We finally know WoW's sub count post-Legion! (kinda)

[Shadowferal]

Considering the high fluctuation wow has i somehow believe they just would need 4 years for that.
People sub, level a character, see that endgame sucks for them, and quit again.

There is that other side of the equation...

[Ghostile]

The way it seems Blizz is counting subscription numbers it's a wonder they don't claim 50 million subscribers at one point.

Bet they paid Bellular and Asmon to agree with them.

[Dracullus]

where are people seeing 4m players? the spike from sod makes the graph go from 5 millions to 7

Numbers are completely irrelevant cause they come from Bellurar speculation. Point of this graph is that we have same amount of subs as Legion launch, low point of SL was very similar to BfA's and Legion, SL height was as big as 2019 Classic and finally - there is no downfall trend from 2016 to now, WoW simply has ups and downs. So basically it wrecked whole doomsayer narrative from last 10 years, look like mad they act now, it looks like hornets defending their nest.

[Shadowferal]

Bet they paid Bellular and Asmon to agree with them.

Well, they can't say anything negative anyway. How would it go if they said;
"Well, after most go through their cancelation cycle a month or so after an expansion or patch release, we're down to 5% of peak."
I mean what have they said about SL and bfa when they were on the forefront?

[schmonz]

There is that other side of the equation...

Well, the subs are not really high compared to how the number of pc players grew in the past. When WoW was at its peak, 2008, there were around 1.1bn pc gamers. Today it is 1.86bn PC gamers.

Source: https://explodingtopics.com/blog/pc-gaming-stats

While wow had a total concurrent sub count of 12-13m subs in those days, it nowadays has 8m subs, shared among multiple different versions of world of warcraft. While it had the same amount of subs earlier for retail.

Compared to the grown size of the total PC playerbase, and taking in credit that way more than a total of 100m players already played WoW, it obviously cannot adress any kind of majority of players for any longer. Also considering that the amount of players drops always short after a new expac or classic version releases.

In total: WoW changed from being the first broad audience MMORPG to adress different niches. WoW retail nowadays adresses transmog casuals and hardcore raiders / hard dungeon players, classic adresses old players from the former generation, hardcore addresses a small hardcore gamer niche and a large youtube video audience. And whenever retail releases a new expac, it lures in millions of players just to drop down back to a new low after either more or less of expac lifetime. Infact, blizzard abandoned the mass market in favor of a few niches, while they could adress way more players than in 2008 nowadays, and even could gain back all the old players if they either would adress their gameplay needs in additional versions of the game or if retail would cater to many again.

That is at least my conclusion. You are free to disagree.

[potis]

For real, Is this such a big deal?. That the graphic is showing 7.25m subs and everyone is like: "OMG, WoW is alive and well!".
I'm more like: "Meh...is not like i'm going to play Dragonflight and in the case of the new expansion, I will wait until there are reviews of it, before even purchase it. Not making that mistake again".

See, this logic is something i do not understand.

"This restaurant i know for 20 years, is gonna release the same exact food menu that they release every 2 years and keep it alive for ..lets say Xmas Season, i have tasted it 10 times before, it was always the same but this time i am gonna wait".

You are gonna do 5 story lines per area with 4 or 5 areas that will guide you to the dungeons, with a general story guiding you to the big bad in the raid with 8 dungeons to gear up, which is the same as always for more than a decade.

I really dont understand how people can be so disconnected about the game you play.

Level, dungeons, raid, repeat dungeons and raid 2-3 more times, unsub in between.

[Altmer]

See, this logic is something i do not understand.

"This restaurant i know for 20 years, is gonna release the same exact food menu that they release every 2 years and keep it alive for ..lets say Xmas Season, i have tasted it 10 times before, it was always the same but this time i am gonna wait".

You are gonna do 5 story lines per area with 4 or 5 areas that will guide you to the dungeons, with a general story guiding you to the big bad in the raid with 8 dungeons to gear up, which is the same as always for more than a decade.

I really dont understand how people can be so disconnected about the game you play.

Level, dungeons, raid, repeat dungeons and raid 2-3 more times, unsub in between.

