Thoughts on selling your game off sex appeal (Stellar Blade) in 2024?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Do those gameplay clips happen to be showing of the story?

Either you are reading a description, which is part of the story.

Or

watching clips of said story.


There is no other way of knowing her character without those. no story = no character

I mean I have no idea if the game has a like arena mode where you can just fight mobs or if every thing is technically part of the story by being in a story missions.

But I’ve never seen any cutscenes or QTE’s (does it have QTE’S?) I don’t even know how she’s voiced. I’ve pretty much have only seen random combat normally in videos about like Devil may cry or other hack and slash games, and some super smash if that counts.

And your right I don’t know her character that’s why I said assuming she’s not super timid in story, I’m just pointing out some observations from purely gameplay that may or may not fit her actual character I don’t know.

[Orange Joe]

I've never taken the angle of "Bayonetta is designed by a women so it's fine", you might be confusing me with someone else.

The rest is being muddled by OJs constant accusations of things I never said.

And to be clear, my point is just simply that I can see why some people would be okay with Bayonetta but not Eve, currently. I don't agree with the sexualization part though, to which I'd ask do you disagree that Bayonetta is portrayed in a powerful way? I personally think so.

And it could very well turn out that Eve is an extremely powerful figure too in this way, but as of right now I can see where some people's ire might target her and not Bayonetta, because we don't know Eves story. I made the mistake admittedly of saying Stellar Blade could be more sexualized to some than Bayonetta, Bayonetta is the clear winner there, but I don't think many would disagree that it's not done in an empowering way, rather than an objectifying way.

To me that's the current clear difference and why I don't agree that people are hypocritical for liking one over the other. Personally, I don't care much for either, but to each their own.

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So where's my statements on the story or saying Eve is bad, coz I'm waiting on that.

Saying she seems to not have personality at the moment isn't saying she's bad, and I've already agreed with another user that it could be a great story plot, but that's all I've mentioned about that. You're failing to actually address what I'm asking you to quote and instead keep building strawman.

In your world are good characters "replaceable" with "no personality"? Or??

and again you can only learn the character through the story. by mentioning character development you are talking about the story that said development happens.

[Jester Joe]

In your world are good characters "replaceable" with "no personality"? Or??

We call what you're doing an assumption.

Mario is a great character to me who could easily be replaced in most of his games too ya know. I don't deny that Mario himself isn't exactly a defining character but he still has a lot of charm to his design and personality that does show despite having almost no voice lines.

[Orange Joe]

We call what you're doing an assumption.

Mario is a great character to me who could easily be replaced in most of his games too ya know.

yeah thats called a bad character...... If they are replaceable they aren't good.

[Jester Joe]

yeah thats called a bad character...... If they are replaceable they aren't good.

So every character who isn't a main character is a bad character to you.

You see how silly that sounds?

[Orange Joe]

So every character who isn't a main character is a bad character to you.

You see how silly that sounds?

We are talking about main characters are we not?

[Big Thanks]

people when my entire first post was simply telling someone "people can enjoy Bayonetta and dislike Eve".

No
You implied is NOT hypocrisy only having a problem with Eve and not Bayonetta.
And why is that?
Because you heavily imply "is done better with Bayonetta" and "is done wrong, admitted by dev it was intentional for her to be hot" reason

In my opinion this is all bull and IT IS hypocrisy

[Jester Joe]

We are talking about main characters are we not?

I mean I thought we're injecting arguments, strawman, and assumptions on others.

If side characters can be replaceable and good characters still, theres no reason why main ones can't. I even gave you a perfect example and you ignored it.

But either way it's completely irrelevant, because you quoted me saying Eve is replaceable, to which I said "I don't think that makes her bad".

And now you're going "well it does to ME, so that means I'm going to argue that it does make her bad and that you believe that too".
Which is a strawman...? Or am I not allowed to have a different opinion than you, because this is the point where you have the chance to realize not everyone views characters the same way as you and that doesn't mean you're the sole decider on what makes a character good or not.

