Here's a crazy idea...

[Deleted]

Vanilla WoW is coming, and we've been fighting for it to come for years.

Now if you're new to the Vanilla WoW train, welcome, know that we want it unchanged and we don't want graphical, balance or quality of life improvements EVEN THOUGH we are well aware of how great those things are in your current retail WoW.

What if it is not technically possible? All we know is :"We found an old build".

What if some things cant be fixed for today's clients /servers and need to be recreated from scratch?

Because I can tell you that is not some crazy thing....this kind of issues happen ALL the time in software development and im not meaning the Blizzcon joke "We are gonna need those blade server we gave away back".

Would you see this issue as "This it not Vanilla then" or you can work with a version that tries to be as accurate as possible (but not 100%)?

[Echocho]

Can we please tone down the hate-filled, elitist rhetoric and just discuss Classic servers in a mature, logical, reasonable manner?

A lot of it is probably from the private server community that's already pretty toxic and have been living in their little bubble for years and don't want any of it to change even in the slightest. They can't be reasoned with, simply launching the game through the game through the battle.net launcher will be herecy to them.

Let's focus on the returning players that have wanted this for years and are excited and open minded.

[Deleted]

This is pretty simple

If it's not "Vanilla as it was" no one will play it.

The vanilla crowd who as been asking for this for years will not play it.
People who wasked for QoL changes and succeeded will eventually quit because they never wanted Vanilla in the first place.

So why in the world should we listen to people who want QoL changes? They dont want Vanilla...

[Video Games]

Them wanting changes isn't valid because they want 3.3.5 wrath, not vanilla

[Slashnox]

Who is we? Really, who do you even think you are? You're not alone. The ''vets'' aren't alone. Everyone has a different way of thinking how this should be done. And probably the only one who knows and chooses what is going to change is Blizzard. So stop acting like you own the place and accept discussion about this. Simply saying I WANT THAT OR NOTHING is not relevant in a discussion. There's gonna be compromises.

You're right it was kind of pretentious.

But by "we" I mean the people who were signing the papers delievered to Mike Morhaime last year when Nostalrius shutdown. I mean the general "we" that want the Nostalgic experience.

I see so many posts asking for this and that like it's gonna make Vanilla WoW greater. When in reality, Vanilla WoW is just a reintroduction of the oldest patch of WoW. And current WoW is Vanilla WoW with all those things people want added. And we really don't want anything added.

[Kirchhoff]

This is pretty simple

If it's not "Vanilla as it was" no one will play it.

The vanilla crowd who as been asking for this for years will not play it.
People who wasked for QoL changes and succeeded will eventually quit because they never wanted Vanilla in the first place.

So why in the world should we listen to people who want QoL changes? They dont want Vanilla...

Wrong.

I played vanilla in 2004. I have played on various private servers. I do not play live. I do want some changes to make it better. I will play whatever blizzard releases.

[Slashnox]

What if it is not technically possible? All we know is :"We found an old build".

What if some things cant be fixed for today's clients /servers and need to be recreated from scratch?

Because I can tell you that is not some crazy thing....this kind of issues happen ALL the time in software development and im not meaning the Blizzcon joke "We are gonna need those blade server we gave away back".

Would you see this issue as "This it not Vanilla then" or you can work with a version that tries to be as accurate as possible (but not 100%)?

Making it as it was back then to the best of their extent is what I want and will be happy with no matter the outcome.

But that is completely different from "let's add new models from current WoW because that will make it prettier" or "lets balance the classes becase they were so unbalanced back then"

[Deleted]

Wrong.

I played vanilla in 2004. I have played on various private servers. I do not play live. I do want some changes to make it better. I will play whatever blizzard releases.

Hard to believe you.
But what changes would you like?

It's hard to believe people who ask for changes will play Classic on the long run. "Change me this, change me that". They will quit either way.

[Deleted]

Agree. I understand that some people don't care about classic wow but I don't understand why they are posting in it.

Revenge basically

[Lucavian]

It's easy to understand why Blizzard delayed so long in attempting this endeavor. It's hard to say defiantly what should or should not be in a re-release of classic servers. People who love monks, demon hunters, or death knights for example may have no interest in them. Like to play Draenei, Blood Elves, Worgen, Goblin, or Pandaren, sorry. Enjoy playing paladin? Well I hope you like Alliance and holy spec because the other two specs aren't viable and only Alliance can be paladins. Everything as broad as classes/races/professions to quality of life and services will have to be re-evaluated to see if there is a compromise that needs to be made in allowing a non-classical component into the re-release of the classic servers. Perhaps some are easy (no MoP zones = no Pandas, easy). Others might be a bit more difficult - maybe ret pallies should have the ability to damage after all, nah!

[Akka]

So Classic WoW is only for the people that have asked for it?

I'm pretty sure that after the whole Nostalrius rumble, the constant "we want Vanilla back" threads that were gang-banged with the "wall of no" and the years of asking Blizzard to make vanilla servers, Blizzard commited to Classic Realms to actually please the people who didn't ask for it. Seems logical.

