Raiding has been really stale in Legion

[Legends303]

The move out of x and soak y is really been grating after a while. I can see why many mythic raid guilds have fallen off since Nighthold because these bosses aren’t well thought out. Tomb of Sergeras has been the biggest offender of this where every boss has a soaking mechanic. They can’t come up with creative mechanics anymore because they are afraid of backlash from their player base. The first boss in Antorus is a soaking boss. I use to look forward to raiding in previous expansions but now getting really faituge and its really becoming a chore.

[BadguyNotBadGuy]

Soaking has been a basic mechanic for ages, and in Legion theyve basically used it to force people to sacrifice some HP to stay alive, while giving you the ability to cycle who soaks. otherwise they would just have raidwide damage, and thats even less interesting.

[Sigxy]

I think it's been quite alright to be honest. Tomb of Sargeras just end up being really annoying to do as a Retribution paladin, given how they are the slowest together with death knights, and there have been a bunch of "Start running!" bosses... x_x

[meowfurion]

I think it's been quite alright to be honest. Tomb of Sargeras just end up being really annoying to do as a Retribution paladin, given how they are the slowest together with death knights, and there have been a bunch of "Start running!" bosses... x_x

I feel you on that.

PLus target switching. I main a feral druid, and the amount of fucking RELENTLESS target swapping is heinous in this expack. "Oh you got your dots almost set up to equal everyone else's easily done DPS? Here, now you have to swap targets and lose all that and set it all up on THIS target! HAHA now swap back, bitch."

[Xtrm]

I think it's been quite alright to be honest. Tomb of Sargeras just end up being really annoying to do as a Retribution paladin, given how they are the slowest together with death knights, and there have been a bunch of "Start running!" bosses... x_x

Rip us on Avatar. I've hated ToS as a Retribution paladin specifically because of soaks.

[Justpassing]

Soaking has been really stale in Legion

Fixed for you.

[Sylvaeres]

I can see why this could be a problem for some classes. I play a mage and a DH mainly, they both have excellent mobility, so it doesn't affect me personally. Hopefully this is something they address soon

[Ealyssa]

now you have to swap targets and lose all that and set it all up on THIS target!

Feral dots aren't "set ups". They are the finisher. Once your dots are on the target they will do damage, the end. You switching doesn't impact the rolling dots.

[meowfurion]

Feral dots aren't "set ups". They are the finisher. Once your dots are on the target they will do damage, the end. You switching doesn't impact the rolling dots.

You clearly don't play a feral druid or main raid as one. Thrash is not a finisher. Rake is not a finisher. Ashaman's Bite is not a finisher. Only RIP is a finisher. And if a druid is relying solely on his or her dots to damage the raid boss and not Ferocious Bite and Shred, they are a bad feral.

[Kazuchika]

I wouldn't say raiding as a whole has been stale just ToS because it's literally "We Ran Out Of Ideas: The Raid Instance".

EN did get boring after a while but not to the point like in ToS where I ask myself sometimes if I even want to bother showing up for raid night because I'm just so utterly bored of Soakamania and their insistence on mythic boss mechanics where if someone sneezes at the wrong time it kills the entire raid.

[Aggrophobic]

Agreed. It has been one big disappointment after another.
There are a few good bosses such as Helya and Gul'dan but thats about it.

- - - Updated - - -

Fixed for you.

Well, thats mostly the last tier and the next one as well, sadly enough.

[Kralljin]

I think that so far not a single Raid Instance did have at least one rather major blunder.


EM had Xavius, a joke of a final boss, the rest of EM was fine in my opinion for an entry raid.

ToV, after they undershotted Xavius, they might have thought to make that up on Helya and overshotted it, for a "filler" raid Helya was way too difficult and a far too big step from Guarm, Helya didn't award any Mounts or titles, only a recoloured transmog if you're doing The Chosen.

NH, one sided mechanics, on too many bosses Ranged Dps had to everything while Melees had to next to nothing.

ToS, similiar thing, one sided mechanics, too much soaking and a lack of Dps Checks.

Dps checks are to a certain degree important because it gives the encounter something to "outgear", so that people can still feel some progression on the fight after reclearing it, if an encounter does not have this, you'll soon face the issue that your guild might simply not defeat this encounter even after a few weeks simply because there's no hope to outgear it.

KJ is especially cruel here, if your raid fails too often on the Knockback / Soak stuff, you will not beat this encounter, period, previous difficult bosses at least gave you some breathing room if you had enough HP via High Ilvl or high Dps, KJ doesn't really have this.

