Be Realistic - Raid content WILL be completed quickly

[Abuelo]

In a couple of specualtive threads about the new raid encounters and boss fights I have seen a lot of people say something along the lines of 'It should be really hard and take several weeks to do.'

Now, while I understand the sentiment behind this I do feel that people need to wake up a little bit and start to be realistic. It doesn't matter what the encounter is like, who the boss is, how many encounters are within a single raid, they will be completed within a week or two of them being released. The only way to slow this down is with artificial checks like resistance fights and magical gates.

Why is this? There is not a force on this earth that can create content that will stand up to the sheer weight of the top competative guilds hitting it hour after hour, day after day. It just can't be that way, and if it IS, that is bad game desing pure and simply. These guilds take time off work, sit in a bucket in case of a call from Mother Nature and have liquid vitamins intraveinously put into their bodies.

Bosses will always be downed rather quickly in the face of this onslaught. Even then though, quickly in terms of days is NOT quick in terms of game play hours. Taking 18/19/20 hours to get a boss down in a world first capacity is a HUGE amount of time. Thats more play time than most Playstation 2 games.

So when people talk of things getting too easy because Arthas has been killed a week after Icecrown, bear in mind what he has been up against during that week.

[lalartu]

yea its a hard thing to balance when top guild are 3000% more dedicated and however more skilled than the average player..

gates just all around suck huge hairy swinging balls, but resistance fights are not the pure evil people make them out to be, gives you a different mechanic. and throwing on a new gooffey looking set if fun sometimes... maybe thats just me.

gear checks are good too i think, you shouldn't be able to finish a dungeon unless alot of your raiders have replaced allot of there gear in my opinion.

[Flanky]

Blizzard is going to continue what they did in tbc = every1 needs to be able to see all content and get good gear.

Blizz <3 12 year old boys who play 1h a day

[Deleted]

What a well thought out opinion Flanky. Surely endgame content should be reserved for the ones who can play 6 hours or more per day!

Screw everyone else!


I'm being sarcastic if you hadn't noticed...

[scett]

no offens but then why would one even play this game.

why shouldnt the more dedicated players get the greater rewards?

as in PvP, why shouldnt the more skillfull players get the greater rewards?

[Fatherohealy]

If raid content can be completed by any player that just hit 80 is in half blues and greens and barely knows how to play his class what is the point? Sorry I like end game content because its a challenge. If there's no occasion to rise to its just a corpse to loot and you can do that in 5 mans. Some people may see that as elitist opinion but I have a feeling if less than 2 months from now every 80 on your server is running around in fully epic raid gear the same feelings might sink in. You might ask yourself why spend time trying to accomplish what anyone can accomplish with minimal effort and skill?

[Abuelo]

Blizzard is going to continue what they did in tbc = every1 needs to be able to see all content and get good gear.

Blizz <3 12 year old boys who play 1h a day

This isn't an attack on you, but people who still believe this kind of logic (for a given definition of the word) need to stop playing the game. That attitude may of been acceptable from game developers when MMORPGs were a very secular, niche market but it just doesn't cut it anymore. WoW especially is huge business, worth over a billion dollars a year to Blizzard. On top of that, these designers are game enthusiasts that WANT people to see the content, and want people to beat it. The industry has moved on from Everquest, players should too, or they are wasting their money on something that will not make it happy.

However you personally feel about things, the more open content is, the more people enjoy the game. Blizzard currently bend over backwards to make sure you get your e-peen enlarging, competative gameplay but they slowly start to reverse this policy the further you get into an expansion. If you cannot see why, or it offends you that much, you truly need to stop playing, because things will only be opened more and more.

I wonder how many people who complain like this are actually in that top 200 of world first pursuing guilds and how many are second wave 'wait until they release the video' raiders.

I especially love how Fatherohealy and Scett completely missed the point of the post.

[Fatherohealy]

I didn't miss any point's I was replying to the sarcastic post on how only people that put in a lot of time should see end game content. Just as you wrote your text on why end game should be easy I wrote mine on why I think it should be a challenge but I'll leave out the "need to stop playing" type comments you seem to enjoy. And yes I'm in a top guild that has killed Kil'jaeden despite your pulled from thin air guess otherwise.

[antidan]

If blizzard came out with new content quickly enough this wouldn't be a problem. Guilds wouldn't have the gear that makes the encounters trivial yet. Kael was perfectly tuned so that if you had farmed SSC and TK for a long while the DPS reqs were not impossible, but if you were bleeding edge you would not have the gear that made aoeing weapons quickly possible so those guilds had to think of creative ways to beat him.

SWP had the opposite problem, they wanted it to be beatable with only a few months of BT farming, but most good guilds had farmed bt for a year, so this made it trivial.

In other words, if blizz just releases more content more quickly they can implement successful gearchecks that dont need to be super nerfed instantly.

