Ulduar and ? in 3.1

[BaBaBoomer]

I highly doubt Ulduar will be difficult at all, The hardest encounter in the game(3D) isn't even hard..

Catering to casuals

Everyone is a winner! It is the American way.

[custos]

There is normal mod on heroic, and there is hard mod ( achivments, extra loot etc. ) so evryone gets what they want, and nobody sints out a exspansion and dont see what blizz made for them, wich is what blizz wants to do.

[BaBaBoomer]

Achievements do nothing for a raider. The only extra loot you get is off Sarth 2D (which is a joke).
The majority of WoW players are not raiders, and Blizz catered to them in Wrath. I do believe (hope) that Ulduar will be more difficult. Less than 8 hours to clear raid content is not enough. Anyone for some L4D?

[RWeber]

If Naxx is so easy for you, make sure nobody in your guild reads any guide about Ulduar and that everybody disables BDM. Perhaps doing the work yourselves instead of saving some weeks of learning the encounters just by watching a couple videos will make the encounters more filling for you.

Yeah, and if you want to make it even harder you can raid naked with your eyes closed! Progress focused raiding is about doing everything possible to kill new bosses. This includes reading tactics, using addons and optimizing your spec, gear and rotations. If you knew there was something more you could do to down the boss easily it would destroy the sense of achievement. The goal is to down the boss, the sense of achievement comes from doing everything in your power and pushing as hard as you can to get there. That's just how the human psyche, or at least mine, works.

[Schippi]

It's great that there's content you like. However, there are plenty of people with school/work/social lives that still enjoy challenging raids. I mean you could've cleared everything up to Sunwell with a 2-day raiding guild in BC. I hope they make 10-mans easy enough that people who like the difficulty of current Naxx can enjoy it. At the same time they should make the 25-man Ulduar as challenging as TK/SSC or Hyjal/BT were in BC. And forget about trying to provide content through achievements; they would work perfectly as something fun to do when you get the place in farm mode but nothing more.
How wonderfully condescending of you to tell people how to live their lives. Alts are not an alternative for people who want to experience raid progress.

nice you enjoy wow.
but to please everyone i would suggest to make 10mans easy so everybody can see the content & the 25mans like tk. and achievements for mounts seems ok but dont count them as content - its the same content in a different way..

[Totschlager]

IMHO, I don't think they should put raids on the PTR anymore. Yeah it gives blizz an idea of how to tune the fights, but it also gives guilds a chance to practice the encounters before they hit live. Knowing the strats for all the fights the day the patch goes live is not fun. Call me crazy, but I would actually enjoy wiping five or six times on a fight just to figure out what kind of abilities it has and what is the best way to counter them rather than simply reading the strat on bosskillers and one-shotting it.

I miss the bosses like pre-nerf C'thun, Nefarian, Vashj, etc. They were fun because they were challenging. I hope Ulduar will be comparable to SSC or pre-nerf Mag. I also hope they introduce a new instance similar to Hyjal with the timed waves just to mix things up. Hyjal was unique and because of that it was one of the most enjoyable raids I've ever done.

[talrob]

Ulduar - http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=e7U2_bMF8W0

WARNING - major spoilers

but from the look of that its at least 15 bosses or a whole heap of trash.

[CombatJack]

There was a Blizz post last week saying there will be more boss's in Ulduar than there are in Naxx, and that most of the boss's will have Hard modes(like sartharion). Also, there is one optional boss that is tuned for Hard Mode ONLY.

If i were to guess, I'd say we'll see 3.1 by mid-late march. possibly later

[Syrada]

I'm pretty sure that they said that Ulduar is not a next tier of raiding... more along the lines of SWP was taht... it wasnt tier 7.... but was a upgrade still.....

So Ulduar will be not tier 8.... but and upgrade ofc.
Another aspect fight at the Wyrmrest temple sounds about right
...
and if you seen the alpha veersion of Ulduar... you'll know how big it is

Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and use common sense.. Sunwell was the last patch of TBC why the hell would they release a sunwell like instance for patch 3.1. considering there is 3 tiers of armor per expansion and still 3 major patches left. It's 80% guaranteed that Ulduar will be t8.

