Patch 2.4.2 PTR Notes Update

[Rubin]

So by your reasoning we should imply that Blizzard's solution to druids which you say is their problem is giving an unheard-of instant cast crowd control spell to a class that most likely will never use it to its full potential?

In a tournament that the final prize is a shit-load of money I don't expect teams to fuck around but instead choose whatever is best to counter-comp their opponents (welcome to 3v3). How can you base your whole argument around a tournament which has so much variability when it comes to class utilization? And once again only a handful of players can take the hunter class as far as 2200 rating so it isn't surprising that the numbers aren't high at all.

Last but not least:

Ever heard of intimidating shout? How about blind? Last time I checked neither have cast times. No one has ever heard of those though. And you continuously refute yourself..."And once again only a handful of players can take the hunter class as far as 2200 rating..." soooo, wait; does this mean the hunter class is extremely difficult to get a high rating with so Blizzard should do something to help it counter the most over powered class in the game? I'm willing to bet that all those hunters who managed to get 2400 ratings on the live realms tried to do it again on the tournament realms and failed. When it comes down to it, hunters are going to lose to the best of the best every time. And that is an issue Blizzard is working on.

[Nathanyel]

Boub didn't you make like a seperate forum for pvp and arena? I'm really starting to get pissed by them 2.2k emos.
Every 3 out of 4 topics is pvp nowadays. And it's not like there's a lot to talk about. Just PVE vs PVP, PVP vs whinyPVP, moar rating vs less rating. C'mon seriously.

Agreed. I keep getting notifications of new replies to this topic for days, yet nothing new ever is said. *unsubscribes*

[Rubin]

Agreed. I keep getting notifications of new replies to this topic for days, yet nothing new ever is said. *unsubscribes*

Did you seriously just complain about people replying in this thread and not saying anything new by bumping the thread again?

[Pyrostemplar]

dude, stop talking...you look like a fool. Wait, you are a fool. But you shouldn't want to look like one in front of the whole internet. The whole WORLD(of warcraft) is figuring out that nothing you say makes any sense at all. There are 2v2 teams on the tournament realms. 3v3 and 2v2 are pretty close when it comes to balancing. Mages have consistently been shown to be well represented in 2v2 and 2v2 until you reach the 2200 bracket by many, many scans of the top players in the world. Hunters have consistently been among the bottom classes, along with paladins. I never said "hunters have it bad." But as of now they have one legitimate playing option, resto druid. And that is true for most classes. That is why this scare beast has been implemented. And to finish the sentence, you cannot argue that because a few extremely "talented"(talent in parentheses because being good at a video game is a lame thing to call someone talented at cause they are wasting their life) have succeeded, does not mean the class is balanced. Druids should not take less significantly less skill than all other classes to succeed at.

To all - please use paragraphs.

Class representation:

The worse 2v2 class atm are mages, with palas, shamies and hunters not much better (well shamies a bit better). Only below 1600 rankings (quite below) do mages outnumber hunters (which means that their median classification is bellow hunters - well, actually bellow every other class).

http://vhairi.blogspot.com/2008/04/u...pril-2008.html

If you mean by "well represented" being at 27% of the target representation (100%) @ 2000, well you are a natural born politician :P

One could also digress about the hunter design should actually be - by far - the worse performer in the arenas - and that their poor standings reflect more of the arena design failures than any hunter class frailties.

Anyway, imo arena is a sidegame that should simply be removed from wow into the CS minded realms - like the tournament one

Btw, does anyone knows if it is being popular or not really?

[Rubin]

Mages are more balanced on the tournament realm and in 3v3 and 5v5 on live realms. Many mages have been successful in 2v2 and I think the tournament realm shows that mages are able to achieve in all the brackets.

[Digitrevx]

The only reason why hunter numbers are down is because 90% are keyboard turning clickers that can't play worth shit. It's one of the classes that people play ez-mode in battlegrounds because there isn't any LoS collision and they hop into arenas thinking they're just gonna stand there shooting at things.

This is a over exaggeration, right? I'd suggest you arena at 2k with a hunter and get back to us.

[tet]

This is a over exaggeration, right? I'd suggest you arena at 2k with a hunter and get back to us.

I do, he's called Hamchook. Look up his info and let me know. Obliterated BG9 teams in WSVGs even before hunters got their dead-zone buff and dispel/ms.

Ever heard of intimidating shout? How about blind? Last time I checked neither have cast times. No one has ever heard of those though.

Yea because those are really practical for CC right? I mean not that they have 3 minute cooldowns or anything. Not to mention the fact that hunters already have other means of crowd control.

And you continuously refute yourself..."And once again only a handful of players can take the hunter class as far as 2200 rating..." soooo, wait; does this mean the hunter class is extremely difficult to get a high rating with so Blizzard should do something to help it counter the most over powered class in the game? I'm willing to bet that all those hunters who managed to get 2400 ratings on the live realms tried to do it again on the tournament realms and failed. When it comes down to it, hunters are going to lose to the best of the best every time. And that is an issue Blizzard is working on.

"And once again only a handful of players can take the hunter class as far as 2200 rating... at the tournament realm". Thanks for taking my sentence out of context. "Does this mean the hunter class is extremely difficult?" Not extremely, but like I've replied again and again it takes more of an effort to play a hunter in arenas that it does in any other aspect of the game... therefore since most cannot make the transition, they fail.

This is what you're not getting: WHAT THE FUCK does balancing hunters have to do with reducing the number of druids in arena? NOTHING. Because when all is said and done, even with an instant hunter fear, the number of druids WILL NOT decrease. What do you think priest will take the helm or something? Yea cause they aren't already counter-comped by Viper Sting and double melee teams?

