasing the number of GCDs, reducing the overall achieveable uptime and maybe, if you feel like it, making us play MG on top of that to achieve higher haste and

[Hoeth]

Having shorter, more powerful Breaths good compromise though. One can plan around a needed ~20-30 seconds on target on most encounters and most burst phases last about that long. But the 45+ second BoS uptimes needed to go as that really encourages a shitbagging playstyle and needlessly penalizes the spec when things happen that you can't control or really even play around, and it seems like more and more fights have such mechanics.

[kennytheone]

Would hope to ge trid of BoS spec since it's so damn borring...yeh gives good no but for anlimited time and if not much movement is required otherwise is a disaster...of they reduced the dmg and cd on BoS maybe it would work better be t atm is way way to boring to play

[Cosmic Janitor]

Would hope to ge trid of BoS spec since it's so damn borring...yeh gives good no but for anlimited time and if not much movement is required otherwise is a disaster...of they reduced the dmg and cd on BoS maybe it would work better be t atm is way way to boring to play

I will never understand why people claim BoS is boring when it's the same as any other kind of frost playstyle with the difference that every 2 minutes you have at least something to do.. annoying I can understand, but boring? More boring than MG? How so?

[kennytheone]

I will never understand why people claim BoS is boring when it's the same as any other kind of frost playstyle with the difference that every 2 minutes you have at least something to do.. annoying I can understand, but boring? More boring than MG? How so?

Because for me at least i get the feeling I am stuck in one place...got that lego ring and i can keep BoS up for so long I fall asleep