[Diatribe]

I don't want "Hard Modes" as options. I want them to be standard for my 25 man experience. As a result of it being standard, I want the loot that would've normally dropped, buffed up a bit more (not insanely more than what it would be), but be reflective of the increases natural degree of difficulty.

[Gron]

Quote from: Gron on January 23, 2009, 01:35:58 PM
"Look.. Blizzard is treating WotLk raiding as if everyone is new to it."

Question - why?

Why ignore the 10million+ people of the 11 million subscribers who went through Karazhan in BC and reintroduce raiding to them?"

Karthul:
if you honestly believe that anywhere near 10 million people ever went through Kara, you're either one of the most fundamentally unintelligent people ever, or just living in an alternate world.

Lots of people raid, sure... but it isnt even anywhere near half of the WoW population. Blizzard is trying to fix that with LK. Thats why theyre "re-intro-ing" raiding.

As for the guys earlier who were like "theyve made the hardcore raiders mad, and if they dont appease us, a lot of us will leave"

tip for you: since you make up something like 4% of the population, and dont contribute significantly to their bottom line, they dont care.

If you all leave because you're mad that "the casuals" can get the same gear you can, no one will miss you. You dont matter.

Karthul, you might be right... maybe it was not 10 million people... maybe just 9 million... just please - please check your facts before writing such posts, from your alternative world. On our server Karazhan was cleared by 97.8% of total existing guilds. And I know at least one "banker" guild exists for fun. I will state again: those who need to learn to raid should go Karazhan at level 80, get an achievement, and they learned to raid... why create entry level raid content when most of WOW population already know how to raid ?!!!

So I am asking again, why ignore those who done Karazhan? Why be so "re-introduce raiding"??? Those who wanted to raid, could - there is so much information out there, 3.0 patch made it so easy, I am just amazed by you guys wanting even more easy content.

Please one more time for you to get it into your brain: ALREADY 50% of all guilds cleared NAXX 10 man. This is taken from http://wow.guildprogress.com/ , but you can also check wowjutsu. This is after 2 months of the game is out. And please remember with 50% it means that there are so many many sleeping guilds, where alt created a guild and have not deleted it yet, the true number is likely to be 80% of "active" guilds have cleared Naxx (the most important raid content) after 2 months. This leaves a lot of guilds who got used to having fun / being challenged by raids to be on the waiting side.

Why would hardcore not be mad at casuals, when the game is changed for their liking, but not giving fun to many others?
I will ask you: will you be happy if next expansion they will re-introduce raiding again, and you will be bored waiting for something to do? And next major expansion re-introduce raiding again?

Currently we solo level 79-80 elites - why??? We do 5 man group quests... alone.... why can I do them? Why say its 5 man group quest in the description? Why say a mob is "elite" when you can solo it? Before I had respect for an elite mob on my level. Not now. What next? We will solo level 93 elites on level 90 blue gear? Is that what you want?

[Kabal]

Ulduar - http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=e7U2_bMF8W0

WARNING - major spoilers

but from the look of that its at least 15 bosses or a whole heap of trash.

Holy hell!
That place looks freaking amazing! Im excited now.

[Goulashia]

Holy hell!
That place looks freaking amazing! Im excited now.

It looks boring with loads of trash honestly.

[Baever]

Lot of ignorance in this thread, and by ignorance, I mean blaming personal lack of skill on a casual play-style.

Simply because you could not pass half the retard checks and moved during Flame Wreath does not mean the game should be toned down to adjust for your lack of attentiveness. What's worse, is you continuously blame this lack of attentiveness on being 'casual.' It takes five-minutes to research optimal PvE/PvP specs and proper rotations, as well as important stat allocation. There is no excuse for sub-par performance other than server lag.