Links to great hunters that have defeated the best of the best:
http://wire.ggl.com/2007/11/27/hamch...petitive-game/
http://www.gameriot.com/blogs/World-...d-Team-Speaks/

[Rubin]

The cooldown on intimidating shout is 30 seconds, less with set bonus. A vast majority of the teams above 1700 ratings are druid/dps. This will be GREATLY reconsidered by these teams when this change takes place, and it will most certainly bump hunter from the bottom to balanced. If you think that's a bad idea because you play a druid or with a druid well then that's something you need to work out. You can't have every team running around with a druid on it, it has to end somewhere.

[Hasulito]

Did you look at the numbers lately? Hunters indeed needed a buff. Do only COMPLETE retards post here lately? Is this the 10year-old-cry-forum or what?

wow, did you realy say you guys need a buff? There are other classes which should get buffed!! (e.g. Shamen).
Anyway, there are to many "Legolas" running around which have no skills and cry till they got their "easy win button". I know so many Hunter, that are soooooo bad in this game it hurts and many of them are also on the Tournament Realm and thats why it looks like you guys have a huge disadvantage. Skilled player switch to healing classes, cause this is today the biggest challenge in wow; in arena and pve. Its not dps'ing and not tanking.

[Rubin]

wow, did you realy say you guys need a buff? There are other classes which should get buffed!! (e.g. Shamen).
Anyway, there are to many "Legolas" running around which have no skills and cry till they got their "easy win button". I know so many Hunter, that are soooooo bad in this game it hurts and many of them are also on the Tournament Realm and thats why it looks like you guys have a huge disadvantage. Skilled player switch to healing classes, cause this is today the biggest challenge in wow; in arena and pve. Its not dps'ing and not tanking.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume English is your second language. Anywho...I don't think a Lord of the Rings character and some bad hunters you know is enough to attribute hunters' lack of representation in higher arena brackets to the players just being bad. I know a ton of really terrible warriors who just picked the class because 'warriors are the coolest.' How does this factor in to warriors being hugely represented? Shouldn't they not be in the top arenas cause kids just pick it to be cool and stink at their class?

[tet]

The cooldown on intimidating shout is 30 seconds, less with set bonus. A vast majority of the teams above 1700 ratings are druid/dps. This will be GREATLY reconsidered by these teams when this change takes place, and it will most certainly bump hunter from the bottom to balanced. If you think that's a bad idea because you play a druid or with a druid well then that's something you need to work out. You can't have every team running around with a druid on it, it has to end somewhere.

You're mistaken, it's 3 minutes - also what set bonus? Are you referring to priest's fear? Even if I think its absurd that they're buffing other classes just to reduce the number of druids (the should just buff if a class actually needs it and not in relation to any other class) in arena I'm intrigued as to how it will play out. If anything they should have given the fear to shamans and just increase the range on hunter's fear beasts instead of doing that and making it instant. Either way I can guarantee you any change that is made in this patch will not decrease druid numbers. Like I said before, if Blizzard wants to decrease the number of druids in arena they should just remove their HoTs so they actually have to stop and cast something. The druid is the mobile healer, and while that remains true it will not make druids any less desirable in Arena.

[Rubin]

You're mistaken, it's 3 minutes - also what set bonus? Are you referring to priest's fear? Even if I think its absurd that they're buffing other classes just to reduce the number of druids (the should just buff if a class actually needs it and not in relation to any other class) in arena I'm intrigued as to how it will play out. If anything they should have given the fear to shamans and just increase the range on hunter's fear beasts instead of doing that and making it instant. Either way I can guarantee you any change that is made in this patch will not decrease druid numbers. Like I said before, if Blizzard wants to decrease the number of druids in arena they should just remove their HoTs so they actually have to stop and cast something. The druid is the mobile healer, and while that remains true it will not make druids any less desirable in Arena.

To be honest there is no reason why there needs to be no cast time on the fear. Simply increasing the range to a more reasonable number would have been substantial. I already use fear beast quite often against druids, but 10 yards is quite quite short. A shaman with a fear may be overpowered I am afraid though. Sort of like resto druids with cyclone I suppose...But still, we will have to see how this all plays out. I think it will significantly impact the healing balance and make those few teams that challenged with hunters/non druid healers compete better.

[Rubin]

...and I was in fact referring to priests fear on the 30 second cooldown which is Howl of Terror. My mistake in the name.

[Digitrevx]

I do, he's called Hamchook. Look up his info and let me know. Obliterated BG9 teams in WSVGs even before hunters got their dead-zone buff and dispel/ms.

You’re on an arena tournament realm bud.



btw. You’re view is based on what a fear buff does to druid popularity. But if you look at the whole picture you'll realize that the buff is meant to impacts druids and increase the demand of hunters in pvp. That is why this buff is being considered for hunters instead of a druid nerf.

[tet]

You’re on an arena tournament realm bud.



btw. You’re view is based on what a fear buff does to druid popularity. But if you look at the whole picture you'll realize that the buff is meant to impacts druids and increase the demand of hunters in pvp. That is why this buff is being considered for hunters instead of a druid nerf.

First off, I'm not Hamchook, I've played with him though.

Nobody is arguing whether its a buff or a nerf for any class. The whole argument is that if Blizzard did in fact do this for hunters just to decrease the number of druids, then what's stopping them of adding some gimmick OP ability to the next form of pvp when say, for example a certain class becomes the popular one? It's flawed logic.

Don't worry though... cause when Paladins (or shamans) become the #1 healers again they will have to give hunters a Paladin/Shaman fear.

Either way I guess at least shitty hunters will realize they had that fear in the first place - which I bet have never even thought of using in arena.

[Rubin]

They probably should have kept the spell the same, but just increased the range to 20 yards. Instant cast is too overpowered.