Mythic plus killed the raiding scene.

[crusadernero]

How can a higher difficulty kill raiding? I dont get it. Most games have difficulty settings, from casual to some hardcore/legendary difficulty. Its the same think when it gets to raiding.

There are also many reasons why people choose what difficulty they want. Some dont have the patience/time for hardcore stuff. Others wants the challenge etc.

Like me. I dont play games on harder than normal these days. I used to play games on hardest difficulty, but I dont have the desire to do so anymore. I focus more on the story or other aspects in a game.

But I understand why people go for mythic, and they should be allowed to.

[papajohn4]

Basically so many years raiding have killed so many content... it killed dungeons, it killed professions, it killed reputation rewards...

Because raiders couldnt move their ass to do anything else than just raid... a profession perk was 1% better than other and the world was in danger!

-Raiders felt forced to have x profession because perk was 1% better and perks removed...

-raiders felt they had to run lfr for tier sets, and tier sets removed...

-raiders felt they have to farm consumables for their raid and consumables dumbed down a lot and decreased in numbers..

-raiders now feel that mythic+ is too generous...

How about blizzard ignore the 5% of playerbase and start creating content for the 95%?

[crusadernero]

Basically so many years raiding have killed so many content... it killed dungeons, it killed professions, it killed reputation rewards...

Because raiders couldnt move their ass to do anything else than just raid... a profession perk was 1% better than other and the world was in danger!

-Raiders felt forced to have x profession because perk was 1% better and perks removed...

-raiders felt they had to run lfr for tier sets, and tier sets removed...

-raiders felt they have to farm consumables for their raid and consumables dumbed down a lot and decreased in numbers..

-raiders now feel that mythic+ is too generous...

How about blizzard ignore the 5% of playerbase and start creating content for the 95%?

Are you saying Blizzard DONT make content for the majority? I would say theres ALOT to do in this game even if you dont raid. We also have several difficulties for raiding, so everyone can attend.

[kamuimac]

Are you saying Blizzard DONT make content for the majority? I would say theres ALOT to do in this game even if you dont raid. We also have several difficulties for raiding, so everyone can attend.

legion is first expansion in at least 6 years when casuals got decent content outside of raiding .

and guess what - the moment they got it they moved away from raiding

devs are just stubborn idiots who refuse to admit truth - if mythic + with its rewards got intorduced back in cata or mop then wow wouldnt loose milions of players like it did because those retards focused only on raids ignoring everything else.

screw raiding - put more systems like mythic + into game - this is what keeps people playing not shitty raids.

[Deleted]

Basically so many years raiding have killed so many content... it killed dungeons, it killed professions, it killed reputation rewards...

Because raiders couldnt move their ass to do anything else than just raid... a profession perk was 1% better than other and the world was in danger!

-Raiders felt forced to have x profession because perk was 1% better and perks removed...

-raiders felt they had to run lfr for tier sets, and tier sets removed...

-raiders felt they have to farm consumables for their raid and consumables dumbed down a lot and decreased in numbers..

-raiders now feel that mythic+ is too generous...

How about blizzard ignore the 5% of playerbase and start creating content for the 95%?

95% is actually playing LFR, don't want to invest more than 1 hour every week and they want to get the best loot out of that.

Besides, you have millions and millions of logs, that proves people don't know the concept of "rotation"(im serious, they litteraly don't know basics as rotational system. That is how nonesense casuals in this game are).

Its not an easy task, but they are doing it amazingly, by creating content for everyone.

[Perkunas]

legion is first expansion in at least 6 years when casuals got decent content outside of raiding .

and guess what - the moment they got it they moved away from raiding

devs are just stubborn idiots who refuse to admit truth - if mythic + with its rewards got intorduced back in cata or mop then wow wouldnt loose milions of players like it did because those retards focused only on raids ignoring everything else.

screw raiding - put more systems like mythic + into game - this is what keeps people playing not shitty raids.

Most people don't want to raid. Most people just want some form of progression that isn't as logistically tedious and so when given that option they stop raiding.

[Deleted]

Raiding killed itself, and the community is digging its grave.
Raid partecipation (especialy the highest difficulty) has always been low, it's a system that requires the players to invest enormous amounts of time and effort in the game, which is something that few can do. I myself got a burnout during mythic ToS and quitted raiding, because I almost 30 and can't invest 4+ night of my life into this. Now i just do HC and M+ and i'm geared like a mythic plaer. :V

[Deleted]

Basically so many years raiding have killed so many content... it killed dungeons, it killed professions, it killed reputation rewards...

