Thread: Paladin Glyphs

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  1. #1

    Paladin Glyphs

    "# Glyph of Seal of Command - Increases the chance of dealing Seal of Command damage by 20%. "

    so it's basically 20% extra chance to proc? or knowing blizzard it's 20% extra on 7ppm to 8.4ppm?





  2. #2

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Would seem that way. Even though it is ppm as opposed to % proc it is still based on the rng so the glyph is of limited use imo.

  3. #3

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Im no math guenius but i think it's more like this:

    How big proc chance SoC has based on your weapon speed and the PPM

    A 3.8 weapon speed(the speed i have on my lolherald ;D) has: 60/7*3,8= 32,57 chance to proc form my melee swings.

    So adding the 20% proc chance to my currently 32,57 proc chance gives:
    50,57% proc chance

    As i said im not that good at math so please corect me if im totaly wrong about the calculations, but still i hope you get the picture of what im trying to say



  4. #4

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    FIrst of all, ppm works like this: (3.8*7)/60=0,4433...
    So with your stunherald you have about 44% procrate rather then 32.

    And for the glyph, i cant imagine it will be a flat 20% increse (44+20=64%). It will probably be either an increse to the ppm (7*1.2=8.4 ppm) or an increse the the base proc % (44*1.2=52.8)

  5. #5

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    So does haste rating help a paladin out w/o changing the base ppm on his/her weapon? Asking about Seal of Command, not Blood.

  6. #6

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Yes, it's a good one for retri.

    But have you seen the FoL or HL ones?
    # Glyph of Flash of Light - Your Flash of Light heals for -50% less initially but also heals for 196% of its inital effect over 1 to 0 sec.
    So, the last rank of FoL heals for 785 to 879 without spell power and talents. With this glyph it will heal for 393 to 440 initially, and it will heal for 770 to 863 in one second. I belive that Blizzard gave us first little HoT beside Sheath of Light?

    # Glyph of Holy Light - Your Holy Light grants 10% of its heal amount to up to 5 friendly targets within 5 of the initial target.
    This glyph is good, combined with Beacon of Light. Sure paladins have now some AoE heals, but surely they aren't so strong like Circle of Healing or Chain Heal, that can be buffed with their glyphs to heal 1 more target. At least that's a beginning for paladins!

  7. #7

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Aressolo
    Yes, it's a good one for retri.

    But have you seen the FoL or HL ones?
    So, the last rank of FoL heals for 785 to 879 without spell power and talents. With this glyph it will heal for 393 to 440 initially, and it will heal for 770 to 863 in one second. I belive that Blizzard gave us first little HoT beside Sheath of Light?
    I'm, personally, really excited about this one. I do kind of wish it was more healing with less HPS over a longer period of time. Maybe 6 seconds. Maybe I'm wrong in the direction this glyph is meant for, but either way is great.

  8. #8

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Tristam85
    So does haste rating help a paladin out w/o changing the base ppm on his/her weapon? Asking about Seal of Command, not Blood.
    Haste changes the calculation for ppm and lowers the damage of SoC as it is not a normalized attack.

  9. #9

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Ty for the reply, so Seal of Blood is the only way to go for haste eh?

  10. #10
    ikillbigppl
    Guest

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    haste dose not lower the damage of seal of command. it only lowers your WHITE damage swing speed. seal of command is a base 70% wepon damage thing. it isnt affected by how fast you attack.

    this has already ben discussed and proven true

  11. #11

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by ikillbigppl
    haste dose not lower the damage of seal of command. it only lowers your WHITE damage swing speed. seal of command is a base 70% wepon damage thing. it isnt affected by how fast you attack.

    this has already ben discussed and proven true
    I haven't played in a while but wasn't seal of command and windfury weapon exempted from the weapon speed normalization change in 05'?

    damage = base_weapon_damage + (weapon_speed * Attack Power / 14)
    Prior to 1.8 granting slower weapons greater benefit from ap. Making slow blue weapons better than faster,higher dps epics.


    normalized_damage = base_weapon_damage + (X * Attack Power / 14)

    where X is:

    * 1.7 for daggers
    * 2.4 for other one-handed weapons
    * 3.3 for two-handed weapons
    * 2.8 for ranged weapons
    Being the new calculation where the 70% was calculated based upon 70% of the
    damage = base_weapon_damage + (weapon_speed * Attack Power / 14)
    equation?

