Car ploughs through protesters at Charlottesville Alt-Right rally

[Slant]

Oh, the Confederacy is boy scouts and the JV team. Well, i guess this thread is kinda pointless being the Alt right is linked to the Confederacy/KKK.

I'm glad we cleared up that we should not be worried.

Make no mistake, the US nazi/KKK movement is a bunch of pussies compared to the Fourth Reich. But that doesn't mean that we should support their agenda. Just means you shouldn't give them more credit than those dimwits deserve. Western civilisation these days is heavily banking on the fact that neonazis are dumb as fuck. So far, so good. But they are getting smarter. They're hiding among regular politicians now, they call themselves Le Pen and Petry, but they are still alive and kicking. Constant fucking vigilance and calling them out for their shit is the only thing keeping them in check.

[Skroe]

That ceiling being called civil war?

Lol nah. Collective moments of national horror that "we've gone too far". A commonly used example would be the LA Riots in the 1990s. Riots (urban civil unrest in general)in the US grew over the course of the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s and peaked in the 1990s. After LA... there hasn't really been anything approaching the scale. The closest was Occupy Wall Street or Ferguson or Baltimore, and those were square dances compared to LA.

I would not be surprised if there is a major riot in the US in coming years due to something, and after several smaller ones. We're "due". I also wouldn't be surprised if it's the last one for some time. There will be the iconic photo of the burned out school Day Care or something, and America will begin the long walk back.

We're extremely predictable, really. Americans are not that complicated. We get really worked up over stuff. And then we forget.

[Slant]

Well, to be fair, there's a difference inbetween desecrating a memorial, and that can hardly be called freedom of speech by anyone.

Actually, in the US actions are considered freedom of speech, aren't they? It's not hard to put up a bullshit defense for pissing on a war memorial. :P

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Lol nah. Collective moments of national horror that "we've gone too far". A commonly used example would be the LA Riots in the 1990s. Riots (urban civil unrest in general)in the US grew over the course of the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s and peaked in the 1990s. After LA... there hasn't really been anything approaching the scale. The closest was Occupy Wall Street or Ferguson or Baltimore, and those were square dances compared to LA.

I would not be surprised if there is a major riot in the US in coming years due to something, and after several smaller ones. We're "due". I also wouldn't be surprised if it's the last one for some time. There will be the iconic photo of the burned out school Day Care or something, and America will begin the long walk back.

We're extremely predictable, really. Americans are not that complicated. We get really worked up over stuff. And then we forget.

As usual, I hope you're right. But it has to happen soon. Your national divides are getting mighty deep. And you're split on too many issues to just gloss them over. Too many traps to trip over in the future. Pick any random topic and there's some sort of divide in the US with little room for nuanced differentiations.

[Skulltaker]

We're extremely predictable, really. Americans are not that complicated. We get really worked up over stuff. And then we forget.

Except for the pumpkin in chief, but yeah, historically speaking, I'd you're right. Allthough, were germans could do with a little more forgetting, americans could do with a little less.

[Dextroden]

And that's just the difference between being a good person and a scum bag.

Good people will police themselves. For scum bags, there is the law.

Alrighty. Crush em.

And don't got the internment route.

[Skroe]

Actually, in the US actions are considered freedom of speech, aren't they? It's not hard to put up a bullshit defense for pissing on a war memorial. :P

Desecrating memorials is explicitly a crime and in general desecrating venerated objects is considered a crime in the US through other means.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1369

18 U.S. Code § 1369 - Destruction of veterans’ memorials

(a) Whoever, in a circumstance described in subsection (b), willfully injures or destroys, or attempts to injure or destroy, any structure, plaque, statue, or other monument on public property commemorating the service of any person or persons in the armed forces of the United States shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both.
(b) A circumstance described in this subsection is that—
(1) in committing the offense described in subsection (a), the defendant travels or causes another to travel in interstate or foreign commerce, or uses the mail or an instrumentality of interstate or foreign commerce; or
(2) the structure, plaque, statue, or other monument described in subsection (a) is located on property owned by, or under the jurisdiction of, the Federal Government.