[Ealyssa]

Don't worry too much, wow classic will most likely never happen.

1)The team isn't even recruted, recruitement isn't a fast process, at all.
2)Blizzard is known for being slow at producing pretty much anything
3)Classic wow is just a myth and forums are allready on fire about what is classic. And there is no answer to that, no matter what Blizzard may choose most of the rose tinted community will just be all rage about the "fake classic" and how vanilla was better.

The whole shitstorm is just a loose-loose situation to happen. And I'm beting that blizzard will just bail on it in the end.

[Kirchhoff]

Hard to believe you.
But what changes would you like?

It's hard to believe people who ask for changes will play Classic on the long run. "Change me this, change me that". They will quit either way.

I think the "people who ask for changes won't stick around" argument is weak. It is basically just a way to say that they don't matter, but more PC. There is no way to know that.

• Better graphics (new character models/animations)
• Better class balance (not design changes, small tweaks to make everyone a bit more viable)
• More than 1 tank class
• Remove debuff/buff limit and allow duplicates (goes a long way to fixing the class balance issue)
• Better UI (new calendar, map, mail, bag, bank, dungeon journal, etc.)
• New macro API
• Guild banks
• Possibly some of the new BG's, brawls, and even arenas (but not at the expense of world PvP)
• New PvP honor system
• Re-do of quests (not to make it easier to level, just more enjoyable)

I am sure there are other things that would make it better too, but this is just off the top of my head. Some of this is no doubt because I have "been there and done that". None of it is a deal breaker, but I absolutely feel that vanilla could be improved upon without losing anything.

EDIT: Obviously some of these changes require that the game be re-balanced to a degree (but I think that needs to happen anyway). Along with that, I would encourage blizzard to make some more interesting boss fights. There are way too many tank and spank fights in vanilla (especially in dungeons).

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

Ya unfortunately the loudest opponents of modern changes to Classic wow are often the ones that will contribute the least to the game. I find a significant portion of the people who actively discuss private servers are just complete noobs with respect to both Classic and modern WoW.

Like one out of every four people who challenge me usually say something like "dude I've played Legion its too easy" or go so far as to embellish that they are some standout player.

So of course, my first response is to ask them for a link to their character. Then I get a bunch of words, but not a single one of them is the name of a character.

If your primary aspirations are to level to 60 and take 10 days played doing so, have fun. Leave the discuss to people who want to play Classic for more than 2 months.

If you don't trust Blizzard and the community enough to help shape these decisions, then don't be a part of it. Enjoy private servers!

[babyback]

I think the "people who ask for changes won't stick around" argument is weak. It is basically just a way to say that they don't matter, but more PC. There is no way to know that.

• Better graphics (new character models/animations)
• Better class balance (not design changes, small tweaks to make everyone a bit more viable)
• More than 1 tank class
• Remove debuff/buff limit and allow duplicates (goes a long way to fixing the class balance issue)
• Better UI (new calendar, map, mail, bag, bank, dungeon journal, etc.)
• New macro API
• Guild banks
• Possibly some of the new BG's, brawls, and even arenas (but not at the expense of world PvP)
• New PvP honor system
• Re-do of quests (not to make it easier to level, just more enjoyable)

I am sure there are other things that would make it better too, but this is just off the top of my head. Some of this is no doubt because I have "been there and done that". None of it is a deal breaker, but I absolutely feel that vanilla could be improved upon without losing anything.

EDIT: Obviously some of these changes require that the game be re-balanced to a degree (but I think that needs to happen anyway). Along with that, I would encourage blizzard to make some more interesting boss fights. There are way too many tank and spank fights in vanilla (especially in dungeons).

Sounds like it’s TBC you want.

[Deleted]

I think the "people who ask for changes won't stick around" argument is weak. It is basically just a way to say that they don't matter, but more PC. There is no way to know that.

• Better graphics (new character models/animations)
• Better class balance (not design changes, small tweaks to make everyone a bit more viable)
• More than 1 tank class
• Remove debuff/buff limit and allow duplicates (goes a long way to fixing the class balance issue)
• Better UI (new calendar, map, mail, bag, bank, dungeon journal, etc.)
• New macro API
• Guild banks
• Possibly some of the new BG's, brawls, and even arenas (but not at the expense of world PvP)
• New PvP honor system
• Re-do of quests (not to make it easier to level, just more enjoyable)

I am sure there are other things that would make it better too, but this is just off the top of my head. Some of this is no doubt because I have "been there and done that". None of it is a deal breaker, but I absolutely feel that vanilla could be improved upon without losing anything.

EDIT: Obviously some of these changes require that the game be re-balanced to a degree (but I think that needs to happen anyway). Along with that, I would encourage blizzard to make some more interesting boss fights. There are way too many tank and spank fights in vanilla (especially in dungeons).

Oh god...

