Will Classic Servers save WoW?

[Queen of Hamsters]

Just makes me sad really, there is no need for this shit and I am still a firm believer vanilla can work out. I have loads of mates that will be playing. But the community on forums is really not good. 30/40 year olds acting like they are 12 constantly.

Looking forward to vanilla though, will be playing a troll rogue (played a human priest 13 years ago and I'd like to be doing the ganking this time :P).

Agreed 100%. I was hoping the "us vs them"-mentality would die down, but instead the Recent Forum Posts-field is cluttered with all the toxicity previously maintained in the Classic megathread... Makes me wish we could put entire forums on ignore.

But, I'm apparently "Anti-Vanilla" for being critical and level-headed towards it. I'm waiting to see what they'll do with issues like balancing and such before deciding what I'll roll, with the goal to clear the raid content again but on an official server. :d

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Nothing can save WoW.
It's time for this thing to end.

See you on WoW's 20th anniversary.

[kibil]

Honestly, who said WoW need to be saved? Ok WoD was completely shit (not couting cata the worst ever), but come on. There is just not WoW need to be saved...

Legion it's a great xpack. Some aspects are ugh...ugh... but despite that the xpack its good the best since WotLK.

[Mifuyne]

See you on WoW's 20th anniversary.

Damnit you caught me!

[Alienshroom]

Since you know "the truth" I am sure you can deliver some facts, like retail sale numbers - and I am even more interested in facts showing how "Vanilla is the future"

You could try opening your eyes. For someone who spends so much time on the forum you seem quite ignorant about the state of the game and the community. Want facts? Go check the main page.

[Saradain]

You could try opening your eyes. For someone who spends so much time on the forum you seem quite ignorant about the state of the game and the community. Want facts? Go check the main page.

So no proof of any kind still? Like a fanatic, when confronted and asked for any proof, any kind, no matter how little, you circle around the request and close your eyes, ears and spout some holy verses...

[Wiedzemir]

This is a nonsensical question. WoW still is the #1 MMO out there. It doesn't require any saving. Classic WoW might bring back the crowd that doesn't like the current state of the game but I wouldn't count on 6-12 millions again, not even close to that.

[Demithio]

I'll be playing it my self, so I like to think I'm part of the community but I'll be doing it all solo because I am not touching the "community" that is on this forum with a 10 foot pole.
Holy shit its bad.

Instead of having fair and moderate discussion we often get "classic will be a disaster!" or "Classic will be WoW's savor!" This seems to apply to just about everything on this forum. It is bad. However, once in a while I do see sensible posts from time to time.

[Alienshroom]

So no proof of any kind still? Like a fanatic, when confronted and asked for any proof, any kind, no matter how little, you circle around the request and close your eyes, ears and spout some holy verses...

What more proof do you need other then these servers are happening? Blizzard has seen the data, but there is still not enough there for you? Buzz off

[Gaidax]

Ah yes, the wow dying thread again. These things got old back in WoTLK.

[athrun7189]

Please add a choice : WOW dont need to be saved

[kibil]

I dont think kids play this game a lot anyway. Kids play MOBA.

Lot of people are playing this since a while, at 37 years old, with 2 kids, wife and job, I do not have times to reach rank 14 pvp again. I'm not saying Vanilla wasnt good, but because you prefer Retail do not mean you are a kid.

You already call Retail players "kiddies", this mean the war isnt over!! It's only beginning.

Forums are more active now, and it's not positive with all the garbage we see.

Couldn't agree more with you here.

I don't undertand some people, blizzard is doing what a TON of people asked them to, but why all this hatred and people acting like they were teenagers again??? WTH??

It's a matter of respect, If a person like Classic and will play great, now if a person is more of a retail player fantastic play retail and fucking stop the fight and poiting fingers telling this or that is better or worst. Be an adult person for sake of the game and the gaming comunity.

Majority of WoW players are not KIDS they are 25-40 years old so stop with the hatred again.

Play whatever you like, let all the rest of the world play what they want and will pay for and thats it.

Personally I have 37 years old, I do play WoW since vanilla, and I'll never stop playing it. Yes I LOVE classic and I'll play it, but not as my main thing, I'll stick with retail cause I invested almost 13 years in my main and other alts. Now if all the great friends I had in classic will come back and serious play it, I might switch to it again and will be happy with it, cause that is what made this game great to begin with back there.

Again the hatred we are seeing in the forums now days, will not help at all in the process to make it happen.

[Saradain]

What more proof do you need other then these servers are happening? Blizzard has seen the data, but there is still not enough there for you? Buzz off

Battle for Azeroth is happening. It means retail is in best shape ever, by your logic No data provided, carry on with your fanaticism.

[Eleccybubb]

Instead of having fair and moderate discussion we often get "classic will be a disaster!" or "Classic will be WoW's savor!" This seems to apply to just about everything on this forum. It is bad. However, once in a while I do see sensible posts from time to time.

Problem is this.

One side you have the pure Vanilla zealots who go out of their way to dump on retail and spout that Classic is God's greatest gift to mankind while insulting those who play the current game.

And on the other side you have people who are for some reason so vehemently against the idea of Classic and dump on that version of the game.

Problem is extremes exist on both sides and right now you can tell with this forum a little. Not saying everyone is like that and as you said there are sensible posts but well....