EVEN IF you think I'm wrong for feeling like good characters could be replaceable, and even IF I am wrong on that, it doesn't change that isn't the way I was using the statement nor my intention, and it's really silly to keep trying to argue the point after the clarification.

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No
You implied is NOT hypocrisy only having a problem with Eve and not Bayonetta.
And why is that?
Because you heavily imply "is done better with Bayonetta" and "is done wrong, admitted by dev it was intentional for her to be hot" reason

In my opinion this is all bull and IT IS hypocrisy

I didn't imply it was "not hypocritical". I straight up told you it's not, because people can like what they like and Eve and Bayonetta are two completely different characters.

I guess it was a mistake to focus on the sexualization but that was your major ire so I tried to address it, but you don't seem to want to acknowledge that there's far more to Bayonetta and why people like her than just that.

[Orange Joe]

I mean I thought we're injecting arguments, strawman, and assumptions on others.

If side characters can be replaceable and good characters still, theres no reason why main ones can't. I even gave you a perfect example and you ignored it.

But either way it's completely irrelevant, because you quoted me saying Eve is replaceable, to which I said "I don't think that makes her bad".

And now you're going "well it does to ME, so that means I'm going to argue that it does make her bad and that you believe that too".
Which is a strawman...? Or am I not allowed to have a different opinion than you, because this is the point where you have the chance to realize not everyone views characters the same way as you and that doesn't mean you're the sole decider on what makes a character good or not.

EVEN IF you think I'm wrong for feeling like good characters could be replaceable, and even IF I am wrong on that, it doesn't change that isn't the way I was using the statement nor my intention, and it's really silly to keep trying to argue the point after the clarification.

how many quotes of you stanning bayonetta and (not insulting) eve did I show and you focus only on that one?


My dude your bias is showing more than you think it is. anyways have fun with those blinders I'll be back later.

[Big Thanks]

I didn't imply it was "not hypocritical". I straight up told you it's not, because people can like what they like and Eve and Bayonetta are two completely different characters.

I guess it was a mistake to focus on the sexualization but that was your major ire so I tried to address it, but you don't seem to want to acknowledge that there's far more to Bayonetta and why people like her than just that.

No, man!
I think is hypocrisy to dislike the Eve SEXUALIZATION and not the Bayonetta sexualization.

It kinda is dumb even!
Since Bayonetta actually plays out and gives actual sexual mannerisms (i think this is the right word) and Eve does not.
She is just...hot.

[Jester Joe]

how many quotes of you stanning bayonetta and (not insulting) eve did I show and you focus only on that one?


My dude your bias is showing more than you think it is. anyways have fun with those blinders I'll be back later.

You're still failing to give any quotes of me hating Eve and talking about the story at all. You can just admit you were mistaken instead of constantly retorting to weird bait. I mean, crazy, I talked about Bayonetta a lot after you kept quoting me. So if I keep asking you about apple pie, and you keep mentioning apple pie, that must mean you love apple pie and hate pumpkin pie.

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No, man!
I think is hypocrisy to dislike the Eve SEXUALIZATION and not the Bayonetta sexualization.

It kinda is dumb even!
Since Bayonetta actually plays out and gives actual sexual mannerisms (i think this is the right word) and Eve does not.
She is just...hot.

I mean you had a quote where you seemed to even take issue with people liking Bayonetta because of her personality even, in spite of the sexualization. This was from one of the first posts I replied to you, but if that isn't what you mean now I'm willing to hear that out.

[Al Gorefiend]

She is.

People who try to single out Stellar Blade as some sort "OMUHGAD the red line was crossed" are full of it. All the crazies got out of their caves over practically a standard Korean/Japanese game fare.

Thanks IGN, I guess.

Games like these do not give players dress-up options because they want to dress people.

They give players dress-up options because they want to undress people.

