Holy Paladins -- How Do You Plan to Spec?

[Geboran]

All of you holy paladins out there, I keep reading and hearing that Holy Paladins are not speccing very deep in Holy, and are speccing more of a Holy/Retribution hybrid spec.

Can you tell me why I wouldn't want to specc DEEP Holy as a Holy Paladin? I know that there are some -NICE- items that can boost healing performance in the Retribution tree, but am confused as to exactly how to spec for each tree.

Please help.

(Also... please provide the individual talents that you take, the number of points in the talent, and the reason why you are taking it).

Thanks in advance.

[SliderX]

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=sxAbgMzhVuMxRtZVcbx0h

This seems to be the best selection out there as of now. It should be noted that if no Ret Pally takes Kings b/c they're still in a BC mentality of Holy having it, some Healer will have to take the 3% crit hit in order to get kings.

Oh and it's also funny how Imp Concentration Aura was moved into the holy tree and still no one will spec into the damn thing ;D

[Geboran]

They would for PvP though, right?

I guess I should have also specified, I am looking for both PvE and PvP specs.

Thanks.

[Ultar]

Well I am going deep in the holy tree, Instant cast Holy lights after a crit holy shock, thats insane especially the fact that you can have a guranteed crit shock every 2 minutes with divine favor. Increases in our spellpower with holy guidance, and of course Beacon of Light. I am very excited to heal as a holy paly now.

This is my spec with Imp Concentration, depending on if it will be worth it in the expansion or not. I just need to see for my self how much they can reduce if you don't have it.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

If its not worth it then I would use this

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

I like the beggining prot talents, a 30 second Hammer of Justice is awesome, toughness is now more useful, divine guardian is interesting to me.

I plan on doing both arena and PvE with this spec.

[Harima]

I plan on staying holy for now, until the nerf hammer is done swinging on ret. I wanna eventually spec to ret to check it out, but knowing that there will be many death knights and a huge push for 80, I doubt there will be a shortage of DPS. So I will just stay holy and ride the wave.

[Sacrid]

I'm really supprised no one has posted this spec yet. It is a bit OP for 2v2s 3v3s and normal PvE healing IMO.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

[Golijov]

You did that spec WAY wrong >_>
It's supposed to be more like this: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

It's not really overpowered tbh; you give up the ability to turret heal really well, and would probably wouldn't be ideal for a 5v5 setting. What it allows you is a very offensive play style, allowing paladin/dps to be more of a 1.5 dps team, sort of the way DS druids are now, or how many resto shamans play in 2v2.
You pick up a LOT of bonus crit and help increase your partner's damage passively too, as well as allowing some decent burst in a JoR + holy shock (with wings up) combo, along with a CC option in repentance. With this build you would be stacking crit/int and spell power, and judging every cooldown to take advantage of your 33% chance to regain 20% max mana.
There's also some room for personal preferance on where you spend your last few holy or ret talents, which helps keep the build from having the cookie cutter feel.

..and I'm not even a paladin.

[Geboran]

You did that spec WAY wrong >_>
It's supposed to be more like this: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

It's not really overpowered tbh; you give up the ability to turret heal really well, and would probably wouldn't be ideal for a 5v5 setting. What it allows you is a very offensive play style, allowing paladin/dps to be more of a 1.5 dps team, sort of the way DS druids are now, or how many resto shamans play in 2v2.
You pick up a LOT of bonus crit and help increase your partner's damage passively too, as well as allowing some decent burst in a JoR + holy shock (with wings up) combo, along with a CC option in repentance. With this build you would be stacking crit/int and spell power, and judging every cooldown to take advantage of your 33% chance to regain 20% max mana.
There's also some room for personal preferance on where you spend your last few holy or ret talents, which helps keep the build from having the cookie cutter feel.

..and I'm not even a paladin.

This one looks like a fun spec. What benefits your mates the most from these talents?

[Kairu]

You did that spec WAY wrong >_>
It's supposed to be more like this: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

It's not really overpowered tbh; you give up the ability to turret heal really well, and would probably wouldn't be ideal for a 5v5 setting. What it allows you is a very offensive play style, allowing paladin/dps to be more of a 1.5 dps team, sort of the way DS druids are now, or how many resto shamans play in 2v2.
You pick up a LOT of bonus crit and help increase your partner's damage passively too, as well as allowing some decent burst in a JoR + holy shock (with wings up) combo, along with a CC option in repentance. With this build you would be stacking crit/int and spell power, and judging every cooldown to take advantage of your 33% chance to regain 20% max mana.
There's also some room for personal preferance on where you spend your last few holy or ret talents, which helps keep the build from having the cookie cutter feel.

..and I'm not even a paladin.

The point of a spec like this isn't dps, its getting judgement of the wise, giving you ultimately an infinite mana pool. Having 1/3 just isn't reliable enough. Sure yours works well as a hybrid, dps//heal, but itd be easier to spam heal and immediately fill up mana pool again with judgement

[Deleted]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

That's my pvp spec. I am not speccing into ret, I am very used to having divine illumination since I find it pretty awesome in situations where I have to spam Holy Light (think about f.ex. your mate getting nuked and having Mortal Strike, too. I pop Divine Illumination and can keep spamming HL as long as it lasts.) Also Beacon Of Light seems pretty useful. Otherwise it should be pretty self-explanatory. This spec also suffices pretty well for pve.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

This is gonna be my pve spec. Not much of a difference, just removed the pvp talents and increased my crit chance by another 5%.


Basically, I just don't find that ret/holy hybrid so compelling that I'd be willing to lose Beacon Of Light and Divine Illumination for it.

