Question to Raid Leaders <3 How do you practice and become Good Raid leader?

[sabrek]

hello wonderful forum <3

i always wanted our raid leaders how do they practice their craft? how do they get experience?

is it just with time? and is it normal to be nervous as hell at the beginning ?

and what are your essential tools to help you ease the task?


i raid lead but very rarely and always panic at it lol but i really love it and wish to do it always


thx for reading

[ddengster]

1) Learn the game
2) Learn enough to be able to point out mistakes of others
3) Get mad, gquit
4) Make new guild for raiding
5) Now that you are now able to guarantee a spot in raids, you can start practicing leading raids.

In any case, being able to get to be in a position to communicate on something you know and make people do what you want is hard as it is. Then there's the raid leading part.

[Serenity91]

1) ask people in your guild if they want to try raiding
2) get pressured into the role of RL by your guild
3) just handle the invite and feast and read up on the tactics on the way to the next boss
4) pray

[Kanika]

It's definitely something that takes time, and as your confidence grows, the more effective you will be and the easier it will become.

I would suggest trying to familiarise yourself with the details of the fights - usually from all perspectives (healers/tanks/dps) and not just your own. If you have a clear understanding of the mechanics, you'll be able to explain them and help others. If it's a new boss, go with a plan of how you intend to tackle it - taking in to account your specific group and strengths/weaknesses.

Be aware of what's going on. As a raid leader you need to be keeping 1 eye on what everyone else is doing the whole time, because if something goes wrong, you will need to try and fix it.

Get to know your team - if you dont already it helps a lot if you are comfortable with the people you are trying to lead.

In terms of practical tools, you may find an addon like exorsus raid tools or oRA3 helpful as you can track cds, assign jobs to people and generally have a better overview of what's happening.

If people are confident in you as a leader, they will ususally be happy to be led. You need to instill that confidence and trust in them and hopefully the group will respond positively and that in turn makes your job a whole lot easier.

I hope this helps a little and Good luck

[tratra]

Study the fights before you go at it.

Make sure you understand the boss fight really well and that you know what it needs to get dropped.

Understand your raid synergy.

Study all the classes and changes, make sure you know all specs, all classes and their + - on situations.

Respect your raid members, and try to explain anything wrong to them like adults and not like kids. Treating them badly or like kids will probably get them against you, and won't listen to you. If you treat them nicely and like adults and maybe point it out to them that they are adults and lets act like it will get them to work towards the same goal as you.

Don't be afraid to admit your own mistakes, and be funny about them. Mock your self pretty much in bad scenarios. That will make you look nice and humble and more likeable.

Learn when its time to call the raid. Sometimes its better calling a raid that is not going really well, if you see people don't feel like it. You'll get back at it stronger the next time and will allow people time to adjust on new tactics mechanics etc.

Learn how to boost morale. If you see your group being down but its not time to call it yet cause you think you can go further on that night, try sing some terrible song, or put on some britney spears on etc. Generally take a small break and have some fun with the raid members, showing them that its just a game etc. That will make them more calm and better at reacting to the fight itself.

Learn how to accept criticism. Accept it and own it. Be firm on your responses to it. If you feel you've been mistreated state it. If you feel you've done something wrong and the criticism is fair, admit it and then throw a joke around, will make everything better.

Learn how to accept feedback and use it. Suggestions etc are very welcome, don't be the kind of leader that is closed into receiving suggestions and or feedback on how to change things around or tactics on downing bosses.

Accept feedback AND do your own thing. Don't always go for whatever others are saying e.g giving you different tactics etc etc. Just go with the thing you believe is most likely to work, stick with it for a bit. Changing your mind all the time and accepting suggestions and implementing them at once, will make you vulnerable and people will start suggesting things all the time and you won't down anything at the end of the day.

Thats just a small list of things, I used to raid lead a top 5 guild mid tbc to start of wotlk. I am currently an assistant director having duties of a director for a big Corp. Had plenty of coaching sessions, management training, leadership training and am halfway through my MBA atm which I only took in as its free to do it.

[Razorice]

1) Time.
2) Boss Mechanics.
3) Class Knowledge.
4) Cool Head
5) Awareness.

[sabrek]

how would you guys deal with a bad raid and bad experiments at the start? my biggest fear sadly is the reaction of others if i raid led a bad raid

[david0925]

how would you guys deal with a bad raid and bad experiments at the start? my biggest fear sadly is the reaction of others if i raid led a bad raid

You just need to have a level head going into it realize that you most likely will make plenty of mistakes even after doing your homework. As others have pointed out, handle the raid in a critical, albeit positive manner. You want to identify issues, potentially discuss with tanks/dps/healers about what to modify based on what you are failing at, without pointing fingers and triggering people. You can fix people's mistake without doing public shaming or using harsh language, and before you have established yourself as a competent raid leader it's even more important to stay away factors that will distance people from you.

