Judgement crits seem low?

[Larivas]

Hey, I'm normally prot but have a decent ret offspec set, respec'd to ret yesterday and my dps/crits seem a bit low. I was wondering if anyone had any idea why.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...mane&n=Larivas

Theres my armory link, the only difference is now I'm using the Breastplate of Frozen Pain instead of the t7 chest. In the past couple days in 5 and 10 mans my average judgement crit has been under 7k, with me rarely getting 10k+ even with wings where before it was fairly common. Last night on 25 man Loatheb, I switched to command at 50%, because my health started dropping. During the 2nd half of the fight seal of command did nearly double the damage martyr did in the first half. My stats for those who don't want to look are 3621 ap unbuffed, 33.03% crit, 192 hit, I've got the increased crit damage meta, the judgement glyph, and I'm using Inevitable Defeat. Am I just having bad luck with the RNG or am I missing something?

[b37x]

You have Flasks, food buffs, windfury/imp icy talons, strength of the earth/horn of winter, unleashed rage/abomination's might, and Leader of the Pack?

[archform]

You have Flasks, food buffs, windfury/imp icy talons, strength of the earth/horn of winter, unleashed rage/abomination's might, and Leader of the Pack?

only some of those would increase the crit dmg*looks at thread title*
*but would help your dps*

[Raptorg]

Unsure what you're saying.

Are you saying all your judgement crits are low, or just judgement of the martyr?


Also, it's normal your SoC deals more damage then SotM, because it gains more from your weapondamage, it just doesn't proc on every hit like martyr, which allows Martyr to do more damage in the long run.

[Larivas]

Martyr is low, I don't use command enough to tell the difference. In the 10 man and 5 man runs I was talking about I had Might, GoTW, and Horn of Winter. On 25 man patch I did 4200 dps, which was reasonable I guess, my crits just seemed horribly low.

[iktankniet]

might be true. im seeing less crits on judgement also. few weeks ago i would get near 80% alot. now its between 60 and 70%. might be RNG, but its hard to tell from the WWS reports. not really accurate with the half crit rating it shows.

[Fornicis]

According to the ret paladin in my guild they have applied the SotM nerf to the live servers aswell, I did notice a big drop in his DPS, normally on Thaddius it is me and him fighting for top spot, this week I outstripped him by a mile, I'm talking maybe 2000dps difference...

[Thellais]

I seem to be getting smaller crits as well, however my overall damage does not seem to be affect that much. About a month ago, even before I had the BoH, I was able to get over 10k judgement crits, but now I barely get that high, even with the same group makeups and gear.

[Deleted]

Your friends are blatantly lying, your gear or rotation is to blame for your low DPS.

We had cleared all 25 man content just this Wednesday after EU reset and I have found absolutely no changes whatsoever. For reference, 5.3k DPS on Patchwerk using Blood.

[apoptygmax]

On a slight tangent why would you break your 4-part T7 bonus?

[Larivas]

Never had 4 piece T7, its an offspec. All of my valor gear went to my prot set.

[Agathon]

Then you will love the patch....just hit the dummy a few minutes and it seems like i cant break 2k judgement hits...thats really funny....a 4-5k crit every 15sec is NOT making up for that loss (exorcism). I guess thats it for us in arena pvp. I dont see how i should knock out a healer with pathetic dmg/ burst like that...

[Samiel]

Erhm...I know people aren't actually testing stuff on those dummies and using them...Please, god tell me you aren't...

[Agathon]

not testing like richie does for instance....but sure checking. Had near 5k ap and i think my gear is not that bad....but like i said i was really disappointed



not mine...

I just cant understand what they are thinking. I had near 10k judgements in 2vs2 happen and still it was hard to burst something down....waiting for repentence, arcane torrent and hammer coming back up again to string them all together just to see the discpriest use his trinket then wait till you can try again after all cds are rdy just to have a chance kinda sucks ^^ (playing with a restodruid, not the best choice in a sector ruled by dks i know)

[Deathleech]

Your friends are blatantly lying, your gear or rotation is to blame for your low DPS.