[Luminair]

As Blizzard has mentioned, the Ulduar raid is already nearly completed, and is something that they would like to release soon. Naxx certainly isn't a cakewalk for everyone, and while many people will be clearing it rather fast, it will have a degree of longevity due to the achievements associated with it that award items such as mounts and titles. Beyond that, don't disregard that there is both a 10 and 25 man version of the instance, each are a similar but varying raid with lots of fun experiences in them.

[mattimaeus]

While the raid content may get slammed down really quickly down the door. With the new way that blizzard has decided to patch in new raids there will be long periods of time after raids get World first/ Server first. In those time less skilled/dedicated players can gear up and be ready to race off against all the hardcore guilds again.

And if thats not enough remember if your guild clears naxx a week after nihilum or SK you still cleared the same raid and got basically the same chances at loot

[Offhand]

What a well thought out opinion Flanky. Surely endgame content should be reserved for the ones who can play 6 hours or more per day!

Screw everyone else!


I'm being sarcastic if you hadn't noticed...

Say you raided twice a week for 2 hours a day. Hyjal is realistically in reach before 3.0.

Even the most casual of casual players can see most of the content.

[Erudus]

Say you raided twice a week for 2 hours a day. Hyjal is realistically in reach before 3.0.

Even the most casual of casual players can see most of the content.

i agree, i worked 9 to 5, mon to fri and still managed to kill Illidan, whilst still going out and enjoying spending time with my mates.

[Abuelo]

I didn't miss any point's I was replying to the sarcastic post on how only people that put in a lot of time should see end game content. Just as you wrote your text on why end game should be easy I wrote mine on why I think it should be a challenge but I'll leave out the "need to stop playing" type comments you seem to enjoy. And yes I'm in a top guild that has killed Kil'jaeden despite your pulled from thin air guess otherwise.

So you DID miss the point and I stand by my comments. If it makes you unhappy that more people will have access to great gear and better raids, then you should stop playing, because it is a decision that will not be changed. Ever. (Psssst, I didnt pull a guess from thin air either. I wondered how many who claimed, had. Get off the defense of your e-peen and read properly)

In other words, if blizz just releases more content more quickly they can implement successful gearchecks that dont need to be super nerfed instantly.

I think this is a rather simplistic approach. I imagine it takes an awfully long time to plan, design, build, test, tune and implement an average raid, so the only way to push content faster would be a decrease in quality, which serves noone. It goes back to the game time vs real time point. It will take Blizzard two months to design a raid or an encounter, but if this is played by the same 25 people for 25 hours, it WILL be beaten. There's nothing you can do about it.

If after that length of play time it couldn't be beaten, even by the likes of SK and Nihilum who are used to this method of play, then it is simply bad game design.

[scett]

its great and al that there changing it for the more casual players.
and it is kindof sadening for the hardcore players.

but ultimately what they are doing is taking away the sence of acomplisment when you kill a boss.
my guild has never killed kael'thas sunstrider, lady vashj or archimonde befor patch 3.0 (casual guild... go figure)
i remeber killing the bosses in karazhan for the first time. killing maggy and gruul after 3 weeks of wiping and what a great sence of acomplisment that gave.
now we just plow throug everything like its butter.
killing both kael'thas sunstrider and lady vashj in 1 evening of only 3 hours of raiding.
now i will probably miss that feeling till actual high end content in WotLK because everyone will be flying throug those places like they mean nothing at al. just another storehouse for purple named items where you only have to kill of that nasty klerk to be able to collect.

[Vallos]

I think most people are missing his best argument. If a boss or encounter is possible to beat, it will be beat by guilds that eat and breathe WOW.

The problem's not with the encounters, or with the bosses. It's with people who expect WOW to provide fulfillment and difficulty equal to real life. As someone who plays a few hours per day some days, none others-- I think it's perfectly reasonable.

And before you call me a 'casual,' just remember that you're talking about an online game. Evaluate your life choices.

[WeaponD]

no offens but then why would one even play this game.

why shouldnt the more dedicated players get the greater rewards?

as in PvP, why shouldnt the more skillfull players get the greater rewards?

The rewards are seeing a boss FIRST, not seeing a boss. Throughout TBC, every time Bliz added new content, they made prior content more accessible. That's a good thing, because it gives the hardcore players a head start, while still letting the casual players see the content and down the bosses.

[Coronel]

What a well thought out opinion Flanky. Surely endgame content should be reserved for the ones who can play 6 hours or more per day!

Screw everyone else!


I'm being sarcastic if you hadn't noticed...

You don't post very often do you?

[Vamonse]

Blizz <3 12 year old boys who play 1h a day

You do know WoW is teen rated, right? :

[Vamonse]

Even the most casual of casual players can see most of the content.

Nope, not true. All I saw, in my 3 years of WoW, in TBC was Kara, Gruul and Mag. Nothing beyond that..