The most important thing is keeping the raid's morale up. You want to address issues quickly and fix them promptly so people get a sense of progression (and you should be stressing this between pulls so people don't feel like they are wiping for nothing). At the same time, you definitely should also consider cutting raiders that consider themselves much better than other people AND actively showing that, even if they are actually much better. As stated before, the most important element to maintaining a stable raid are keeping the players positive: it doesn't matter if you have 1-2 world class players in your guild that makes people want to quit when they play with them.

[Deleted]

Start small. Assist other raidleaders, start raidleading a pug group etc. Tell your guild about your situation and try raidleading easy bosses.

Raidleading isn't just leading a raid during your raid times. There comes so much responsibility with it.

I started raidleading during TBC (I was 15 or 16 y/o) and had no clue how to do it. Many of my raids were bad but during my time in WoW I tried it again and again and again.
Now I am guild and raidlead in a world 200 guild. I respect my people, try to give them constructive criticism... treating them as human beings.

[Justpassing]

I didn't choose the raid leader life, it chose me.

[Atherions]

In no particular order:

1) Alcohol
2) Have good players as "role officers" IE healers, melee, ranged and tanks that you can talk to about how to handle the next boss before the raid.
3) Respect your raiders, don't be a nazi, don't be a bully. Empower your raiders.
4) Spend way more time on raiding compared to everyone else in your raid team. Most casual/semi-casual and even hardcore players will show up to the raid with very little knowledge of the boss you are progressing on.
5) Talk to everyone on your team outside of raids. As a raid leader you can't just stick with your preferred 5 man party outside of raids and only talk to your team on raid nights.
6) Don't be a "Human DBM" add something of value when you call something out. If you call out every single thing happening people will ignore you when you call out something important.
7) Be the best player on your team - In most guilds this will give you all the respect you need.
8) Don't try to fill all other roles of the guild as raid leader, you can't also be GM and all the officers combined. A guild needs more than 1 person in charge

[Slykila]

Run with other groups before you choose to lead on your own. See how other people do it and adapt to make your leading your own. It will take some time for you to become comfortable. Start with a small group of people, 10 man (normal, then move to heroic). You need to be able to play your class while watching others and watching boss timers to call out incoming mechanics. Big Wigs or DBM, Exorsus Raid Tools, Angry Assignments are helpful. I would suggest getting a healer that knows his or her shit to help with calling out healing cds for mechanics. You should also watch and study videos of the encounters beforehand, don't go in there blind. Expect people you don't know to leave on wipes, it happens. The atmosphere will be what you make it; if you're stressed, others will be too. Try and be relaxed and have a good attitude. Have fun and good luck!

[Egregious]

In no particular order:

1) Alcohol
2) Have good players as "role officers" IE healers, melee, ranged and tanks that you can talk to about how to handle the next boss before the raid.
3) Respect your raiders, don't be a nazi, don't be a bully. Empower your raiders.
4) Spend way more time on raiding compared to everyone else in your raid team. Most casual/semi-casual and even hardcore players will show up to the raid with very little knowledge of the boss you are progressing on.
5) Talk to everyone on your team outside of raids. As a raid leader you can't just stick with your preferred 5 man party outside of raids and only talk to your team on raid nights.
6) Don't be a "Human DBM" add something of value when you call something out. If you call out every single thing happening people will ignore you when you call out something important.
7) Be the best player on your team - In most guilds this will give you all the respect you need.
8) Don't try to fill all other roles of the guild as raid leader, you can't also be GM and all the officers combined. A guild needs more than 1 person in charge

Definitely this.

There is no secret to raid leading. It's essentially just leading. Take input from all sources and decide what to do. Don't be a meek pussy bitch and let other people tell you what to do, then they're the leader. Don't be a stubborn intransigent shitwad and demean and belittle other's for no reason, then you're a dick. Be decisive, be firm, and most importantly be dependable regardless of situation. The quality of your decision making will determine whether you are a good raid leader or a bad raid leader.

You'll definitely fuck up, everyone does. But, if you're dependable and likable, people don't really mind too much. Oh, and knowing: the mechanics of the encounter, the intended niche/strength of each role/class/spec, your raid team's makeup and, to a greater or lesser extent, the purpose and or function of each type of raid mechanic in WoW's mechanic library will be helpful to you, as well.

*Edit: And don't be afraid to delegate. There's no reason you should have to call out every single god damned mechanic. On that same note, don't have a tank call out a healer mechanic, don't have healers worry about DPS mechanics, etc. You don't have to tell the healers when to CD, delegate that. However, you should be aware of when they're CDing, why, etc. in order to ensure they are performing appropriately.

Be the metronome keeping the raid's pace and be the deciding factor both in and out of the encounter.

[PhantasmagoriaX]

All of the above is great advice, I would also like to add when it comes down to a boss fight give out small explanations of the fight (if needed) and keep it short, I had an old RL who would go into great detail and took 20 mins before every pull.