Edit: You aren't even the person I quoted and I do not know how to delete comments. Idk why this is happening, is this happening to anyone else? @Jester Joe is who this is directed to

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More than Eve is highly debatable since Eve literally has a dress up doll feature.

this quote lol

[Jester Joe]

Games like these do not give players dress-up options because they want to dress people.

They give players dress-up options because they want to undress people.

Edit: You aren't even the person I quoted and I do not know how to delete comments. Idk why this is happening, is this happening to anyone else? @Jester Joe is who this is directed to

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this quote lol

I've had it happen once ever to my genuine confusion.
Usually it's when I use multiquote and then come back to that thread, sometimes it will remember what I used multiquote with for some reason.

But there was once that it just weirdly somehow used a completely different quote.

[Itori]

Heres the thing about asia. They do not care about western opinions on their idea of beauty. They never will. Korea especially if you take the time to read their manwha, watch their anime, or their dramas, majority of all of them are full of this “over exaggerated beauty” its their MO at this point.

I tried stellar blade thinking it was going to be a T&A cash grab but after i tried the demo i pre ordered. Its a mix of dark souls, bayonetta and nier automata all in one package and im here for it.

TLDR: if a hyper sexualized female lead turns you off on a game..just dont buy it.

[Eapoe]

I've never taken the angle of "Bayonetta is designed by a women so it's fine", you might be confusing me with someone else.

The rest is being muddled by OJs constant accusations of things I never said.

And to be clear, my point is just simply that I can see why some people would be okay with Bayonetta but not Eve, currently. I don't agree with the sexualization part though, to which I'd ask do you disagree that Bayonetta is portrayed in a powerful way? I personally think so.

And it could very well turn out that Eve is an extremely powerful figure too in this way, but as of right now I can see where some people's ire might target her and not Bayonetta, because we don't know Eves story. I made the mistake admittedly of saying Stellar Blade could be more sexualized to some than Bayonetta, Bayonetta is the clear winner there, but I don't think many would disagree that it's not done in an empowering way, rather than an objectifying way.

To me that's the current clear difference and why I don't agree that people are hypocritical for liking one over the other. Personally, I don't care much for either, but to each their own. And to be clear, I'm not saying I agree Eve is objectified currently, I'm just saying I can see how people might get that impression.

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So where's my statements on the story or saying Eve is bad, coz I'm waiting on that.

Saying she seems to not have personality at the moment isn't saying she's bad, and I've already agreed with another user that it could be a great story plot, but that's all I've mentioned about that. You're failing to actually address what I'm asking you to quote and instead keep building strawman.

I believe you had a post where you linked an article from the woman who designed her, and in context of the discussion at the time this made it seem like her design isn’t as much of an issue to Eve’s since a woman designed her original appearance.
I’m not debating that Bayonetta is portrayed in a powerful way. Never once had that on my mind. My point has been that she is every bit as much sexualized as Eve, and probably even more so as the entire game is based around sexualizing Bayonetta (which I know you just stated this).
There is some debate as to whether objectification occurs with Bayonetta, as I’ve seen different articles about it concerning her being a character created by a man. Interesting debate as to whether her agency actually applies. I personally believe that objectification is still in full effect, yet hidden and nuanced due to how she is presented in game.

[Jester Joe]

I believe you had a post where you linked an article from the woman who designed her, and in context of the discussion at the time this made it seem like her design isn’t as much of an issue to Eve’s since a woman designed her original appearance.
I’m not debating that Bayonetta is portrayed in a powerful way. Never once had that on my mind. My point has been that she is every bit as much sexualized as Eve, and probably even more so as the entire game is based around sexualizing Bayonetta (which I know you just stated this).
There is some debate as to whether objectification occurs with Bayonetta, as I’ve seen different articles about it concerning her being a character created by a man. Interesting debate as to whether her agency actually applies. I personally believe that objectification is still in full effect, yet hidden and nuanced due to how she is presented in game.