    I haven't played in over 6 months so sometimes backtracking through changes can be difficult.


  12. #12

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Aressolo
    Yes, it's a good one for retri.

    But have you seen the FoL or HL ones?
    So, the last rank of FoL heals for 785 to 879 without spell power and talents. With this glyph it will heal for 393 to 440 initially, and it will heal for 770 to 863 in one second. I belive that Blizzard gave us first little HoT beside Sheath of Light?

    This glyph is good, combined with Beacon of Light. Sure paladins have now some AoE heals, but surely they aren't so strong like Circle of Healing or Chain Heal, that can be buffed with their glyphs to heal 1 more target. At least that's a beginning for paladins!
    looks to me that the glyph for FoL is bugged not giving real value for the duration of the hot. I could be wrong i dont deny that.

  13. #13

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    aight, assuming no hidden CD on SoC (could never confirm this anywhere), and 50% proc rate. SoB = 35% dmg, 100% of the time, and SoC = 70% dmg, 50% of the time. given a long enough fight, randomness evens out and they do the same dmg. however, haste makes you attack faster with the same white dmg, and makes SoB much better due it being a 100% proc.

  14. #14

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    I was so hoping for this glyph:
    The paladin has a 10% chance to turn into a fairy when casting holy light.

  15. #15

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by yeknom366
    aight, assuming no hidden CD on SoC (could never confirm this anywhere), and 50% proc rate. SoB = 35% dmg, 100% of the time, and SoC = 70% dmg, 50% of the time. given a long enough fight, randomness evens out and they do the same dmg. however, haste makes you attack faster with the same white dmg, and makes SoB much better due it being a 100% proc.
    cant maybe call this one bonus but you lose hp so you can get manareturns from the healing you receive. Very situational but on tank and spank encounters with not much raid dmg you could call this one adition.

  16. #16
    Mechagnome Fablewynd's Avatar
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    Jul 2008
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    639

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Glyph of Exorcism - Your Exorcism also interrupts spellcasting for 0 sec.
    Now, if this is tweaked so it affects everyone but still only damages undead and demons, we could be on to a winner.

    C
    x

  17. #17

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Underbar
    FIrst of all, ppm works like this: (3.8*7)/60=0,4433...
    So with your stunherald you have about 44% procrate rather then 32.

    And for the glyph, i cant imagine it will be a flat 20% increse (44+20=64%). It will probably be either an increse to the ppm (7*1.2=8.4 ppm) or an increse the the base proc % (44*1.2=52.8)
    Wrong, you're forgetting something important. To figure your calculation on your % for seal of command to proc do the following:

    60 seconds / your weapon speed = The number of attacks you do in 60 seconds

    7 of those attacks in the 60 seconds will proc Seal of Command, so

    7 / the number of attacks you do in 60 seconds = your % of doing a seal of command proc



    So take Stormherald: 3.8 aspd

    60 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 15.7 attacks in 60 seconds

    This is where logic comes into play, you can't have a .7 of an attack, your character will only do 15 attacks in those 60 seconds.

    7 seal of command procs / 15 attacks = .46


    So your seal of command has a 46% chance to go off in one minute.





    The thing though, is that since your attacks don't ALWAYS coincide with a minute exactly, you'd have to do this equation for every minute, in addition to the one you did.

    -------------------------------------------------------
    2 minute duration

    120 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 31.57 attacks in 2 minutes

    14 seal of command procs / 31 attacks = .45

    or 45%

    -------------------------------------------------------
    3 minute duration

    180 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 47.37 attacks in 3 minutes

    21 seal of command procs / 47 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    4 minute duration

    240 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 63.16 attacks in 4 minutes

    28 seal of command procs / 63 attacks = .44

    or 44%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    5 minute duration

    300 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 78.95 attacks in 5 minutes

    35 seal of command procs / 78 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    6 minute duration

    360 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 94.74 attacks

    42 seal of command procs / 94 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    and so on...


    Sorry, I'm a realist.





    Now in regards to the glyph:

    IF it does add a 20% and then pushes PPM up in essence, it should do more damage then seal of blood.

