enhance left out for pvp

[Fenrir The Phantom]

title says it all enhancement no longer has survivability shamistic rage lasts 15 sec and reduces damage taken by 30%...big whoop doesnt matter if your stunned the whole damn time or being death gripped all over the place you can get the glyph of stoneclaw totem and aborb what like 4k? yes i have the glyph it saves on killing blow...but you hit me twice im dead 4k not alot
enhance also does not have alot of burst that all the other classes have now IF wf crits yeah it can bruise you but thats IF it crits and if it even hits with the glyph
the wolves do help yeah if your target isnt a healer or anyone that can slow/fear/stun which last i checked was everyclass spirit walk only lasts 15 sec so not much help a 2 sec stun doesnt help much eaither...
wish blizz would make shamistic rage make the shaman immune to fear like it was supposed to that would help out a lil bit and maybe give a attack to the wolves or add a glyph that makes them last like 2 min like the dk ghoul *does a dk even need a pet* : does even one lasting 2 min would help alot maybe even wind shock stunning the target honestly who uses it...
enhance is fine for pve lil more damage or a buff i wouldent mind just wish it was more viable for pvp

[Drunkenfinn]

It's not as bad as you make it sound. Atleast I noticed myself doing shitloads of damage when I started arena last week for deadly glad totem. Got the nececcary rating for Deadly Glad totem qutie easily and I got quite excited on this Enh PvP thingie. Going for 1400++ next week for some furious offpieces. Need a wee bit of resi to reach 1850 for some furious weps and stuff.

I'm wearing full PvE gear and playing with a DK and I can tell you we destroyed allmost every team with a rogue and every healer team. Allthough me having Ulduar gear and 2xT8 + 2x Vulmirs might help a bit in the damage department. Just use a shield, sham rage, fire nova stun, wolf stun, earthbind to get outta roots and other stuff.

Against classes without stuns / cloth teams u can go pretty much zerg. We killed quite a few healer + warr teams with my DK sitting on the warr and keepping him busy while I went and instagibbed the healer. Wolfs stun + Fire Nova stun + eartshock the last cast and most healers are dead if you have the gear for it.

[Escatonic]

No offense to the OP, but my impression of Enhancement in PVP is that it takes a significantly greater level of skill to reach a given arena rating than it does for other classes.

I think Blizzard *has* attempted to give Enhancement tools to survive but at the expense of being a potent threat in the arenas. Blizzard wants every class to be a foil for some other class but I'm *still* not sure who Enhancement is supposed to be able to counter effectively. With the possible exception of a few healer types, most teams don't see Enhancement as that much of a problem.

Unfortunately I do not have the mongoose-like reflexes to be competitive at the upper levels of PVP but if you ever get the chance to look over the shoulder of an elite Enhancement PVPer, they can do well enough against many teams.

WOW's take on PVP is a competition about CC. Who can incapacitate whom and for how long and who can escape the incapacitation. That trend has only increased over time and I expect more of the same.

The other thing I've noticed is that for each of the arena seasons there have been a dominant class and a dominant team comp. This changes with each of the tweaks that Blizzard makes. Perhaps Enhancement's time will be coming up in the rotation soon but don't get your hopes up. We're still paying for the two-handed windfury OP days of long ago BGs.

[monkeysnarf]

This week I tried running 2s with a resto druid. Once we sort of felt it out, it actually went very well for us. Dual dps teams are no problem. I have enough survivability to withstand their initial burst. Even rogues weren't that bad. 1 healer teams are tougher depending on the classes. Our best bet was to out think them and/or oom them.

We had the greatest success when we flipped the script. Instead of popping lust right off the bat, I held it for my second (or sometimes even 3rd) set of wolves. Since we can't be burst down, the match will settle into a routine. This is where our shaman abilities will win the match. Constantly keeping totems down and even a mana totem (depending) in huge in long mana-fights. Using Shaman Rage and water shield to regain mana are huge. Critical interrupts and CCs with odd-timed burst is also huge. Plus whenever the other team wanted to chill and not come to us, I let them. I have no problem allowing my CDs to refresh. BTW, I ran with WF/WF for more maelstrom procs.

[IhatePvE]

title says it all enhancement no longer has survivability shamistic rage lasts 15 sec and reduces damage taken by 30%...big whoop doesnt matter if your stunned the whole damn time or being death gripped all over the place you can get the glyph of stoneclaw totem and aborb what like 4k? yes i have the glyph it saves on killing blow...but you hit me twice im dead 4k not alot
enhance also does not have alot of burst that all the other classes have now IF wf crits yeah it can bruise you but thats IF it crits and if it even hits with the glyph
the wolves do help yeah if your target isnt a healer or anyone that can slow/fear/stun which last i checked was everyclass spirit walk only lasts 15 sec so not much help a 2 sec stun doesnt help much eaither...
wish blizz would make shamistic rage make the shaman immune to fear like it was supposed to that would help out a lil bit and maybe give a attack to the wolves or add a glyph that makes them last like 2 min like the dk ghoul *does a dk even need a pet* : does even one lasting 2 min would help alot maybe even wind shock stunning the target honestly who uses it...
enhance is fine for pve lil more damage or a buff i wouldent mind just wish it was more viable for pvp

All what i have to say about it - give me double stoneclaw shield absorbtion...