If I ever mention the name "Belullar" on these forums, I would be cursed and made fun for even mentioning him in a post. But here we are....with a thread about the "sub count post Legion" that Belullar made and now everyone praise this graphic for being "accurate".
Imagine if Asmongold ever mention something like this and say possitive things about the game....he could become the king of MMO Champ. But because he is a critic about the game, he is hated. Same with Belullar. I think both guys are smart, that is why I watch them, otherwise I would have ignored them long time ago.

About the game...I like WoW, specially the races and classes (except Evoker and Lizard race). I know is always like that, they do the same things for years in terms of design. But my problem, like I have said several times (and as Belullar and Asmon had said as well) is that the story telling is bad. The writing is really bad. And that is why I don't play Dragonflight. If we get a really nice story in the Saga, I would be playing without any problem. That is all I want...

Not a "Doomer" or just for the sake of being negative. Is just that I don't like today "WoW story". That is all.

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I should ask the mods to close the topic now that you've officially ended all possible discussion about it with your poignant insight. Thanks!

No need for drama....

[potis]

snip

Sorry to inform you, i dont watch clickbait idiot streamers, what they say is irrelevant to me, quite the opposite, people i know tend to annoy me about said videos and i just shut them down.

I dont need some streamer to tell me how WoW is, neither does it matter cause i play in my own bubble, but my anecdotal evidence is when LFR as DPS the first ~2 months in S3 was below 10mins, tank was barely a minute and healer was instant, aka, people are playing, are all i need compared to the average mmo-champion doomer since these numbers scale up and down when the game is active/inactive and its really easy to tell when there is a shit ton of people online.

I was commenting on your particular thread like, you are playing WoW for the story? You are already playing the wrong game, which has had the same story for 15 years + ever since they started bothering, aka averagely around WoTLK.

Its literally "Baddie of Area to dungeon", "Baddies of Expansion" copy/pasted every 2 years, the good guys win, woohoo.

As i said, this is logic i dont understand, its like saying you are gonna wait to see this superhero movie, when we already know the superhero is gonna win..What are you gonna watch if not the CGI effects and maybe a twist in the story, or introduction of some forgotten superhero, or some easter egg reference which are all expected either way?

[Mysterymask]

I don't get some of y'all...

The graph just says wow is doing fine and some of y'all are like *IMPOSSIBLE WOW IS DEAD "

Like it's not even doing super amazing or like the 10 mil it was its showing mostly market saturation and that's yalls problem that there might be 5 million who think the game is "fine"

[potis]

The graph just says wow is doing fine and some of y'all are like *IMPOSSIBLE WOW IS DEAD "

Cause this forum is a wow hate echo chamber of the repeated 15 weirdos that create account after account to pretend they didnt waste some time in their past that they took more seriously or has value in their brain, only to be exposed repeatedly that they are just wrong, or bad at the game, or their irrelevant experience is exactly that, as irrelevant as their opinion about the game.

They have been screaming for so long and now the first official data in years shows them "You are wrong, once again", so they are screeching.

The most fun are the ones claiming fake profits because they cant understand how illegal that is but somehow, magically only Blizzard does this and gets away with it.

Most of these basically have some sort of inferiority complex syndrome that unless they are given freebie Mythic gear, the game will never be as they want it to be, therefor it must die.

And a few more with legit whines about the game that again most are just preferences, like the people crying about the story..acceptable, but who plays these god damn games for the story, pay a month, play the story, unsub, what are you screeching in mmo-champion for which as the trend shows an we already know, its what 50% the population has been doing for a decade now.

They play the first 2 months, and unsub , why is it so hard for you to do it also?

[Ghostile]

Well, they can't say anything negative anyway.

I'm surprised someone unaware who Bellular and Asmon are still exists.

[potis]

I'm surprised someone unaware who Bellular and Asmon are still exists.

He is not unaware, they no longer hit his narrative, so he pretends he doesnt know who they are now.

[Mysterymask]

He is not unaware, they no longer hit his narrative, so he pretends he doesnt know who they are now.

Tbf his narrative is "Blizzard is going to buy my fanfic and Incorporate it into wow you'll see"

[Altmer]

Snip

What i'm expecting from this "superhero" movie, is a story worth listening and watching. Just like FF14 MSQ from Heavensward to Endwalker, I know that the hero (that we are playing) is going to win. But the challenges in the story, the plot twists and secrets that are being revelead actually intrige me to the point i want to know more about it. Just like I learned about the reasons for the Ascians to be evil in FF14 and who they were. And also who was the real enemy to defeat.