    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Blood / Martyr

    35% weapon dmg 100% swing

    .35 * (.100 * 1 attack ) = .35
    .35 * (.100 * 2 attacks) = .7
    .35 * (.100 * 3 attacks) = 1.05
    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Command (with Stormherald)

    70% weapon dmg 45% swing

    .70 * (.45 * 1 attack ) = .315
    .70 * (.45 * 2 attacks) = .63
    .70 * (.45 * 3 attacks) = .945
    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Command with Glyph (With Stormherald)

    70% weapon dmg 65% swing

    .70 * (.65 * 1 attack ) = .455
    .70 * (.65 * 2 attacks) = .91
    .70 * (.65 * 3 attacks) = 1.36
    -------------------------------------------------------


    As we can see, Seal of Blood / Martyr does more damage then Seal of Command
    But when you add the new glyph, Seal of Command will do more damage then Seal of Blood / Martyr

    HOWEVER
    This does not include haste rating, nor the fact that you are spamming judgments.

    Quite a head ache, isn't it. Oiy.


  18. #18

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    The problem with SoC would be resolved quite elegantly if it was made a flat out 50% chance to proc, then this Glyph would become just fantastic giving a nice 70% proc chance and tiping SoC into the Retribution paladin's main seal.

  19. #19

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Akyle
    Wrong, you're forgetting something important. To figure your calculation on your % for seal of command to proc do the following:

    60 seconds / your weapon speed = The number of attacks you do in 60 seconds

    7 of those attacks in the 60 seconds will proc Seal of Command, so

    7 / the number of attacks you do in 60 seconds = your % of doing a seal of command proc



    So take Stormherald: 3.8 aspd

    60 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 15.7 attacks in 60 seconds

    This is where logic comes into play, you can't have a .7 of an attack, your character will only do 15 attacks in those 60 seconds.

    7 seal of command procs / 15 attacks = .46


    So your seal of command has a 46% chance to go off in one minute.





    The thing though, is that since your attacks don't ALWAYS coincide with a minute exactly, you'd have to do this equation for every minute, in addition to the one you did.

    -------------------------------------------------------
    2 minute duration

    120 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 31.57 attacks in 2 minutes

    14 seal of command procs / 31 attacks = .45

    or 45%

    -------------------------------------------------------
    3 minute duration

    180 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 47.37 attacks in 3 minutes

    21 seal of command procs / 47 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    4 minute duration

    240 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 63.16 attacks in 4 minutes

    28 seal of command procs / 63 attacks = .44

    or 44%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    5 minute duration

    300 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 78.95 attacks in 5 minutes

    35 seal of command procs / 78 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    6 minute duration

    360 seconds / 3.8 aspd = 94.74 attacks

    42 seal of command procs / 94 attacks = .45

    or 45%
    -------------------------------------------------------
    and so on...


    Sorry, I'm a realist.





    Now in regards to the glyph:

    IF it does add a 20% and then pushes PPM up in essence, it should do more damage then seal of blood.

    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Blood / Martyr

    35% weapon dmg 100% swing

    .35 * (.100 * 1 attack ) = .35
    .35 * (.100 * 2 attacks) = .7
    .35 * (.100 * 3 attacks) = 1.05
    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Command (with Stormherald)

    70% weapon dmg 45% swing

    .70 * (.45 * 1 attack ) = .315
    .70 * (.45 * 2 attacks) = .63
    .70 * (.45 * 3 attacks) = .945
    -------------------------------------------------------
    Seal of Command with Glyph (With Stormherald)

    70% weapon dmg 65% swing

    .70 * (.65 * 1 attack ) = .455
    .70 * (.65 * 2 attacks) = .91
    .70 * (.65 * 3 attacks) = 1.36
    -------------------------------------------------------


    As we can see, Seal of Blood / Martyr does more damage then Seal of Command
    But when you add the new glyph, Seal of Command will do more damage then Seal of Blood / Martyr

    HOWEVER
    This does not include haste rating, nor the fact that you are spamming judgments.

    Quite a head ache, isn't it. Oiy.

    And that's assuming the 20% isn't meant as a 20% of the 45% (Which would mean an additional 9% proc chance for a total of 54%.) or a 20% of the 7 PPM (Which would mean 8.2 PPM)

  20. #20

    Re: Paladin Glyphs

    Quote Originally Posted by Samiel
    And that's assuming the 20% isn't meant as a 20% of the 45% (Which would mean an additional 9% proc chance for a total of 54%.) or a 20% of the 7 PPM (Which would mean 8.2 PPM)
    True, but we don't know the mechanic 100% yet, so right now its just a bunch of random guesses.

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