With those changes they would have to rebalance the whole game. All bosses, all raids, everything.
With all classes viable and strong, the raids would be easy mode.

Not to mention the PvP would be completely different.

Enh Shaman was shit in PvE but they were gods in PvP. With "class balance changes" for PvE they would outright be Sargeras himself, above all gods in PvP.

You are asking to change the whole game fot the sake of one thing.

[Deleted]

Hard to believe you.
But what changes would you like?

It's hard to believe people who ask for changes will play Classic on the long run. "Change me this, change me that". They will quit either way.

Not the person you quoted, but as someone who has been around since 2005 and is super stoked about classic wow.

I do want a few things, most of them optional.

I want a LFG tool, serverlimited, and no teleport to the instance, it just helps you get a group together instead of spamming LFG channels in main cities. I want it to be a community tool, not a tool for anonymity. Just somewhere a person can go like "Making a group for DM, need x class" and then people can whisper them etc.

I want an OPTIONAL graphic update, new models etc, but it needs to be a toggle. This way both crowds are pleased, the old school people turn the models off and it looks the same as always, and the people who prefer the new models can use them.

Honestly, I do dislike how BAD some specs where, as much fun as I had with stupid builds, it did get frustrating to be so locked in your choice at 60 and in raiding. However, not sure I actually want changes... But I wouldnt hate it if all specs had some level of viability, no design change, just... able to do their role as stated on character creation. It is pretty shitty to have for the paladin Melee DPS, Tank, Healer in the description at char creation, but in reality they can only be healers. Also, potentially give hunters a quiver bagslot, can only hold arrows, but allows them the same bagspace as everyone else. Potentially give every class that uses reagents a reagent bag, just to save that clutter. Reagents are cool tho.

I dont want them to touch items, quests or bosses. If the raids end up being easy, so be it.

So yeah, overall, I love Vanilla WoW for what it was, but I can easily see improvements being made without it being ruined. And I will play it regardless of how they do it tbh. I mean its going to be modernized anyhow, as vanilla WoW wasnt optimized for modern PCs, and I can tell when I've in the past tried private servers just for nostalgia. But yeah, I prefer the style of vanilla, even if it ends up getting diluted, to modern WoW.

[Eveningforest]

...

EDIT: Obviously some of these changes require that the game be re-balanced to a degree (but I think that needs to happen anyway). Along with that, I would encourage blizzard to make some more interesting boss fights. There are way too many tank and spank fights in vanilla (especially in dungeons).

This is priceless.

You're asking for a different game, cupcake...in the Classic subforum.

[Deleted]

Not the person you quoted, but as someone who has been around since 2005 and is super stoked about classic wow.

I do want a few things, most of them optional.

I want a LFG tool, serverlimited, and no teleport to the instance, it just helps you get a group together instead of spamming LFG channels in main cities. I want it to be a community tool, not a tool for anonymity. Just somewhere a person can go like "Making a group for DM, need x class" and then people can whisper them etc.

I want an OPTIONAL graphic update, new models etc, but it needs to be a toggle. This way both crowds are pleased, the old school people turn the models off and it looks the same as always, and the people who prefer the new models can use them.

Honestly, I do dislike how BAD some specs where, as much fun as I had with stupid builds, it did get frustrating to be so locked in your choice at 60 and in raiding. However, not sure I actually want changes... But I wouldnt hate it if all specs had some level of viability, no design change, just... able to do their role as stated on character creation. It is pretty shitty to have for the paladin Melee DPS, Tank, Healer in the description at char creation, but in reality they can only be healers. Also, potentially give hunters a quiver bagslot, can only hold arrows, but allows them the same bagspace as everyone else. Potentially give every class that uses reagents a reagent bag, just to save that clutter. Reagents are cool tho.

I dont want them to touch items, quests or bosses. If the raids end up being easy, so be it.

So yeah, overall, I love Vanilla WoW for what it was, but I can easily see improvements being made without it being ruined. And I will play it regardless of how they do it tbh. I mean its going to be modernized anyhow, as vanilla WoW wasnt optimized for modern PCs, and I can tell when I've in the past tried private servers just for nostalgia. But yeah, I prefer the style of vanilla, even if it ends up getting diluted, to modern WoW.

Well, at least you are not asking to rebalance the entire game.
LFG is debatable and optional Graphics is ok.

But rebalancing the whole game is crazy talk :S

[Kirchhoff]

You will have to re-balance the entire game anyway. Don't kid yourself. Players are flat out better now, know more, have more resources, and most people are asking for everything to be on 1.12, which inflates DPS numbers. If you want raids to be as hard as they were originally, then you have to re-balance them anyway. Which means you might as well make the mechanics more interesting.

And no, I do not want TBC. I want vanilla, but see no reason why feral druids, boomkins, ret paladins, dps shaman, other tank specs, etc. can't get a small boost. And you do it in a way that does not impact PvP that much at all (attack speed, hit%, stacking buff, w/e).

It is silly to think you can't experience vanilla unless classes are imbalanced.