But in WoW, i'm expecting the same. They did a good job in Legion, because now we know how Sargeras looks like (officialy and with a cinematic, no more descriptions of him that comes from books or other sources, the real thing made in the game) what he was trying to do (and failed to do) and how he was using another Titan to revive his army of demons. Now, that was a good story with good characters (Khadgar, Alleria, Turalion, Thalyssra, etc). I can't say the same with Dragonflight horrible story writing and plot (or boring characters). For real, Fyrakk is really lame as an enemy. And the same I can say with all the story so far in the Dragon Isles. I didn't felt anything when they bring Tyr back, because how they write the story was really bad. Like, we have Tyr back, now what...?.

Sorry that I don't like it, is just my opinion and the reason I watch those "clickbait idiot streamers" is because they make sense to me on how I feel about WoW. Specially Asmongold and Belullar.

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He is not unaware, they no longer hit his narrative, so he pretends he doesnt know who they are now.

And know you guys pretends that Belullar exist, just because he "guessed" the subs numbers and they look good for you guys....

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Tbf his narrative is "Blizzard is going to buy my fanfic and Incorporate it into wow you'll see"

They haven't been able to incorporate any good story since BFA, Shadowlands and now Dragonflight. I have no idea what to expect from the World Soul Saga. They had to bring back Chris Metzen from retirement, in order to save the day.

[potis]

Sorry that I don't like it, is just my opinion and the reason I watch those "clickbait idiot streamers" is because they make sense to me on how I feel about WoW. Specially Asmongold and Belullar.

So you openly claim you are of lower intelligence that you let the cultural effect of streamers making money OFF your lower intelligence by simply following the narrative that others create and somehow i am supposed to take you seriously?

Haha.

I wonder whose alt-account of the usual 15 suspects you are.

[Altmer]

So you openly claim you are of lower intelligence that you let the cultural effect of streamers making money OFF your lower intelligence by simply following the narrative that others create and somehow i am supposed to take you seriously?.

I think calling it "lower intelligence" is insulting and not relevant to this conversation. What I actually believe is that they express their dislike about the things i also dislike and make accurate points in the current state of WoW. Asmon makes really good points about the game and why he is no longer playing retail.

I wonder whose alt-account of the usual 15 suspects you are

I deleted my 15 years old account back in December 2020 or probably January 2021, because of the horrible state of WoW with Shadowlands. I just returned recently with this new account. Also, I'm not interested in your drama and passive aggresive attitude. You can keep that to yourself. I'm just here to express my dislike on what I think is not working for WoW.

[doledippers]

I'm just here to express my dislike on what I think is not working for WoW.

unfortunately (well, fortunately in this case) it doesn't matter what you think when the numbers prove you wrong

[potis]

Asmon makes really good points about the game and why he is no longer playing retail.

You cant make this stuff up, and you cant be serious, the guy pretending to be elitist while getting carried by others about how casuals suck and should die in a pit of fire for being shit at the game, that created his following, which he then realised he just has to say retarded shit that are the hype to make millions of dollars out of your type.

And somehow you think, this argument works against people with knowledge about the game?

Man, the gaming world is so fucking dead, no wonder all we are gonna get is 90$ games and cosmetics when this is your answer.

[Altmer]

unfortunately (well, fortunately in this case) it doesn't matter what you think when the numbers prove you wrong

Why would they prove me wrong? Shadowlands really sucked to the point it reach 4.5m. People love "Classic" and it went up to 8.27m. With Dragonflight it was going down around the line of the 5.8m and recover because of Season 3 and SoD and went up to 7.25m.
The thing is, that maybe you believe that 7.25m is thanks only to DF, while actually "Classic SoD" was a big part of the success. Happened before with the 8.27m with "Classic"

[doledippers]

Why would they prove me wrong? Shadowlands really sucked to the point it reach 4.5m. People love "Classic" and it went up to 8.27m. With Dragonflight it was going down around the line of the 5.8m and recover because of Season 3 and SoD and went up to 7.25m.
The thing is, that maybe you believe that 7.25m is thanks only to DF, while actually "Classic SoD" was a big part of the success. Happened before with the 8.27m with "Classic"

shows that despite your constant moaning, DF is actually quite popular amongst those who, yknow, actually play it. retention and all. stronger final season than s1, unheard of