Because raiders couldnt move their ass to do anything else than just raid... a profession perk was 1% better than other and the world was in danger!

-Raiders felt forced to have x profession because perk was 1% better and perks removed...

-raiders felt they had to run lfr for tier sets, and tier sets removed...

-raiders felt they have to farm consumables for their raid and consumables dumbed down a lot and decreased in numbers..

-raiders now feel that mythic+ is too generous...

How about blizzard ignore the 5% of playerbase and start creating content for the 95%?

that's quite true, also pvp "balance" killed every single class.

[SirCowdog]

Most people who whine about LFR and M+ are not the high end players. The end high players don't care at all about what the LFR-players do. The people who whine and moan are the toxic rejects who get kicked from mythic guilds because they think they're better than they are; mostly LFG-people that have cleared absolute max 2 bosses in mythic.

That's why I specifically defined those guys as "Shitlords at the top who would sacrifice their own health and friends for a spot in a top raid". I've met and been friends with some pretty cool cutting edge raiders. One of my long-time friends was a raid leader for a top-5 Naxx raid(Tier 3) on my server back in vanilla, and was a top 10 guild in TBC. Guess what killed his raid team and guild? A-holes and guild drama over loot because they took on a new guy who left the second he got the drop he wanted.

But you're right, it's the toxic rejects who make everyone else look bad. But it's really just one more reason to support more small-group content like M+ 5 mans, or 10-man raids for Mythic difficulty.

[crusadernero]

Dont you think most of this comes down to people being assholes? I mean, why does it hurt that we have several raiding difficulties? I really dont care about it. Do LFR. Do Normal. Do mythic. Do raids. Do dungeons. Whatever you prefer.

I dont care at all about pet battles and sometimes wonder why its in the game, but I dont spend time and energy complaining about it being in the game. Its there, people use it, I respect that.

Just as with raiding. LFR is there, people use it. Mythic is there, people do it.

Just as in any game out there, the harder the game, the fewer will complete it. Some people dont have time, some people are just bad at the game, others dont have desire for it. Theres millions of reasons why or why not engage in mythic raiding.

[papajohn4]

that's quite true, also pvp "balance" killed every single class.

Not only pvp balance but also the philosophy "bring the player not the class" which also was a change for raiding balance and resulted in homogenization of the classes

[Perkunas]

That's why I specifically defined those guys as "Shitlords at the top who would sacrifice their own health and friends for a spot in a top raid". I've met and been friends with some pretty cool cutting edge raiders. One of my long-time friends was a raid leader for a top-5 Naxx raid(Tier 3) on my server back in vanilla, and was a top 10 guild in TBC. Guess what killed his raid team and guild? A-holes and guild drama over loot because they took on a new guy who left the second he got the drop he wanted.

But you're right, it's the toxic rejects who make everyone else look bad. But it's really just one more reason to support more small-group content like M+ 5 mans, or 10-man raids for Mythic difficulty.

10 man mythic would suffer the exact same fate as 20 man mythic. Mythic+ would be favored because there are less people you are forced to rely on and the gear is just as good save the set bonuses. Shit, you hand out tier in Mythic+ and mythic raiding is all but dead after that. They need to just combine LFR and normal into a single difficulty and scale it in the middle and do the same for mythic and heroic. It's no longer raid or die so there's no point for mythic raiding be it 20 or 10.

[papajohn4]

95% is actually playing LFR, don't want to invest more than 1 hour every week and they want to get the best loot out of that.

Besides, you have millions and millions of logs, that proves people don't know the concept of "rotation"(im serious, they litteraly don't know basics as rotational system. That is how nonesense casuals in this game are).

Its not an easy task, but they are doing it amazingly, by creating content for everyone.

I dont even bother with lfr.. i only do open world content and dungeons..

- - - Updated - - -

Are you saying Blizzard DONT make content for the majority? I would say theres ALOT to do in this game even if you dont raid. We also have several difficulties for raiding, so everyone can attend.

I mean content that matters, not a just fluff stuff that nake sure that raiders wont feel "forced" to do them...

[potis]

Dont you think most of this comes down to people being assholes? I mean, why does it hurt that we have several raiding difficulties? I really dont care about it. Do LFR. Do Normal. Do mythic. Do raids. Do dungeons. Whatever you prefer.

I dont care at all about pet battles and sometimes wonder why its in the game, but I dont spend time and energy complaining about it being in the game. Its there, people use it, I respect that.

Just as with raiding. LFR is there, people use it. Mythic is there, people do it.

Just as in any game out there, the harder the game, the fewer will complete it. Some people dont have time, some people are just bad at the game, others dont have desire for it. Theres millions of reasons why or why not engage in mythic raiding.

