Carrying People into Ulduar. Let's hear some stories!

[Waltz]

So, I'm here to rant a little bit. But not in the way you'd expect. I'm not going to complain that it's 'too hard' or anything like that. I'd like to talk about those people in your guild you carry. The nice people, but you just CANT get them to function properly. Sometimes it's a healer, someone who just doesn't understand the idea of mana conservation. Othertimes a tank, the never-ending 'woops, forgot Righteous Fury lawl'. And the big one, the one that bugs me the most... The DPS. Overgearing half the raid, yet they can't manage to put out ANYTHING in numbers.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...on&n=Drukinner

This is a Boomkin in my guild. Right now, she's logged out with a Fishing Hat and a Fishing Pole; but in actuality has Valorous Helm and the Torch of Holy Fire. So she's 4/5 Valor and rocking the Pre-Uld BiS weapon for a balance Druid, atleast to my knowledge it was. We've had other boomkins talk to her, they've made suggestions and had her mess with her spec, given her rotations, and guess how much DPS she puts out? If we're LUCKY, she breaks 2k.


Last night we went up against Deconstructor. We wipe and call the raid when, 3 minutes into the fight, we've gotten him to 75% and the first set of adds start to show. He's got an Enrage of 6 minutes. 8 DPS can't break 2k in 4/5-5/5 Valor.

How, as a guild, have you all dealt with such players? I've informed the GM and officers, but if they shrug it off I'm ready to just call them on it. I'd hate to leave a guild of fun, nice people just to progress through new content, and 3/4ths of them are good players. We just can't carry the other 10 people in the guild.

[uniq]

she needs more hit rating gems

[cagoule]

People doing 2k dps in 4/5 valorous are AFK players, it's simply not possible ^^

Just do the test, spam Moonfire only, and you'll get more than 2k...

[Kalanos]

ive been having the same issue with some of my guildmates. oddly, all of our melee dps is able to pull 3k+ and 1 or 2 of the ranged can do it too....then the majority of the ranged are barely breaking 2k.... tried XT last night....i can definitly see im going to have to get mean and buckle down on some people or he's just going to keep breaking us ^-^

[cagoule]

she needs more hit rating gems

huh? all the gems are +hit, except one which is +hit+endu and one +spell.

[Breh]

This combat rogue that was in my previous guild... He had calamity.. He had the best weapons a combat rogue wanted. Chaosomega, the one rogue who never used slice and dice...

This guy was carroed like nothing i have ever seen. on trash he stood there and did FoK, never used any regular attacks (white dmg, to get energy faster) he just stood there.

Shalamal, the other fail rogue. If there was ever something glowing, this guy would go investigate, EVERY TIME. He died every KT fight to the void zones, same with OS... this guy was sooo bad...

I hate bad people.

[Separate]

On deconstructor our melee 2 rogues 1 enhance shaman, me being one of the rogues (other is hat, Im combat). Put out close to 6k+ I spiked 6.8 last night. I know its a different class but maybe its her rotation, maybe she is waiting to long in between attacks, make sure she is using eclipse to her advantage.

[SFJake]

The patch changed a lot of things, so it can have an impact on people.

Beside that, as far as DPS roles goes, they are very easy - everyone can do it, and if they seriously can't, they don't deserve to raid, its that simple. I am far from elitist, always raid with complete casuals, but casuals can handle their own very well.

At some point I'd just tell them to learn to use their class. I can't give the right tips for most class, but they don't raid anymore until they learn their class? Is that so hard to tell someone? There is so much you can do wrong. I don't understand how anyone can "fail" to such level I see, especially as DPS.


No matter how nice someone is, you don't have to be rude yourself, but make them understand that they won't be raiding if they can't learn the easy basics of playing wow during all the time they played to get to 80 and into Ulduar.

[Memawmango]

Yeah, we are really starting to buckle down on slack DPS in Ulduar now. Despite what they think, it is very easy to seperate the slackers from the players who are giving as much as they can.

[Separate]

Honestly look at it this way. Its a game that uses your keyboard. Theres a order you press your keys to do GUD, if you cant learn to press 3333 5 3333 2 3333 G I dont know what to tell you. Its all about pressing buttons in the right order lol.

[Ronaldinho]

Man, I saw this thread and knew it was just for me. I play a NE Warrior, protection, with almost all best in slot items. I find myself out DPS'ing mage's in our guild for christ sake. I can usually pull out about 2k DPS as prot with Ciderhelm's Deep Wounds spec 15/5/51. My guild has the same exact problem as OP's. 3/4's are great players, even good enough to do Ulduar 10 man hard modes. But the rest, are T-E-R-R-I-B-L-E. I think the solution is to buckle down on who you invite to raids, and also how you recruit raiders. If your just letting any ol' chap in, then your asking for trouble. Make a seperate pile between raiders, and people who are just in the guild. Make it clear to people who WANT to raid, that there are rules to follow and before they can just join in, they need to know their class, rotations, playstyle, etc. The harder the instance is, the less you can carry. That's what was nice about Sunwell. If they aren't up to par, simply don't invite them to raids, even if you are short on raiders.