[b37x]

Ret

[Cheesepala]

PvE:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

Having BoL, Kings and Conviction... best possible for PvE pala imo.

and PvP:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

Enlightened Judgements just simply to help keeping justice on those pesky druids :P

The 5 points in conviction can be changed to Judgements of the Pure for haste.. it's up to personal preference.

EDIT: Added last line.

[Mysmere]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

fixt for pvp, pure of heart will be great, cotongues is annoying, as are teh future dk diseases. a lock wont be able to keep up a tongues on you and be able to kill anything.

blessed life is nice when it procs on someones cooldown/burst. i'm a dice roller so i'd only get 2/3 lights grace. survivability is the most important. all that extra int i useless considering jotw. you could move a few points around, ie aura mastery or deflection, and you might not even need benediction, you tell me. it's kind of funny how people get all these mana conserving talents with jotw.

[waldina]

Well I am going deep in the holy tree, Instant cast Holy lights after a crit holy shock, thats insane especially the fact that you can have a guranteed crit shock every 2 minutes with divine favor. Increases in our spellpower with holy guidance, and of course Beacon of Light. I am very excited to heal as a holy paly now.

This is my spec with Imp Concentration, depending on if it will be worth it in the expansion or not. I just need to see for my self how much they can reduce if you don't have it.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

If its not worth it then I would use this

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

I like the beggining prot talents, a 30 second Hammer of Justice is awesome, toughness is now more useful, divine guardian is interesting to me.

I plan on doing both arena and PvE with this spec.

I'm curious why take 5 points in Strength instead of Kings? I don't see how 15% strength helps with this build.

[Carsomyrr]

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

This is my favorite spec for pvp, and its main focus is for small bracket (2v2 and 3v3) arena and battle grounds. I arena with a warrior, and it works nicely to have the combination of might/wis and commanding shout, since might no longer stacks with battle shout, so I take imp might. Light's Grace is worthless now, as I have yet to cast a holy light in pvp without the infusion of light proc. I have spent many hours playing on the murmur beta test realm with specs that include JotW and BoL, and beacon is just a little too clunky to be useful in pvp (not to mention its high priority on the offensive dispel list). Don't get me wrong, when I build a pve holy spec, it will most likely include BoL, especially for raids, but in small bracket pvp, its not as useful as you would think. 2/2 Divine Purpose is amazing, as well has having Repentance in your back pocket. Eye for an Eye effects all criticals, so that is worth taking. Pursuit of justice should come in handy in light of the new rogue ability dismantle. Depending on how good JotW turns out to be on live, I believe you could sub out however many points you can from Divine Int to grab some other goodies. Pure of heart and Blessed Hands are debatable, but since this spec doesn't include stoicism, I think Blessed Hands will be just as good of a choice. Keep in mind Hex is a curse, and technically (although I have not been able to test this) Pure of Heart should half the duration of Hex. Depends on how concerned about ele shamans you are. I have played thus far with the Hammer of Justice glyph, the Holy light glyph, and the Seal of Wisdom Glyph. The Hammer glyph is useful, and I will most likely swap out the Holy Light glyph for the new and improved Turn Evil glyph. Warlocks and Death Knights will fear my Evil Coil. I think this spec, given its advantages in the realms of CC and Longevity, will be the premiere spec for small bracket pvp, with a few tweaks depending on the personal preference of the person.

[Mysmere]

getting divine intellect with jotw just looks so awkward and is confusing me. there is such a thing as wasting too many points in efficiency.. like overcapping hit or armor.. i dont see why no one takes blessed life or pure of heart.

for blessed life, you have to ask, who dies first in your team? or even, do you waste bubble too early? certainly you're over dramatizing how often you cast a real holy light. are you a drood now? all instants? i wonder how long you can survive spamming fol/holyshock with an ms affect and a nuker in 3's or a curse of tongues in 2's.

oh well, i am prepared to see a new surge of holy/warriors and am prepared to own you with my mage/ret combo! long live the fails.

[shockpally]

I will be dropping my paladin for one of my other 70's. Probably my shaman. What is the use of continuing on as a Holy paladin if you dont have time to raid and have no chance in 2's and 3's?

[Carsomyrr]

I am not over dramatizing, with the blue pvp set and all stam/resil gems I had no problem running around spamming holy shock/using fol with sacred shield. Once palis are in a full set of pvp epics gemmed with crit, they will be running 40%+ crit on holy shock and 80%+ crit on fol with sacred shield. Also, I didn't mention the increased low health burst potential holy has with 35% hp hammer of wraths and 6 second holy shocks with judgment thrown in. Also, consider divine favor/holyshock/holylight against nature's swiftness. The DF/HS/HL combo will happen every 2 minutes in an arena setting, but can happen every 6 seconds without divine favor, and given a 40-50% crit chance with holy shock, will happen about every 12 seconds. In blues, my holy shock crits for 7k and my holy light crits for 13.5k. Thats a near full heal on most classes at a 2 minute cooldown while NS has a 3 minute cooldown. I am not claiming that holy palis will breeze through healing against 2 dps and a ms debuff, I'm just saying its a hell of a lot easier than it ever was in BC.

[Mysmere]

good, no more perma interrupt like at 70. unfortunately i can't imagine them letting you keep this =/ 19% crit off of talents is way higher than anyone else i think.... i could be wrong. illum + jotw seems about as much regen as you'd need, so again i suggest you move some regen efficiency talents around.

i believe you have 18 pts in efficiency/int

[Carsomyrr]

Agreed, although I am still skeptical about blessed life. Just like the old Unyielding Faith, I was never happy with low % chance procs. I would most likely take points out of divine int to get pure of heart. One thing paladins don't have the gcds for is spam cleansing.