You forget, thats how the Homo Sapiens is.

Jealous, envious, resentful <insert any other word that represents jealousy when it comes to items even with pixels>

Also you forget how the Homo Sapiens of "gamer quality" of 2017 is.

Raiding scene is fine, the problem arises because there isnt enough quality players and Blizzard is adding ways for everyone to feel happy, making no-incentive to raid higher difficulty levels for a few ilvls.

Why would i waste my time raiding Mythic with wannabe-pro horrible 20 year olds that only create drama, when i can clear HC practically whenever i want, and with the TF system i am 30 item levels above what i should be?

Havent stepped foot in Mythic and i am 942 ilvl while the active raid is 930 supposedly, why would i ever go through the struggle of wiping with retards over 300 times because "Nick argued with his GF", or "John is stressed from college and cant dodge fire" or "Paul didnt sleep well today" or whatever crap excuse the average trash player has nowadays.

And to everyone crying about non-existent problems, WoW is a raiding progressed game based on gear chase(Aka THE WESTERN MMO GENRE) just because you want it to be something else to suit your agenda.. go back to whatever trash tier game you came from.

Only actual problem Legion has is that alts get crapgenderies and are not fun to play cause of that , its not M+, its not how raids are or whatever delusional problem fits every person.

[papajohn4]

10 man mythic would suffer the exact same fate as 20 man mythic. Mythic+ would be favored because there are less people you are forced to rely on and the gear is just as good save the set bonuses. Shit, you hand out tier in Mythic+ and mythic raiding is all but dead after that. They need to just combine LFR and normal into a single difficulty and scale it in the middle and do the same for mythic and heroic. It's no longer raid or die so there's no point for mythic raiding be it 20 or 10.

So maybe that means that majority prefer mythic+? So should we remove it and people forced to do what you like?

[Deleted]

So basically another retard thread about a retard non existent problem from an user that has probably less than 1200 myth score

Mythic raiding has its own sweet spot with the ez 955 o the title or the mounts and the prestige.

[Niwes]

Less and fewer people raid today, with mythic + gear being easier to obtain. It's just as good as mythic raiding gear. With how the mythic + esport is going we can expect from now on Mythic + will always be a thing and it wont change other than more dungeons and affixes. I love dungeons as much as the next guy, but getting better gear from mythic raidng is a joke. The dungeons are not hard enough to where they should get better gear, until you do a 17 key the content is a joke, assuming you do it on your main.

I cant link anything because Im new, it says "You are not allowed to post any kinds of links, images or videos until you post a few times." However you guys can look up what I just said through WQ and WoW progress.

no. it dont.

IF, then legendaries, endless grind, alt unfriendlyness and diablo gameplay did.

less ppl playing the game, so less ppl raid. and even that is, like your nonsense, a complete assumption.

as long as you dont have i.e. real sub numbers, or numbers of other actvities besides raids, that also existed before, to compare past constellations with actual one, as long you dont have any clue what you are talking. ofc, you can look at wp/wcl and say „look! less ppl raid than in past!“. this may be a fact (if you can differ fixed raids from pug raiding, so not only the WHERE of raiding shifted). but about WHY that says absolutelly nothing.

or in short: you have no data. but pulling stuff out of your ass because your guts say so.

[Deleted]

There is no correlation between a "to be proven" lacks of sub and no more raiding.
Because mythic raiding isn't the most played raid difficulty.

Hence myth raiding doesn't show nothing about subs.
Lfr normal heroic and m+ instead...show us that more and more people are playing.




What killed Mythic raiding was just the kill of myth 10 raid and the "no pugs no xrealm" stuff
If queque or openraid were built into wow with people able to pug mythic raid, you would see a huuuuuge participation.

Even it would been only for the first 5 bosses in ToS ( the easiest)

[Perkunas]

So maybe that means that majority prefer mythic+? So should we remove it and people forced to do what you like?

Not what I'm saying. I don't advocate for the removal of Mythic+ I'm saying Mythic raids are doomed be they 20 or 10. I think for this game raiding is no longer the end-all be-all and so there's no point in Mythic raids.

[jtstormrage]

Mythic+ arguably saved this game.

Much of the player base is now in its late 20s and 30s - this game is 13 years old. Many players have jobs, kids, a life. Many players don't have 2-3 hours in the evenings to raid.

However, M+ allows quite high end challenging play and access to good gear, and you only have to play for 20-30 mins. That is so great for the players referred to above.

If there was no Mythic +, personally I would struggle to find a reason to play this game.