[lalartu]

OP imo, thats just inexcusable.

i personally think carrying your own weight in raid is a way to show respect.

sorry but some form of confrontation private or otherwise is needed.
you have to let someone know that they are part of a team and that they are holding that team back.

for me a good person would also make the effort to perform well. ive never understood this "hes dirt stupid and wipes us all the time but hes a great guy"

well he may be kind and thats good, but a nice guy does not wipe his friends.

let her know what you expect from her. point her to elitistjerks at bare minimum. . .

[Amran20]

I dunno what to tell you. I'm a Prot Paladin in heroic/10 man gear, and on 10 man XT-002 I pulled 2500 DPS last night. Yeah, I know his heart takes double damage, but still, you're not always fighting that heart. I don't really know how a DPS spec of ANY class can't pull more than 2K. I know I could do it with any class given about half hour to figure out the rotations.

[rathok]

Man, I saw this thread and knew it was just for me. I play a NE Warrior, protection, with almost all best in slot items. I find myself out DPS'ing mage's in our guild for christ sake. I can usually pull out about 2k DPS as prot with Ciderhelm's Deep Wounds spec 15/5/51. My guild has the same exact problem as OP's. 3/4's are great players, even good enough to do Ulduar 10 man hard modes. But the rest, are T-E-R-R-I-B-L-E. I think the solution is to buckle down on who you invite to raids, and also how you recruit raiders. If your just letting any ol' chap in, then your asking for trouble. Make a seperate pile between raiders, and people who are just in the guild. Make it clear to people who WANT to raid, that there are rules to follow and before they can just join in, they need to know their class, rotations, playstyle, etc. The harder the instance is, the less you can carry. That's what was nice about Sunwell. If they aren't up to par, simply don't invite them to raids, even if you are short on raiders.

lol, reminds me of my OS10 last night. I was #2 dps for the actuall sarth fight and #1 overall average dps for the entire raid as MT with my DK... :'(

[Waltz]

Ronald, that's pretty much the boat I'm in. We made a point, during our first few attempts of Razorscale, to link the DPS reports.

First was a Rogue, who recently respecced HAT one he got his Calamity's Grasp. 3k+ every attempt
Second was our MT, the Prot Pally. Pulling around 2300 because he's getting most of the adds.
Third was a Mage, thank god for that. Riding the Prot Pally, they switched back and forth; but he's not AoE'ing.
Fourth was me, DK tank, tanking specifically the casters and the Whirlwind guys.

Now, they were far from perfect attempts, but posting those got the point across. Sure, you have to dodge fire. But so do the tanks. You're doing it wrong. :P


I'm going to talk to the GM about setting up a difference in ranking, right now there's only 4 or 5 ranks in the guild. A seperation between good raiders and bad might not be a bad idea. But I'm sure it'll be a bit more subtle with the labels. xD

[Separate]

I'm going to talk to the GM about setting up a difference in ranking, right now there's only 4 or 5 ranks in the guild. A seperation between good raiders and bad might not be a bad idea. But I'm sure it'll be a bit more subtle with the labels. xD

Im becoming very popular in this thread TYVM

Aside from that. If any rogues that are combat have any questions please feel free to pm or ask me through here, I like to turn bad rogues into machines I know alot of people switched to combat from mutilate, and to be honestly I havent switched since sunwell, combat is the back of my hand.

If you have "nice" people in your guild and you want to cater to everyone, start a alt or 2nd 10 man Uld and let them get aquainted with the fights imo before bringing in the baddies.

[treasy]

She has better gear than I do and I pulled 5k DPS on our XT kill

lol


She should aim for ~500 haste 263 hit ~28% crit character sheet buffed (not including 4 piece bonus, IFF, imp IS)

Also, her rotation should be IFF -> IS -> MF -> Wrath until Eclipse -> Starfire until 4 seconds left on ICD -> IS -> MF

repeat


Have her spec something like this: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-t...reasy&gn=Relax

[Sindershock]

That's why the smart guilds have a trial period for new members and a friends/family title for the non-raider "nice" people.

The nice people who suck can still be in the guild, but they don't raid with the core raiders (unless you need a replacement in a pinch or something) and the trial members who suck can just be kicked immediately after or during the run.

[Priestattack]

There are a lot of variables to the title "bad". I honestly think some people could also have really shitty computers and have a fps of like 4-6. Ive seen it and it does happen. Then there are players that just don't care, people can become bad to good if they at least make an effort. For me, when I was a shadowpriest, all I had to do was download "darkness" and I was in the top 8 on boss damage in (25 mans), top 4 when running (10 mans).

I think what you have to worry about is peeps that are not doing what they are supposed to do because they want it easy. Those people aren't bad they are evil.

[keychain]

There are a lot of variables to the title "bad". I honestly think some people could also have really shitty computers and have a fps of like 4-6. Ive seen it and it does happen. Then there are players that just don't care, people can become bad to good if they at least make an effort. For me, when I was a shadowpriest, all I had to do was download "darkness" and I was in the top 8 on boss damage in (25 mans), top 4 when running (10 mans).

I think what you have to worry about is peeps that are not doing what they are supposed to do because they want it easy. Those people aren't bad they are evil.

I have below 10 fps in every fight (usually 6, sometimes lower). I still pull out top dps and I'm usually top 5(25 man) in a decent guild.