[krl]

- PREPARE the next encounter beyond the raid journal. Raiding time is precious, you need to make the most of it.
- Raid leader is a role. GM is another one. Recruiting, judging applicants and swinging the discipline baton is tiring. If you can, don't take these roles.
- Multiple people can have good input on tactics. Be open and value good input. On the other hand, be prompt to cut pompous discourses on vocal.
- Be there for every raid. No "2 nights out of 3" for you.
- Imho, play a braindead-easy range DPS spec, so you can have a good view of what's going on during the fight and not concentrate on complex rotations/health bars/boss' stinking mouths.
- Be demanding of your raiders, at their level. For example, don't spend 10 minutes explaining the basics of a boss, they should probably know that.

[Deleted]

Make raid.

Take a drink.

Pull boss.

Die.

Take another drink.

Work out what went wrong, laugh.

Take another drink.

Pull boss again.

Repeat until boss dies or you go blind through alcohol poisoning.

[miDnight77]

how would you guys deal with a bad raid and bad experiments at the start? my biggest fear sadly is the reaction of others if i raid led a bad raid

To answer this question : it depends . What is this raid? Are you raidleading a random group you build from time to time. Or do is this a casual every other week guild raid or do you have a raiding group with higher ambitions?
Also what do you consider a bad raid? Wiping the whole evening doesn't automatically mean that the raid was bad. If its a really hard fight for your group and you need to progress and learn. Many Bosses take wipe counts in the 3digit realm if you raid Mythic ie.

Generally speaking the Raidleader is a role in the group for the group. You as a raid decide to give away some of your freedom, some of your control and put it into the hands of the Raidleader / RL-Team to install order, direction and ultimatley one Voice. Uniformity. First and Foremost the RL should be Leader. Maybe just look it up what a charakter Traits are the ones of a good Leader.
There should be respect for you in the raidgroup. Respect is normally earned. People need to see that you excell at if not on all at least most of those fields:
-Encounter knowledge,
-Class knowledge ( what does your raid setup bring to the fight )
-your Own Class Knowledge (they shoudlnt feel like carrying you every night through the hardest content while you chill with DPS lower than the tanks)
-Communication skills: Building and communicating Strategies, collecting Inside from your raid listening as well as knowing when to shush your raid

and there is a lot more. Also what people want from a raidlead differs by what they want from the raid itself. If you do a Random group they want you to balance the group correctly with invites, give quick call outs what boss is next, who might have special assignments like Interrupts or Heal CDs and kick people who drag behind.
If you, on the other hand, are in the position to raidlead a Family and Friends casual Normal mode raid they might look for you to the organize it ahead of time, explain strategies, help them learn thos, handle the loot and have a great time.

[Deleted]

Raid Lead in Vanilla, Wotlk, Pandaland and WoD.

Nobody can really give you the exact answers your looking for because every Raid Comp is different. Generally the better players in top guilds can deal with jokes during a pull and have wiped enough on the Boss or done enough PTR testing to know when shit is about hit the fan, Last phase of Fallen Avatar and Mistress are a pretty clear example.

Nervousness is normal for everyone until you get used to it and then at that point it's just regular routine. Similar to starting a new job, you don't really know anybody and think twice before using initiative because you are afraid of fucking up, once you are used to the job and the role, you no longer need to keep asking what to do because you know what needs to be done and how.
Same in raids. Top guilds will already have PTR tested and would have seen certain mechanics first hand, how the abilities animations work, what you can get away with and when to use certain CDs. So most of the framework is already in place. Healers will already have a rough idea of when to use CDs etc. Weakauras etc.

Imo the most important thing as a raid leader besides getting a kill is to keep morale high. Naturally as people get better they will wanna experience harder content Normal > Heroic > Mythic. And you will reach points when you will wipe on boss's well over a 100 times. And that doesn't mean your shit or your raid leading. DOn't start screwing at guys over fuck ups unless you know you got someone competent on the bench ready to come in and finally always be willing to listen.

Raid Leading is very similar to a management role at work. So just think of your favorite Managers you worked for and ask yourself why you liked working for them. Good RLs will always have the respect of the raid and always willing to listen because no strat in the world is absolutely perfect. Sometimes you kill boss's while practicing shit and it will be a surprise other times you will fail to simple mechanics like armageddon's on KJ. Don't just cuss someone out for a simple fuck up and then just say it wasn't my fault if you do the same fuck up. And if you do call people for fuck ups learn to be your own biggest critic. And no RL does all the work by himself.
Method are a great example, you have Scripe RL'ing, Roger helping, Healers probs already discuss when CDs need to be used and generally random DPS will call all shit out.

And finally and imo the most important, don't just watch a kill video and expect it to work for you. Amount of guilds I see not using Lust on pull because they watched some Fatboss video and want to save Lust for 20% or w/e. and then don't reach that 20% mark for 100 attempts etc is just fucking stupid. Use lust as aggressively as you can when progressing to see as much as you can of an encounter and just try to survive so your raid can see and experience the mechanics as much as possible.

Sorry for any grammar errors and typos, English isn't my first language. 8)

[Rorke]

You either have it or you don't. It's genetic.

If you're nervous about leading then you're not a leader. And if you're not a leader then you must follow.

[Sierra85]

You either have it or you don't. It's genetic.

Not true. thats like saying theres no point in taking business management classes cause u r either born a leader or you're not.

leadership qualities, strategies and tactics can be learnt.