Enhancement Q's (LB vs CL, MT vs ST, Flameshock?)

[Kodie]

I have some quick questions that I was hopeing I could get some answers to.

1. I see a lot of people saying, "use LB when MW procs"... But doesn't CL hit harder, even on single targets?

2. I am fairly certain that Magma Totem does more dps than Searing Totem, even on single target DPS. But with keeping MT down every 20seconds(when my CD's allow it) coupled with spaming CL when MW procs, I still find myself getting really close to, if not completley, running out of mana. And that's with Imp SS, Shamanistic Rage, the talent "Shamanistic Focus" (reduceing the mana cost of my Shock Spells by 45%), and keeping my mana totem down. Am I doing something wrong? Because I hear other people stateing that they have no problems with mana...

3. Is Flameshock back in the rotation? I've heard conflicting comments, so I am a bit confused as to what is better... spamming ES or rotating ES and FS.

Here is my Armory if this will help anyone explain to me if i am doing anything wrong... I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks guys =)
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...chewer&n=Kodie

[Dirtyfist]

1. LB scales better than CL.
2. Searing totem is a one minute totem vs a 20 second totem, and i think it costs less mana, which all equals to more dps done in the end. I DO believe it does hit harder than Magma totem anyway, its 3 am where im at and am headed for bed.
Chain lightning and magma totem also cost more mana to cast ( I think) than Searing totem and lightning bolt, that would be part of your OOM issues. Personally i would max out Ancesrtal knowledge, rather than go with wolves. Also take one out of call of flame, and one out of shamanistic focus ( put both in ancestral knowledge ). Use some judgement on the Shamanistic focus one though, i dont know what your raid comp is like and whether you run consistently with replenish effects or not. Spirit wolves are fun ( I miss mine) but are a 3 min cooldown. The dps you gain from putting point in other areas surpasses that of the wolves within 3 minutes.
3. I havent heard anything about Flame shock back in the rotation at all, not sure why you would though, all our debuffs amplify nature damage or frost depending on imbue.



P.S. Chain lightning for aoe effect, LB for single target ALWAYS.

[Norena]

#1 Yes, the base damage from CL is higher but LB does scale better with spell power because of its slower cast time. So the spell power you gain from Mental Quickness (30% of your AP as bonus SP) will make LB better than CL. It will also help your mana management, LB costing about a third less mana. Keep using CL on multiple targets though.

#2 Magma Totem should be doing more DPS than Searing Totem. You say you had trouble with your mana to keep it up but switching from CL to LB from Maelstrom procs will help with that.

#3 ES should still be the only Shock you will use in your "rotation" as an enhance shaman.

Your talents look fine:
Just make sure you are hit capped: 341 hit rating for 13% increased chance to hit with spells
and Expertise capped: 140 Expertise for 6.50% reduced chance to be dodged/parried (as long as you have Unleashed Rage, which you do)

You should see a little increase in your DPS

[Jynks]

I have some quick questions that I was hopeing I could get some answers to.

1. I see a lot of people saying, "use LB when MW procs"... But doesn't CL hit harder, even on single targets?

LB hits for more on single targets, if you will hit more than one target with your CL then use that instead (assuming you should be hitting the other target.) If CL is on Cooldown don't wait for it to come up again just use LB.

2. I am fairly certain that Magma Totem does more dps than Searing Totem, even on single target DPS. But with keeping MT down every 20seconds(when my CD's allow it) coupled with spaming CL when MW procs, I still find myself getting really close to, if not completley, running out of mana.

Depends how OOM you are going. At the start of Wrath I occasionally had problems keeping magma down if I had to keep moving it. With Imp SS you should not be having these problems anymore.

How much mana are you getting back from SR (I get a full bar in about 3 specials when raid buffed)?
Are you using a pot if you need it?
What is the difference between your OOM time and your CD for SR being back up?
Do you have replenishment?

As I guess I would say you are doing something wrong; however without more information it is difficult to say what. The poster below you who said use Searing is wrong. Always use Magma as a piority; initial positioning of drakes in Sarth3d is about the only time I can think I use Searing instead.

3. Is Flameshock back in the rotation? I've heard conflicting comments, so I am a bit confused as to what is better... spamming ES or rotating ES and FS.

No FS; at all; ever.