I'm all for discussion but threads like these don't lead to constructive discussion. It's just a clear as day "let's dump on one side to try and be funny" thread.

[Nero Duskwind]

Agreed 100%. I was hoping the "us vs them"-mentality would die down, but instead the Recent Forum Posts-field is cluttered with all the toxicity previously maintained in the Classic megathread... Makes me wish we could put entire forums on ignore.

But, I'm apparently "Anti-Vanilla" for being critical and level-headed towards it. I'm waiting to see what they'll do with issues like balancing and such before deciding what I'll roll, with the goal to clear the raid content again but on an official server. :d

When was the last time you ran into a reasonable purist of anything?

[Deleted]

Agreed 100%. I was hoping the "us vs them"-mentality would die down, but instead the Recent Forum Posts-field is cluttered with all the toxicity previously maintained in the Classic megathread... Makes me wish we could put entire forums on ignore.

But, I'm apparently "Anti-Vanilla" for being critical and level-headed towards it. I'm waiting to see what they'll do with issues like balancing and such before deciding what I'll roll, with the goal to clear the raid content again but on an official server. :d

Could you stop with the agenda that the legacy crowd is toxic?
This was a happy forum before people started asking for QoL changes. This is pretty much the only topic where you see toxicity.
And with reason because this people are trying their best to see this ruined.
We have been asking for this for years and all of a sudden some people want "Vanilla Remastered Super Turbo Remix Edition"

What did you expect?

[Alienshroom]

Battle for Azeroth is happening. It means retail is in best shape ever, by your logic No data provided, carry on with your fanaticism.

I will be carrying on in victory most certainly. I got my severs, I won.

[Saradain]

I will be carrying on in victory most certainly. I got my severs, I won.

And I congratulate you for being able to play the version you prefer. We both can have what we want, without having to take anything away from the other side.

[rda]

So no proof of any kind still? Like a fanatic, when confronted and asked for any proof, any kind, no matter how little, you circle around the request and close your eyes, ears and spout some holy verses...

There are many places with numbers that suggest that Legion is (a) absolutely not gaining subs and continues to lose them, and (b) loses subs at about the same rate as WoD did, give or take.

Let's take a look at raiding, for example. Let's compare the number of kills of easiest boss on easiest mode tracked by wowprogress - taking easiest to make the sample as wide as possible, while still comparing apples to apples:

WoD, tier 17, first boss in Heroic HM: 42070
WoD, tier 18, first boss in Heroic HFC: 29017

You can see that the number went down. That's because the game is losing players. There are other factors, yes, but the main one is that players stop logging in.

Now, Legion:

Legion, tier 19, first boss in Heroic EN: 39561
Legion, tier 20, first boss in Heroic ToS: 24161

What do we see here.

First, the numbers for Legion are going down same as in WoD. It stands to reason that the game is losing about as many players proportionally in the relevant segment. Now, since it's not all players and only the relevant segment = raiders, perhaps more stable than all players - this does not mean yet that Legion lost as many of the overall players as WoD did. But that's not the only set of numbers, you can look at PVP, activity graphs, whatever, and they all show the same thing - Legion is losing players pretty heavily, not much slower than WoD.

Second, the numbers for Legion are a bit lower than for WoD as they stand. And this time, since the numbers only apply to the segment of all players, the segment that we think is more stable than all players, the effect on all players is likely noticeably larger.

That was one example.

[Deleted]

And I congratulate you for being able to play the version you prefer. We both can have what we want, without having to take anything away from the other side.

I was a happy person saying exactly what you are saying everyday...until the "QoL changes crowd" came.
Now it's a constant battle on the battlefield...

[Saradain]

There are many places with numbers that suggest that Legion is (a) absolutely not gaining subs and continues to lose them, and (b) loses subs at about the same rate as WoD did, give or take.

Let's take a look at raiding, for example. Let's compare the number of kills of easiest boss on easiest mode tracked by wowprogress - taking easiest to make the sample as wide as possible, while still comparing apples to apples:

WoD, tier 17, first boss in Heroic HM: 42070
WoD, tier 18, first boss in Heroic HFC: 29017

You can see that the number went down. That's because the game is losing players. There are other factors, yes, but the main one is that players stop logging in.

Now, Legion:

Legion, tier 19, first boss in Heroic EN: 39561
Legion, tier 20, first boss in Heroic ToS: 24161

What do we see here.

First, the numbers for Legion are going down same as in WoD. It stands to reason that the game is losing about as many players proportionally in the relevant segment. Now, since it's not all players and only the relevant segment = raiders, perhaps more stable than all players - this does not mean yet that Legion lost as many of the overall players as WoD did. But that's not the only set of numbers, you can look at PVP, activity graphs, whatever, and they all show the same thing - Legion is losing players pretty heavily, not much slower than WoD.

Second, the numbers for Legion are a bit lower than for WoD as they stand. And this time, since the numbers only apply to the segment of all players, the segment that we think is more stable than all players, the effect on all players is likely noticeably larger.

That was one example.

You forget one cold fact; LFR players are the absolute majority, and they do also count for the subscriber amount, which is something not many accept here, for some odd reason...

Blizzard has not released sub numbers for a while now, I'm not in the condition to do hard math how you determine the progression in sub numbers, but I recall your argument being presented before, and it was debunked - but I cannot find a link right now, so I won't outright say you are wrong.