(Added Pub. L. 108–29, § 2(a), May 29, 2003, 117 Stat. 772.)

[Slant]

And that's just the difference between being a good person and a scum bag.

Good people will police themselves. For scum bags, there is the law.

Such a bad ass Doctor.

[Deleted]

No it is a good idea to ban hate speech.

The definition of 'hate speech' is very blurry, though, and can be changed at will and basically span everything that does not reflect the majority opinion on a topic - and everything that could be offensive to someone. It is a very slippery slope if we selectively start banning the right to publicly express an opinion.

Are you pendra?

Yes.

[Skulltaker]

Actually, in the US actions are considered freedom of speech, aren't they? It's not hard to put up a bullshit defense for pissing on a war memorial. :P

What was the name of the guy who crashed into someone who wasn't prosecuted for manslaughter? The dude with tits, was on South Park, campainging with Garrison...

[Doctor Amadeus]

I am certainly not in the middle. I would class myself as left of center. Here is my problem. How many people looked at who was driving the car and who they hit before they decided what side to sit on.

Good point but I am saying it shouldn't matter who you are, hell you could hate another group, but logically, reasonably, when people are killed or hurt that is stupid, it makes everything worse.

I don't know about you but forget sides, when people do stupid shit even if it's property damage I am annoyed, people on either side aren't always, but the problem is everyone motives aren't the same. And cowards often find crowds to hide behind, and claim reason.

How many times do people wait until their politicians say something before deciding what their stance on that subject should be? People aren't thinking for themselves any more. They are letting politicians and fear drive their decisions.

Yes and or Celebrities, or a comedian that gets another Embed, see see I love this guy because he says everything I want to hear, and the moment they don't I think Celebrities should just shut up, or politicians are really just in it for the money blah blah blah.

People have to watch out for being screwed over now 24/7 people would like one place they can trust, at some point it's going to get laid at the feet of someone.

The problem here is that bringing up anything else is a deflection. It's a way of justifying the behavior. Almost as if to say "others made him do it" or "but others are doing it too". That doesn't deal with the issue. It feeds into things because people don't realize that their side can be wrong. Not everything that their side does is automatically right.

I understand the people hate each other. The only way that people can move forward from that is too see that they aren't always right.

You ever been in a room every once in a while and somebody really lets everybody have it and everyone hears some shit they really don't want to hear, now days that would go a little more like "Ask not what your country can do for you"

People just have to get outside of that comfort zone especially politicians, and EVERYBODY needs to stop being addicted to just listening to what they want to hear. The problem is we can't get there, because anytime we get close, it get's used and misused.

In the end people just don't want to be told their some shit they have to do, and the worst sin anybody can ever commit is to not live up the the expectations of everybody else.

Just speak the truth and stop worrying about it being perfect, I think Trump for instance used that, and it's why he gets a pass and forgiven for the shit he has said and done.

Alt-Right are just following that que.

[Slant]

Desecrating memorials is explicitly a crime and in general desecrating venerated objects is considered a crime in the US through other means.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1369

18 U.S. Code § 1369 - Destruction of veterans’ memorials

(a) Whoever, in a circumstance described in subsection (b), willfully injures or destroys, or attempts to injure or destroy, any structure, plaque, statue, or other monument on public property commemorating the service of any person or persons in the armed forces of the United States shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both.
(b) A circumstance described in this subsection is that—
(1) in committing the offense described in subsection (a), the defendant travels or causes another to travel in interstate or foreign commerce, or uses the mail or an instrumentality of interstate or foreign commerce; or
(2) the structure, plaque, statue, or other monument described in subsection (a) is located on property owned by, or under the jurisdiction of, the Federal Government.

(Added Pub. L. 108–29, § 2(a), May 29, 2003, 117 Stat. 772.)