[digichi]

mmmm yea i can see why it gets boring... get out of the fire has existed since the start of the game, and soak mechanics are getting annoyingly overused..

My biggest complaint is that fights have become so position/movement INTENSE. (maiden especially. dont get hit by stuff, do a little dance, time your jump into the mid PERFECTLY or die.. demonic inq needs you to dance out and about when looking out for quills, void pools, dispelling... stack for harj, spread for harj... avatar with all the quarters, soaks, shadowblades, the annihilation, the bloody 2nd phase with the tornadoes especially.. every boss feels SO punishing movement wise.) Even the first 'easy' boss of the raid, like goroth, needs you to be moving out and into stuff more consistently than say, something like marrowgar back in ICC. Half of the challenge is movement based (esp why ppl are bringing a lot of druid tanks for M KJ for the savage roar... gotta go fast). Sure, movement aspects are an easy way to make things more challenging. And its fun when its fresh and new. But for every boss its just more of a challenge than it is fun... if that makes sense.

Obvs the mechanics have evolved over time to be more punishing, but can we get some chill back? Valithria Dreamwalker (green dragon boss in ICC) was a gauntlet for tanks/dmg, but it was a fun fly-through-the-rings fight for healers... it was fresh and fun, ppl would still wipe cause it wasn't a total snooze fest. Watching my feet constantly for every boss gets tiring, surely there are other things they can come up with ??

From what i saw in antorus, the first boss has 'dance' mechanics too for the whole group... i wonder how the other bosses will pan out. (im not saying i like snoozefests of just standard there and hitting a boss, but what i'm saying is that id like to hit the boss more than some fights in ToS..)

[IceMan1763]

Mythic raiding isn't what Heroic raiding once was back in the day. It's basically a time sink based difficulty level. If you can't no life to a certain level, then you have no business even attempting to do mythic raiding while it's even remotely current content.

In earlier (and more popular and more played) xpacs like Wrath, the difficulty really was primarily the content (as in the bosses). That's why any analysis of the number of guilds completing Mythic in Legion compared to Heroic in Wrath, for example, shows a massive difference in the number of guilds completing the hardest content. There isn't the massive gap in skill that current Mythic raiders would like you to believe there is. There are a lot more players capable of completing the Mythic content in Legion than have done it, but those players don't have the time needed to farm TF procs, BIS legendaries, and Traits. All of those things, by the way, take essentially 0 skill to farm, they just take time.

[Queen of Hamsters]

If it feels stale, do Mythic.

"They can't come up with creative mechanics anymore" = conspiracy theory, not based in any tangible evidence.

[digichi]

I think it's been quite alright to be honest. Tomb of Sargeras just end up being really annoying to do as a Retribution paladin, given how they are the slowest together with death knights, and there have been a bunch of "Start running!" bosses... x_x

this is what i'm talkin bout >< i hope they dont overload bosses like that for antorus

[Swalload]

The move out of x and soak y is really been grating after a while. I can see why many mythic raid guilds have fallen off since Nighthold because these bosses aren’t well thought out. Tomb of Sergeras has been the biggest offender of this where every boss has a soaking mechanic. They can’t come up with creative mechanics anymore because they are afraid of backlash from their player base. The first boss in Antorus is a soaking boss. I use to look forward to raiding in previous expansions but now getting really faituge and its really becoming a chore.

So quit? This is not your job, nothing and no one forces you to be in this game, there's plenty of other good games out there, no reason to torture yourself with stuff you don't like.

Also you can do that without making a useless forums post, it's amazing, you don't need the community's permission to gtfo.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Mythic raiding isn't what Heroic raiding once was back in the day.

Sub numbers =/= time spent in-game.

People are just angry that Mythic raiding is mechanically more difficult AND requires more logistics now than HC did back in the day.

this is what i'm talkin bout >< i hope they dont overload bosses like that for antorus

It'll be a major bummer for the slower/more immobile classes if Blizzard compensates less soak mechanics with "OH SHIT RUN!"-mechanics...

[Kazuchika]

Oh look here comes Rorcanna into another thread to spout a bunch of inane rambling.

Time to abandon thread.

[Deleted]

Yea it's like an alarm goess off in his house and he has to rush in the thread and play the devil's advocate.

ToS has been really bad for me as well, I have zero motivation to show up for raids, and indeed I've just stopped showing up. I doubt Antorus will be any different for me, I just hope something magical happens with the next expac.