"She lead the way" USC student cleared of rape

[Machismo]

And since she was the one to initiate, by their arguments from a previous thread about rape, she's the rapist.

No, not necessarily, she was the one to initiate in front of the camera. We do not know what happened in the room.

[Mehrunes]

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.u.../htm/pe.22.htm

what part of that says, specifically, drunk?

Being 'unaware' is not the same as drunk, btw.

Let me mansplain that to you...

[Machismo]

Until you stop parroting the same line over and over and over again your posts will simply be ignored.

Well, you really did make a claim, and refuse to back it up. I'm not sure what the issue is. You claimed I'm a rape apologist, so it should be very easy to point out where I did it. After all, I think I have about 24% of the comments on this thread.

[Bryntrollian]

Is it really appropriate to be using a smiley face like this for a case involving rape? It's a very serious matter.

The only one getting raped in this case is the gent who is about to face expulsion for being falsely accused.

[Mehrunes]

Consent is different for men and women.

The penis is shoved into the vagina. So the man is the aggressor.

Because a woman is incapable of putting the penis inside her. Do you not see the sexism in presenting sex as something that men do to women? Wait, why am I even asking.

[Elba]

Honestly, I get the idea of wanting to socially ostracize someone, especially in a college environment. The first instinct should be to protect someone. However, mistakes can happen.

I was in the Marines, and my roommate was accused of rape. I was the key witness, because I was the last one to see them both before it happened. The three of us were in her room, drunk. She gave me the "scram" look, and so I took off. Later that night, he came back to our room, and passed out. Everything seemed fine among our platoon, until people started to find out about it. Then one day, she went to the command and made the accusation.

Mind you, I loved the hell out of both of them. They were two of my closest friends, and our unit was torn apart from all of it. Everyone felt the need to take sides. There I was, the main witness, and I fucking hated being in that position. I would have gladly died for either one, but I felt like I needed to "pick" one side or the other. I gave my account of exactly what happened that evening, as well as what happened in the days and weeks following. I told them everything to the best of my ability, and yet, I still felt guilty. I felt I was going to be letting one of them down. Two of my closest friends in the world were on opposite sides of something very serious.

In the end, they chose not to press charges, based largely off of my statements. I spoke with as little bias as possible, and made it clear how much I loved and respected both parties. I believe him when he said he did not rape her, but I also believe she was telling the truth when she said she could not remember the event, and had no intention of having sex that night. Watching people's lives get ruined is terrible when one of them definitely does not deserve it.

I am sorry you went through this. I can't fathom how you must have felt.

The last paragraph is the crux in a lot of these situations I guess. You have two people telling different stories but also both telling the truth.

Rashomon.

[Doctor Funkenstein]

I think it's because he didn't make the claim that he didn't consent?

That's because he wasn't, nor was she.

But according to that Einstein's logic, he was clearly the rape victim.

Ooh, ooh, or since if you're drunk/intoxicated and cannot be held responsible for your actions or give consent, does that mean you can't rape anyone if you're drunk/intoxicated, too?! By Jove, I think it does...

[Sermistalot]

Well, you really did make a claim, and refuse to back it up. I'm not sure what the issue is. You claimed I'm a rape apologist, so it should be very easy to point out where I did it. After all, I think I have about 24% of the comments on this thread.

I have seen you make similar claim to other people and not offer any evidence.

24% seems like a high estimate.

[Elba]

That's true, but that line is super fucking blurry and basically impossible to decipher.

Yup, which is why I am so for positive consent. Unless you are 100% sure the other person gives you an enthusiastic yes instead of simply not a no ... don't fuck.

[Fastlane_hellscream]

Gentlemen, and I use the term loosely, this isn't a tough nut to crack.

If a woman is under the influence, she cannot consent.

If she is unknown to you, you would be esp. foolish to move forward to sex.

Judge in this case seems to think he's god. His opinions about video footage seems to fly in the face of the uncontroverted assertion that the woman was drunk and could not therefore consent. Behaving inappropriately while drunk is fairly common and doesn't somehow give her the ability to grant consent if a drunk woman cannot consent.

Yet again, I don't understand social norms better post on MMO-Champ...