Nah I was linking the blog to show the only art direction they were given was like, 3 bullet points of "witch", "female", and "has 4 guns" along with "give her glasses", nothing about her needing to be hot or anything, because I think someone at the time claimed she was also forced to be hot in design or something.

I honestly had no idea the artist was a female until people pointed that out.

[Triceron]

I'm lost on how you think that's OJs points and not what I'm saying.

OJ is repeatedly trying to say the sexualization is the exact same thing and there's no nuance at all, if you like one and dislike the other, it's hypocritical to him.

My point was the one that there's differences and it's perfectly valid that people might enjoy one but dislike the other.

There ISN'T any nuance if you're trying to objectively define one. That is the point.

All of the nuance in this discussion is in the realm of Subjective opinion. Ergo, no wrong or right, no collectively agreed upon line or threshold for acceptable or unacceptable sexualization. This is especially the case if we take different cultures and social norms into account.

[Jester Joe]

There ISN'T any nuance if you're trying to objectively define one. That is the point.

All of the nuance in this discussion is in the realm of Subjective opinion. Ergo, no wrong or right, no collectively agreed upon line or threshold for acceptable or unacceptable sexualization. This is especially the case if we take different cultures and social norms into account.

I genuinely do not get why you are coming into here then saying that OJ is right when he is trying to say "It's hypocritical to be fine with one and not the other" if you agree it's subjective either way, which is more in line with what I've been saying from the start.

This literally all started because one poster said "It's not fine to dislike Eve but like Bayonetta" and I disagreed, because I can see why people would have different views of both, which part of that is because it's subjective.

[Triceron]

I genuinely do not get why you are coming into here then saying that OJ is right when he is trying to say "It's hypocritical to be fine with one and not the other" if you agree it's subjective either way, which is more in line with what I've been saying from the start.

This literally all started because one poster said "It's not fine to dislike Eve but like Bayonetta" and I disagreed, because I can see why people would have different views of both, which part of that is because it's subjective.

Because you accused him of being a hypocrit for something that is purely subjective and NOT exclusive to sexualized characters.

You were accusing him of being hypocritical for liking snd not liking different games that have sexualized characters in them. There's nothing hypocritical about that since liking any game has little to do with the presence of sexualized characters.. He answered quite genuiniely.

He responds that it's only hypocritical if sexualization of the characters was the ONLY FACTOR that you are using to define 'liking a game'. You didn't leave any room to consider he could like one game because of its gameplay or story over the other. You don't even bother to consider that as a response. You are hyper focusing on the discussion of sexualized characters while not acknowledging what you are calling out as hypocritical, because liking any game is a standard that is much broader than just a Sexualized character in any game, and you can't just broadly accuse someone for being a hypocrit for simply liking one game over another on the basis that they both have sexualized characters.

His response is given IN SPITE of both games having sexualized characters, not because of it, because that is the nature of the accusation you presented.

[Jester Joe]

Because you aren't reading what he's saying, you're reading what you want to hear.

You were basically telling him he's being hypocritical for not liking one game and liking another game when both characters are sexualized.

I'm...fairly certain you're misreading here hard.

OJ is the one calling ME hypocritical multiple times and saying that there is no difference, they're both the same. My entire point here is that NO ONE is hypocritical for preferring one over the other. I've said that multiple times.

He responds that it's only hypocritical if sexualization of the characters was the ONLY FACTOR that you are using to define 'liking a game'. You didn't leave any room to consider he could like one game because of its gameplay or story over the other. You don't even bother to consider that as a response. You are hyper focusing on the discussion of sexualized characters while not acknowledging what you are calling out as hypocritical, because liking any game is a standard that is much broader than just a Sexualized character in any game, and you can't just broadly accuse someone for being a hypocrit for simply liking one game over another on the basis that they both have sexualized characters.

His response is given IN SPITE of both games having sexualized characters, not because of it, because that is the nature of the accusation you presented.

Again, like I said, there's one user here calling others hypocritical, and it ain't me.