Here is my Armory if this will help anyone explain to me if i am doing anything wrong... I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks guys =)
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...chewer&n=Kodie

You are not hit capped (341 Target)
You are over expertise capped (17 Target)
Gemming for AP over hit below cap is not recommended
The gems you are using could be much better utilised

Other than that practice.

[scoopington]

I have some quick questions that I was hopeing I could get some answers to.

1. I see a lot of people saying, "use LB when MW procs"... But doesn't CL hit harder, even on single targets?

Uhhhh you cant Lava Burst off of MW. Idk who you are talking to but they are terrible and you're even worse for being the shaman and not even knowing you cant LB off MW.

[qae]

Uhhhh you cant Lava Burst off of MW. Idk who you are talking to but they are terrible and you're even worse for being the shaman and not even knowing you cant LB off MW.

In most of the thread about shamans I saw people use :

LB for Lightning Bolt
LvB for LavaBurst

[Kodie]

well I think armory is wrong, because I am at 348hit and am 26/26, or 17, or 147exp, or 6.5%(how ever you want to look at it)expertise rated. So I am capped... But I do greatly appreciate the tips.

With spamming CL and Magma Totem I would go OOM at about 2.5-3 minutes(faster with heroism). I would pot when needed, but if it was a fairly long fight, I obviously would not be able to pot again... putting me in an OOM situation.

With this new knowledge of LB scaleing better and actauly hitting a single target harder than CL would, that alone should help me tremendously... pending a boss fight where only single target DPS is needed.

So I guess there's not much I can do about going OOM when I have to hit multiple targets in a boss fight... hmm.


PS. Elecman, LB is the acronym for Lightning Bolt. LvB is the acronym for Lava Burst. Glad I could help ya out there =)

[Norena]

So I guess there's not much I can do about going OOM when I have to hit multiple targets in a boss fight... hmm.

That shouldn't happen for long enough to make you go OOM. Or maybe your raid is missing Replenishment ? Other than that, even with sloppy enhance gear (elemental as main spec until 3.1 so most enhance pieces are offset win) I have yet to find a fight that makes me go OOM to the point where I have nothing but auto-attack until my mana comes back (That is up to Auriaya in Ulduar, I can't talk for the rest of it as I have not tried it yet).

[scoopington]

In most of the thread about shamans I saw people use :

LB for Lightning Bolt
LvB for LavaBurst

i see, i must have assumed lava burst because i saw flameshock discussion as well. and FS is bad.

[Deleted]

Personally i would max out Ancesrtal knowledge, rather than go with wolves. Also take one out of call of flame, and one out of shamanistic focus ( put both in ancestral knowledge ). Use some judgement on the Shamanistic focus one though, i dont know what your raid comp is like and whether you run consistently with replenish effects or not. Spirit wolves are fun ( I miss mine) but are a 3 min cooldown. The dps you gain from putting point in other areas surpasses that of the wolves within 3 minutes.

Good grief NO. Wolves do around 300-400 dps when out or around 100-150 dps over cooldown duration. Ancestral knowledge does around 10 dps per talent point. Your statement about "The dps you gain from putting point in other areas surpasses that of the wolves within 3 minutes." couldn't possibly be more wrong if you tried.

[Deleted]

You are over expertise capped (17 Target)

The expertise cap is STILL 26 you just get 9 from talents so you STILL need your character sheet to say 26. More accurately you need it to say 140 expertise rating when you hover over the figure. BTW I note the armoury is still as buggy as ever as its showing the OP with zero bonus damage yet he has 3/3 mental quickness, and 17 expertise despite having 3/3 Unleashed Rage.

[Cl4ymore]

1. LB scales better than CL.
2. Searing totem is a one minute totem vs a 20 second totem, and i think it costs less mana, which all equals to more dps done in the end. I DO believe it does hit harder than Magma totem anyway, its 3 am where im at and am headed for bed.
Chain lightning and magma totem also cost more mana to cast ( I think) than Searing totem and lightning bolt, that would be part of your OOM issues. Personally i would max out Ancesrtal knowledge, rather than go with wolves. Also take one out of call of flame, and one out of shamanistic focus ( put both in ancestral knowledge ). Use some judgement on the Shamanistic focus one though, i dont know what your raid comp is like and whether you run consistently with replenish effects or not. Spirit wolves are fun ( I miss mine) but are a 3 min cooldown. The dps you gain from putting point in other areas surpasses that of the wolves within 3 minutes.
3. I havent heard anything about Flame shock back in the rotation at all, not sure why you would though, all our debuffs amplify nature damage or frost depending on imbue.