Flawed logic. If I go out and drive drunk and kill someone...I can't tell the judge and jury that I was drunk so I didn't consent to the accident. Getting too drunk to make good decisions means you are irresponsible. If a girl is all over a guy as was the case here, and she was coherent enough to be sneaky and sign him into her dorm (something that is against the rules and premeditated)...how the fuck is she, at the same time, not thinking straight enough to have sex? Let me clear it up, she had buyers remorse and made a false claim and got caught. Complete bullshit lol...Everyone has heard of jokes about gnawing your arm off when you wake up with someone unattractive the next morning. Seriously, you don't see guys filing rape charges against fat or ugly girls when the realize what occurred. You simply leave. How is that a hard to understand concept?

[Vyuvarax]

You're doing that on purpose to avoid owning up your nonsense.

You said actions. You didn't specify which actions.

Investigations will analyze all facts, including those actions. You said that the notion of those actions having an impact on determining fitness to consent is rape apologist 101. This is literally what you said.

So yeah, you're being obtuse on purpose in hopes I'll drop it. Well there ya go, I'll drop it. I no longer have the patience for games like these.

That's how you "win" on MMO-C, guys.

I don't have the patience to qualify everything I say within a conversation, no. I was talking about the actions in the way that the other party used them to explain how the victim had consented. That's typical in argumentation.

I don't give a shit if you drop it or not. Cherry picking segments of discussions out of context doesn't make you look knowledgeable.

[Machismo]

I am sorry you went through this. I can't fathom how you must have felt.

The last paragraph is the crux in a lot of these situations I guess. You have two people telling different stories but also both telling the truth.

Rashomon.

Exactly, in the case we've been discussing, both parties may very well be telling the truth.

[Katchii]

I don't even know any actual rapist that have had their life destroyed, people have rushed to defend them and try to ruin the girls reputation and her families reputation and anyone else who dare to support her, even when convicted with overwhelming evidence.

Destroyed may be too strong of a word, but getting fired from your job, expelled from school, black listed from certain events etc... have a profoundly life altering effect and these can be consequences of simply being accused, not actually ever convicted.

[Mistame]

The victim said she was drunk to the point of not remembering what she did the night before. That's substantial impairment in any court. I'm not sure what you're arguing, but you sound uninformed at best.

I'm uniformed? You've been shown on multiple occasions that memory impairment from intoxication has no relevance whatsoever to being able to function effectively. Someone who's just a bit tipsy can experience this phenomenon. Someone who's shit-faced can forget things that happened prior to them even starting to drink. Stop spewing the same tripe about stuff that's already been shown to be false.

I stand by my premise that social control is a necessary tool to protect women, though.

How sexist of you.

[Machismo]

I have seen you make similar claim to other people and not offer any evidence.

24% seems like a high estimate.

Can you provide an instance where I did that? After all, you've apparently only been on these threads for less than two months, so it shouldn't be difficult to find an example. Also, when asked to back up my claims, I make a point to do so.

So, I would like you to back up your claim that I am being a rape apologist. You have plenty of comments in this thread to go by, and I'm guessing you have gone back to try and find some (with no success).

[McTroll]

I don't have the patience to qualify everything I say within a conversation, no. I was talking about the actions in the way that the other party used them to explain how the victim had consented. That's typical in argumentation.

I don't give a shit if you drop it or not. Cherry picking segments of discussions out of context doesn't make you look knowledgeable.

Assuming intent. Cute.

My point is that what you pointed out is NOT necessarily rape apology 101. Context matters.

[Dreknar20]

Yup, which is why I am so for positive consent.

wow sounds like lame Jewish sex

[Sermistalot]

I don't have the patience to qualify everything I say within a conversation, no. I was talking about the actions in the way that the other party used them to explain how the victim had consented. That's typical in argumentation.

I don't give a shit if you drop it or not. Cherry picking segments of discussions out of context doesn't make you look knowledgeable.

People on MMOC thinks it does if it makes them "win" an internet battle.

[McTroll]

People on MMOC thinks it does if it makes them "win" an internet battle.

I rest my case.

[Vyuvarax]

I'm uniformed? You've been shown on multiple occasions that memory impairment from intoxication has no relevance whatsoever to being able to function effectively. Someone who's just a bit tipsy can experience this phenomenon. Someone who's passed out drunk can forget things that happened prior to them even starting to drink. Stop spewing the same tripe about stuff that's already been shown to be false.

Lol I've never seen a defendant in court claim "She was blackout drunk, sure, but she only had a couple drinks so she also was only tipsy so totally competent, right?" as a defense, but you're welcome to try.

Whether you can walk and talk is not evidence of competence. Review any case where the elderly sell property but are deemed incompetent by the court.