We had cleared all 25 man content just this Wednesday after EU reset and I have found absolutely no changes whatsoever. For reference, 5.3k DPS on Patchwerk using Blood.

This. I pulled nearly 10k DPS on Thaddius and well over 5k on Patchwerk when we did Naxx Tuesday night. I know Seal of the Martyr judgment damage was nerfed hard on the PTR (and the seal dmg buffed to compensate), but that's not gone live yet. It will in 3.1 if things remain as currently scheduled.

[greatrichie]

I'm not so sure our burst was really... nerfed... When SotM crits for close to 3k on CS, DS,and Autoattacks... thats alot of burst. And the 3k SotM procs were completely unbuffed. Not even Might.


Let me pull out this "Jump to Conclusions" Mat.


And don't judge raid DPS loses by testing on Test dummies. They are nowhere near a good indicator of Raid DPS, or even potential Raid DPS.

[Deathleech]

Ya I gotta agree. Crusader Strike hits 15% harder. Exorcism hits 20% harder and can be used on all targets now. Not only that though, we also have much harder hitting seals. 3k+ crits is ridiculous. A white hit, CS, and DS should net about 5-10k in dmg alone, depending on crits. That's on top of the 4-4.5k judgments, 4-5k Exorcism, 4k CS, and 3k DS. Even if only half these things crit we are still looking at about 15k+ burst dmg in under 5 seconds.

[Raptorg]

I'm not so sure our burst was really... nerfed... When SotM crits for close to 3k on CS, DS,and Autoattacks... thats alot of burst. And the 3k SotM procs were completely unbuffed. Not even Might.


Let me pull out this "Jump to Conclusions" Mat.


And don't judge raid DPS loses by testing on Test dummies. They are nowhere near a good indicator of Raid DPS, or even potential Raid DPS.

No, but you can take your live test dummy dps/damage. Then go to the PTR test dummy dps/damage.

And find out similar data.

It won't be an indicator of raid dps, but it will show the power of a nerf, or at least a rough estimate.

[greatrichie]

No, but you can take your live test dummy dps/damage. Then go to the PTR test dummy dps/damage.

And find out similar data.

It won't be an indicator of raid dps, but it will show the power of a nerf, or at least a rough estimate.

No you really can't. Raid buffs like Windfury/Icy Talons will affect the Seal portion (which got buffed) WAAAY more than it EVER affected judgements, so thats a huge buff to our Raid DPS, which wouldn't show up hitting a test dummy. Taking a WWS of Live on a test dummy and a WWS of PTR on a test dummy. Just because the Live parse may be higher, doesn't mean it was a nerf to raid DPS. Raids aren't run Solo.

[Raptorg]

No you really can't. Raid buffs like Windfury/Icy Talons will affect the Seal portion (which got buffed) WAAAY more than it EVER affected judgements, so thats a huge buff to our Raid DPS, which wouldn't show up hitting a test dummy. Taking a WWS of Live on a test dummy and a WWS of PTR on a test dummy. Just because the Live parse may be higher, doesn't mean it was a nerf to raid DPS. Raids aren't run Solo.

I'm fairly sure it was already established the seal change was not a nerf, but a rebalance.

In such a case, you would consider the effects of haste. But it's not a nerf, so you consider it completely differently

But say, if several spells were nerfed, and some others buffed.. Like, judgement got a serious cut in damage, while CS gains some damage.

That haste you would gain from raidbuffs changes nothing.


It's obvious to even the biggest moron you can't test on dummies without the least consideration.

Consideration is key in testing just about everything. Don't forget that.


And even then, you will gain more damage on each instant strike due to the seal proccing everytime, so the results will still end up being a rough estimate, for which the training dummies were created after all.