P.S. Chain lightning for aoe effect, LB for single target ALWAYS.

failed hard...

magma does a lot more dps than searing does...... lb does more damage on single target than cl.
und wolfs are a must have talent.... it give you a lot more dps boost than ancestrall knowledge..

and i play without imp stormstrike, and drop magma on cd, and i never go oom.. sometimes i have to use a manapot, but thats np, for more dps since i can put the points from imp stormstrike and ancrestrel knowledge to reveberation...

[Dirtyfist]

Good grief NO. Wolves do around 300-400 dps when out or around 100-150 dps over cooldown duration. Ancestral knowledge does around 10 dps per talent point. Your statement about "The dps you gain from putting point in other areas surpasses that of the wolves within 3 minutes." couldn't possibly be more wrong if you tried.

hmmm ..i shall have to try that...ive always out dps'd any other enhance shamans ive come across, and sad to say, I dont play as hardcore as I used to.

[Elementium]

Just from what i've learned.

1.Lightning bolt wins
2. Magma totem wins
3. Flame shock isn't even on my bars anymore.

[Cantii]

Just throwing my 2¢ in about Spirit Wolves.

Glyph of Feral Spirit is pure win. Jumped my wolves up to ~1200 DPS with just my SoE/WF totems out on heroic dummy, no Unleashed Rage. The glyph makes the wolves an amazing burst dps timer, and actually made my dps go up a few more points than Glyph of Lightning Shield (which I replaced with Feral Spirit).

Your mileage may vary, however.

[CookieEater]

Flameshock isn't entirely useless. It should be used over Earthshock in any of the following situations:

1- You have way over +/-2300 spellpower. This is the point at which a (Glyphed) FS becomes stronger, according to pen+paper calculations based on an average Crit rating of 33%. As I don't raid I have no idea whether this is an achievable number and you have to greatly surpass it for the Glyph to be even considerable, but it's something to keep in mind.

2- There is no Stormstrike debuff on your target and you cannot immediately (re)apply it. This can happen when lots of running is involved.

3- You're being kited by an enemy player. The guaranteed critical hit on Lava Burst, especially with Elemental Fury, could mean his end, while not doing it will likely mean yours.

It is for these reasons that I keep Flameshock and Lava Burst on my bars, somewhere to the right (just beyond Feral Spirit and Shamanistic Rage), simply because I wouldn't forgive myself if I had to facepalm due to one of these situations occurring. Of course, Flameshock should never be used when it's DoT is still running, because that'd be a waste of mana and time.

[Barawr]

Flameshock isn't entirely useless. It should be used over Earthshock in any of the following situations:

1- You have way over +/-2300 spellpower. This is the point at which a (Glyphed) FS becomes stronger, according to pen+paper calculations based on an average Crit rating of 33%. As I don't raid I have no idea whether this is an achievable number and you have to greatly surpass it for the Glyph to be even considerable, but it's something to keep in mind.

2- There is no Stormstrike debuff on your target and you cannot immediately (re)apply it. This can happen when lots of running is involved.

3- You're being kited by an enemy player. The guaranteed critical hit on Lava Burst, especially with Elemental Fury, could mean his end, while not doing it will likely mean yours.

It is for these reasons that I keep Flameshock and Lava Burst on my bars, somewhere to the right (just beyond Feral Spirit and Shamanistic Rage), simply because I wouldn't forgive myself if I had to facepalm due to one of these situations occurring. Of course, Flameshock should never be used when it's DoT is still running, because that'd be a waste of mana and time.

It has its place in PVP, beyond that though you truly should NOT use it as a raiding enhancement shaman. The SP figure you mention is not very hard to obtain fully raid buffed, however any good raiding enhancement shaman will never be glyphed for FS.

[CookieEater]

Well, you can't dispute (is that the right word?) point 2 either. Without Stormstrike Flameshock will do more damage in the long run and waiting until you can use Stormstrike means a loss of DPS.

And hey, I'm a theoreticus. I did the whole calculation because I was bored and there wasn't anything on TV. I'd never use the Glyph myself either :P

[Nizjub]

Yeah the only time i used flameshock was malygoose right after phase 1

[CookieEater]

Yeah the only time i used flameshock was malygoose right after phase 1

The epic informative value of your post aside, that just made me chuckle.