Arms Rotation 3.1

[DeManiac]

So, will it be viable to stance dance for Whirlwind?


If you stay in Battle Stance and refresh rend every 21 sec, Mortal Strike every 5 and Overpower every 6 sec, and hopefully you get one execute very 10 sec.
Then the graph would look something like this.



As you see the room between each Overpower and Rend is quite smal, so might not be worth it, also keep in mind that we still lose all but 25 rage when we change stance so you might not have rage for both Execute, Whirlwind and MS while your there.

[Thaurr]

Stance dancing to Zerker for a WW takes longer GCD-wise than Slam, however it doesn't delay your whites. Yet I think it's still best to remain in battle stance and spam Slam between TfB/SD-procs, Mortal Strike and Bladestorm.

[m1abrams]

It would be cool if we could overpower in zerker stance.
rend,go zerker(^perform rotation^), battle stance, refresh rend. repeat

[Crimsonak]

Stance dancing to Zerker for a WW takes longer GCD-wise than Slam, however it doesn't delay your whites. Yet I think it's still best to remain in battle stance and spam Slam between TfB/SD-procs, Mortal Strike and Bladestorm.

Stances only share a GCD with other stances not with skills. The only problem is latency on the switch however it still works out as having way less time wasted than a GCD. Especially if you macro it.
WW would be perfectly viable IMO if the rage changes come into place to not rage punish dancing so much.

As you see the room between each Overpower and Rend is quite smal, so might not be worth it, also keep in mind that we still lose all but 25 rage when we change stance so you might not have rage for both Execute, Whirlwind and MS while your there.

What you are forgetting is the overpower proc doesn't need to be used immediatly, and you arent going to loose any DPS by not using it immediatly either. So closeness between the two isn't a massive issue unless a boss dodges your attack, but then that's debatable on the fact of if you're expertise capped or not which IMO you should be.

Ideally you don't want MS and rend finishing CD/needing a renew at the same moment so if that image you've provided is accurate it would be more sensitble to use MS firest then rend to prevent the two finishing at the same time later on down the line

[Kelesti]

Rotations fall behind. Really. Doing a rotation, when a higher damage ability comes off cooldown and you stick with your rotation, you aren't doing optimum DPS.

I need to get to some tweaking to see if our priority has changed but I don't think it has.

Rend, Sudden Death, Taste for Blood, MS (high rage) - Slam (moderate rage). MS is pretty much a rage dump, not much else.

[RPZip]

TfB is quite consistent in 3.1, so it can actually be moved a bit lower on the priority scale. Unless TfB will expire before you can hit it, you'd be almost always better with other abilities (esp. MS).

So maybe something like;

Rend, Sudden Death, MS, OP, Slam?

[Gribble]

OP does about the same damage for less rage and has a 1 second global cooldown, compared to MS at 30 rage with less of a scaling factor.

Overpower will definitely be a higher priority.

[jespersa]

when you get better gear and about 50% crit raidbuffed, you will have ample rage to furfill your rotation and even spam HS frequently. With endless rage, a white crit gives me atm 70ish rage :/ (yes i raid as arms already)

[blabbling]

Has anyone tested arms PvE dps compared to fury on the PTR? With the new changes, arms seems to be PvP viable again, but I don't feel that arms got much of a dps buff. The 10% additional ArP wasn't in the latest official patch notes. Was it removed?

[DeManiac]

Arms buff if we state em are these.

While in Battle Stance 10% Armor Penetration.

Taste for Blood proc every ticc of Rend, with a 6 sec internal cooldown, it grant you the buff Taste for blood that last 8 sec, so you have 5 sec on you to use it, before you have "wasted" it. With that caculation I asume you have Unrelenting Assult, or you would have to do it either at first sec, or and 3rd sec.(I'l almost certainly have Unrelenting since it boost overpower by 20% aswel).

Unrelenting Assult, now also increase the damage you do with Overpower by 20%.

Shattering Throw, sounds weak in a pve perspective but since your already in arms, it gives you an addition to Bloodlust for Melee, if you use it at the right time since it stack with Sunder Armor and other Armor Penetration effect you boos all melee armor penetration by 10% for 10 sec, that's not to bad.


And then we have Blood Frenzy, not actualy a dps boost just for you, but they reverted the change so now, if you were considered viable cause of this ability in tbc, you should almost certainly be that now aswel with better dps. That is ofc if you don't have any rogues that provide it aswel.



I'm not including the secondary effect of Overpower vs cast since I don't think it will work on bosses directly, it will proly say imune, similar to some spells not being possible to interupt and some are, then this effect will work sometimes and others it won't, might work on kelthuzad for example, since you can interupt his casts.



So, our dmg is a bit higher then it was before, still not comparable to live fury atm, but it's higher and more reliable then live Arms.

[harrydinkle]

I do WAY more dps as arms on ptr than i do as fury on live (on target dummy havent done 25 raid yet). They have buffed it a TOOOON.

my priority list is like this rend>execute>MS>OP spam slam if MS is on CD.

This is very very dependent on time left on OP proc however. There is another thread on here saying why i would do MS before OP and execute before MS. There is more to it than just the amount of damage each ability does.

Doing this i do 3.5k dps on target dummy with just battle shout (2 points talented since always ret pally in raids)

Going to zerker stance and switching back to battle for rend/OP procs seems like a large waste of rage and adds complexity (which 25 man lag kills). If you dont want to miss any OP procs you will have to switch no less than once every 5 seconds (once it works as tooltip states). 30/5=6 rage per second? WW only does weapon damage anyway so its not even that good as arms spec.

They added 10% armor pen to battle stance, so the difference in damage between zerker and battle stance isnt as large as before (if any since armor pen is more consistant rage flow over crit=burst rage).

[Deleted]

my priority list is like this rend>execute>MS>OP spam slam if MS is on CD.

Dont forget about the OP crit %. It will refresh DW everytime u use it and stacking DW is a ton of dmg as well, even after double dipping fix.

I'd stance dance everytime op is >3,5 sec cd, SD didnt proc and MS is >2sec cd and you have at least 60 rage ( depending on the swing timer and buffs at that moment ). Stance dance will do more DPS then 2 HS in battle but it needs some training and experience.

[blabbling]

Why is Slam out of the rotation now? Isn't 2 x Slam > Ms in dmg? Back when Wrath was released, the arms rotation was Rend + Slam spam, keep BS on CD, and use SD and OP when proc.

[marodeur]

I do WAY more dps as arms on ptr than i do as fury on live (on target dummy havent done 25 raid yet). They have buffed it a TOOOON.

yeah i was wondering why there wasnt a thread about this yet. i testet it myself and im doing more dps with arms and battlestance then i do with fury.

only thing i want to know is how it scales with raid buffs, maybe someone here can test that?