The reason there is such an uproar about the ease of WoTLK, is because the twenty-five man content, meant to be the better, more challenging gear outlet, is thus far much easier to complete, which contradicts entirely Blizzard's original goal. Also, unlike TBC, which was released with three tiers of content (although Hyjal was relatively unaccessable due to a limited number of vial drops off Vashj and Kael), WoTLK launched with nothing more than entry level, ridiculously easy entry level. Not providing at least a second tier from the get go was nothing more than poor planning on Blizzard's behalf.

Which brings me to my focal point.

Blizzard designed the game. Blizzard is responsible for the high, and sometimes preposterous, requirement levels on previous raid content, not hardcore players. Every person who has ever spoken/typed/essayed a response in such a manner as to blame hardcore players for the game's difficulty in the past is a moron and probably never graduated high school, or in the rare occasion that they did somehow buy their GED, most likely is working the cash register at McDonalds; the only job they are qualified for.

In short; take blame for your own failures as a gamer or a person, and quit bickering amongst each other when Blizzard is the culprit for all our troubles in the game, past and present.

[Baever]

if it so easy that you are complaining about it being too easy, why are you still playing? go play something else that is hard, also to make this game a bit more challenging play without a moniter...you should have all the content memorized by now

If the game was too hard before, why did you play through BC?

[Gron]

Baever,

I totally agree with you. This game shipped with Karazahn (Naxx) and Gruul (2 bosses -Malygos + Sarth). No Magtheridon, SSC, Eye, Hijal content there. Ulduar will be like addition of BT - 5-6 months after release.

Actually its not the issue that Blizzard caters for casuals, and makes it a no-brainer in Naxx. The issue is that there is nothing after that.

Zilia,
"Blizzard is a business, nothing more, nothing less. If their clients are 80%+ casual players that want easier instances ( I'm included in the casual players ), then that's what they will create.

If you had a company, would you create a product only 10 or 20% of your buyers will like ? That's how you must think to understand Blizzard.

IT'S A BUSINESS, THEY GIVE WHAT THE MAJORITY WANTS ! Too bad people with no lives are a minority... -.-"

Let me answer to that. Blizzard is a business that wants people to enjoy their game. That includes people who know how to play the game (lets call them hardcore), and those who just jump in for 5 minutes and want to laugh at killing all bosses in Naxx (let's call them casual). Best case is that Blizzard creates content for both types of players. Not choose one (which, lets be honest, is the easiest solution, recycle old bossess, recycle old content, give them free loot, and casuals are happy).

Also, people with no lives... its actually another false myth you are babysitting there in your dreams. Most hardcore players are normal people, with normal lives, who don't spend half of their lives in the the game. I have a job, do a lot of work. I have a family with 2 kids. Yet when I log in on the evening, I want quality entertainment, not cheesy flat casual soap-opera. Ofcourse the reason I want that is because I am in a quality guild - made a lot of friends here, and enjoyed the challenging content. I also know this arose from the machinations of Blizzard who created challenging content in the past, getting skilled players together to challenge it.

Its really funny how the casual players can troll here, and say to hardcore players "get the hell out of here"... its just plain jealous attitude that some people moved on to larger guilds, or really enjoy challenges.

Missing content is a big issue from Blizzard's side (actually it proves they don't have multiple teams working on content for WOW - shows the team is really small doing it, and proves that they probably spent much less time working on WOTLK than you'd expect).

Karazhan has been cleared by most people in the game (not that big need for entry level content when so many done Karazhan), and Naxx has been cleared by anyone who has set a foot inside - rushed through it like knife in butter. What's next? Nothing, no content. Most achievements are very easy and defy the word "achievement" (yeah levelling first aid over 375 is worth the same as clearing Naxxramas). Blizzard HAD to release a game against Warhammer, and the only way they could do it is quickly stopping development on WOTLK and finally shipping it after 2 years.