Like I said, your "freedom of speech" is not so different from ours. We're just upfront about the limitations, while you hide them deep in criminal code.

[Deletedaccount1]

Kind of strange to see the white nationalist protesters have no masks on. Seems like unless you lived out in the boonies, getting recognized as one of those people could get you fired or doxxed.

[Skroe]

As usual, I hope you're right. But it has to happen soon. Your national divides are getting mighty deep. And you're split on too many issues to just gloss them over. Too many traps to trip over in the future. Pick any random topic and there's some sort of divide in the US with little room for nuanced differentiations.

Actually, its quite the opposite. There is a broad-based consensus about so many things in America this day in age, that the rather narrow list of things that Americans ARE divided on are simply deeply divisive. Our problem, in other words, is a kind of national narrow, but deep disagreement, rather than broad and superficial or broad and deep.

But race issues are ALWAYS in a class in it's own because slavery is America's original sin and we've never fully had our reckoning with respect to that. I would not put divisions on race in the same kind of sphere as say, taxation.

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Such a bad ass Doctor.

I loved him but Capaldi is king.

[Dextroden]

Like I said, your "freedom of speech" is not so different from ours. We're just upfront about the limitations, while you hide them deep in criminal code.

Can you find a country where grave desecration isn't illegal?

[Skroe]

Like I said, your "freedom of speech" is not so different from ours. We're just upfront about the limitations, while you hide them deep in criminal code.

And let's not forget, there is the second layer of State Laws too.

[Doctor Amadeus]

The definition of 'hate speech' is very blurry, though, and can be changed at will and basically span everything that does not reflect the majority opinion on a topic - and everything that could be offensive to someone. It is a very slippery slope if we selectively start banning the right to publicly express an opinion.

No Illiyra it's not and you damn well it isn't even if the theory doesn't meet the practice.

You know when something goes past a line and I don't mean being offended, sure I am offended all the time, but there is a time and place for everything and I realize it's next to ever really important.


But HATE speech is real clear, when someone comes to the decision that they want to preach in a specific way that explicitly or implies that the way to progress is to murder you, or enslave you, that is hate speech. I am not talking about the ignorant, I am talking about the stupid who know better and choose to lie.

That needs to be understood.

[Slant]

Actually, its quite the opposite. There is a broad-based consensus about so many things in America this day in age, that the rather narrow list of things that Americans ARE divided on are simply deeply divisive. Our problem, in other words, is a kind of national narrow, but deep disagreement, rather than broad and superficial or broad and deep.

But race issues are ALWAYS in a class in it's own because slavery is America's original sin and we've never fully had our reckoning with respect to that. I would not put divisions on race in the same kind of sphere as say, taxation.

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I loved him but Capaldi is king.

Dems vs. Reps, pro-choice vs. pro-life, health insurance vs. each to his own, "left" vs. "right", gun control vs. the right to kill anyone, creationism vs. evolution, cimate change vs. deniers, religion vs. science... really, you're too divided on bullshit topics that should be a no brainer. And some of them don't even make sense (creationism vs. evolution).

And this is just the ones that jump to mind immediately, disregarding the obvious elephant in the room: black vs. white.

[Dextroden]

Kind of strange to see the white nationalist protesters have no masks on. Seems like unless you lived out in the boonies, getting recognized as one of those people could get you fired or doxxed.

That's why you want them in the open. So many fucking idiots ousted themselves.

[Slant]

Can you find a country where grave desecration isn't illegal?

That's not the point. I'm still a bit mad at Skroe for telling me he thinks he has more freedom of speech than we do. I'm just poking in it until he relents and admits that ours is pretty fucking free as well. :P

[Doctor Amadeus]

Such a bad ass Doctor.

Great scene wish I watched Doctor Who.

It's True rules don't keep you safe, the whole idea of things such as security is a joke. You are only as free and or safe as your instincts and understandings allow for, there is no 100%

However that doesn't mean there isn't calculable probability and where that number is can make all the difference in the world.