I think these issues about missing fun content must be raised to Blizzard so they understand how many people feel about their game - I know I am not alone. Blizzard will also need to think about new ways to stimulate the old time raiders - all boss mechanics in Naxx can be found in Burning Crusade raids (or at least nearly all), but Blizzard showed us they can do good raiding content with Zul Aman, Sunwell, etc. Let's hope they still have enough creativity to keep level 80 players busy.

[Baever]

Blizzard is a business, nothing more, nothing less. If their clients are 80%+ casual players that want easier instances ( I'm included in the casual players ), then that's what they will create.

If you had a company, would you create a product only 10 or 20% of your buyers will like ? That's how you must think to understand Blizzard.

IT'S A BUSINESS, THEY GIVE WHAT THE MAJORITY WANTS ! Too bad people with no lives are a minority... -.-

Edit: I forgot to mention...if you are really a true hardcore raider then you are looking for hard content for itself. You can make content REALLY hard if you want...Try the 25 man version with 10 people ? Do malygos without hitting 1 spark ? It's not hard to think of....

Now...If you want ( like most "hardcore" players that wrote here ) hardcore raid versions because you want better gear than the dude next to you in dalaran then you are not a hardcore raider you are a LOOT WHORE.

Games that are treated with an objective to maximize profits ultimately fail.

WoW did just fine while inducing difficult content, achieving 10 million subscribers prior to WoTLK's launch, and they would have done just fine keeping the bar as high as they previously did.

I stand firmly with my prediction that WoTLK will be the last record-breaking expansion in the series, brought on in due part by how drawn out the franchise has become, and due to the lack of immersible content. What you fail to realize is the easier content is, the faster all players complete it, and the sooner boredom and lack of interest develops. When your company makes a majority of its income off of membership fees, this is not a very wise path to take.

Also, don't be so foolish. No one enjoys making content purposely difficult if rewards for such action do not exist in the form of better gear; mounts and titles are nothing but novelties which every non-RP'er can live without.

[proga]

Looking at Northrend possible raids are:
1) New aspect near Sartharion
2) Zul'Drak
3) Raid instance near UK/UP (there is a big bridge and big closed door, maybe it's just for decoration but who knows)
4) Something near An'kahet/Azhol-Nerub (new AQ?)

[Deleted]

Looking at Northrend possible raids are:
1) New aspect near Sartharion
2) Zul'Drak
3) Raid instance near UK/UP (there is a big bridge and big closed door, maybe it's just for decoration but who knows)
4) Something near An'kahet/Azhol-Nerub (new AQ?)

Grim Batol,Uldum, New Arugal home,CoT any instances, there are many possibilities, but i hope it will be somewhere in EK or Kalimdor, i want them to improve old world..its so epic..

[Deleted]

This game is sadly too casual friendly and so Ulduar will be. If Ulduar won't change things in WoW, my guild will definitily stop raiding. A whole bunch of people will be playing Aion, this game looks beautiful and sounds very interesting. But this is just off the topic.

I don't think, that the next Content Patch will bring more things than the Ulduar raid dungeon itself and some class changes. Maybe the new arena season will start shortly after. Nevertheless many people are just disappointed by Blizzard for making the game too focused on casuals. Look at Naxxramas, or Sartharion. Sartharion drops the best possible loot if he's killed with at least two additional adds. This isn't very "hard, neither the 25men version, nor the one for 10men. We don't consider killing him with three adds, the mount isn't necessary. We are killing him with two 20men groups together with two adds on his side. Where's the difficulty? There is none, and this is why the majority of hard core players, who invest a greater amount of time for their hobby called WoW will leave this game and try something new.

Still I don't understand why Blizzard is giving the best possible gear to every single player out there, who sits just 3-4 hours in front of his game and gets some crazy loot. Of course I know that the starting dungeons are all simply "nobrainer", but this won't change in Ulduar, this won't also change in the future dungeons.

Players should live with this fact. Either you spend a greater amount of time, or you won't dominating this game. But who cares, Blizzard does not.