[Athor]

title says it all enhancement no longer has survivability shamistic rage lasts 15 sec and reduces damage taken by 30%...big whoop doesnt matter if your stunned the whole damn time or being death gripped all over the place you can get the glyph of stoneclaw totem and aborb what like 4k? yes i have the glyph it saves on killing blow...but you hit me twice im dead 4k not alot
enhance also does not have alot of burst that all the other classes have now IF wf crits yeah it can bruise you but thats IF it crits and if it even hits with the glyph
the wolves do help yeah if your target isnt a healer or anyone that can slow/fear/stun which last i checked was everyclass spirit walk only lasts 15 sec so not much help a 2 sec stun doesnt help much eaither...
wish blizz would make shamistic rage make the shaman immune to fear like it was supposed to that would help out a lil bit and maybe give a attack to the wolves or add a glyph that makes them last like 2 min like the dk ghoul *does a dk even need a pet* : does even one lasting 2 min would help alot maybe even wind shock stunning the target honestly who uses it...
enhance is fine for pve lil more damage or a buff i wouldent mind just wish it was more viable for pvp

If you whine like you are doing ofc it seems bad. Your using the typical list abilites and then say no use tactic.

Example.
Ret paladins are useless in pvp, no survivabilty what we get 12 secs every 5 mins thats like up 1% so no point using it. We have stun, everyone can remove it with trinket so no point using it. We hit a prot warrior for like 500 so no point attacking anyone as we do 0 damage. Cant heal as will be interupted so no point using heals. Every buff we have can be dispelled so just no point buffing ourselves. Elemental shamsn crit me for 12 k where i can only hit tank warriors for 500 so theres no point even trying to fight.

Get what i'm saying?

[Omanley]

Ret paladins are useless in pvp, no survivabilty what we get 12 secs every 5 mins thats like up 1% so no point using it. We have stun, everyone can remove it with trinket so no point using it. We hit a prot warrior for like 500 so no point attacking anyone as we do 0 damage. Cant heal as will be interupted so no point using heals. Every buff we have can be dispelled so just no point buffing ourselves. Elemental shamsn crit me for 12 k where i can only hit tank warriors for 500 so theres no point even trying to fight.

Get what i'm saying?

12 secs imunity, together with instant full-heal is huge. i dont know what your crying about. Stun no use? what are you talking about? use your repentance on the guy you want to focus, burst his partner to make him use his trinket, than stun him and burst him down with him having no way out, easy. you have to think about your possibilities some more. Every melee hits a pro warri for puny damage, think any other does well against them? pvp tanks are ridiculous, nerf them down to 50% damage output, is what im saying, they simply dont belong into pvp and if you want to have 5times the survivability of that of another player you have to pay with having only 1/5 of the damage of other ( especially bears are to powerful ). You have instant heals every time your seals crit ( which happens more frequently than getting 5 stacks of malestrom as an enhancer ). Enhancers buffs can be one-shotted by a holypala in melee and get nerfed often ( grounding and tremor-totem ). Also, your seals cannot be purged anymore, wich was the greatest weakness in tbc.Ele-shamy´s crit themselves for 12k if the prot reflects it, and your able to nuke ele´s just as good as they are to nuke you, you simply have to be able to cross the distance.

[Escatonic]

While I don't frequent the Paladin forum, I have to say that that was the first time I've seen a complaint from a pallie since WotLK came out about their viability in PVP. Especially on the shaman forum!

Anyway, I agree that protection warriors are now completely transformed from the TBC days in PVP. The added mobility, multiple stuns, avoidance, health pool, spell reflection, etc. make them one very tough kill if they're played by a competent PVPer. With even marginal healing they make a 5v5 arena team match go on for TWICE as long as they used to in the arena seasons prior or to WotLK.

It's a toss up for me between a bear tank and a proc warrior in PVP. The bear has a bigger health pool and more armor but that warrior has so many "disruption" abilities that they can make an opposing team just spitting mad.

[Amgyn]

I'm pretty sure Athor was being sarcastic and using your own logic to prove that your problem can be applied to every class, and thus your post is nothing but a 'madlib' and has no actual point.

"whats the point of having <insert your ability here> when <insert other class here> can <insert other class ability here> <number>% of the time and negate the effect of <insert buff here>."

drunken and escatonic make good points (escatonic's first post, not his second one, which is waaaay off topic) its a basic problem of L2P, and, if you know how, then your partner needs to L2P.


Shamans got a lot of PVP type updates over the patches, and while we might not be able to survive for 10 minutes while taking on an entire WSG team, we can still hold our own during a 2v2 or 3v3.

[IAreRaz]

L2Sarcasm you guys, Athor was attempting to prove a point...

[Gonard]

> Ok first off It didnt take a incredible amount of skill to play a Enh shaman in PvP. It too skill period.

The problem wasn't that players lacked skill. If a player leveled his shaman up as Enh he understood everything there was to know about a shaman. The problem is they nerfed shaman so bad they couldn't hold there own in PvP.


They didnt need CC they didnt need GOD gear to beat people. Any shaman wearing greens could be any other class wearing Purple gear just based on Skill IF they knew there class.


Also the idea of making shamanistic rage shamans defense rather than restoring shamans armor was just what the people in blizzard asked for. They didnt want shaman to have high armor. Yet they were a mail armor class. So they nerfed shamans armor and there defense making it difficult to do anything because shaman dont have any way of getting out of a fight.

So now left with face your enemy for 5 seconds an eat flaming death! ;D

As far as i see it. I wont PvP. Until i see The fixes i complained about im not playing again. I rerolled DK because shaman were just that bad. And that's not only for the case of mime at this time. Just about everyone has quit.


This is because the population of people playing wow has dropped drasticly. down to 4 million players. And it all has to do with Class balance. Not Blues are flooding the forums trying to save there jobs :-[ Because if they dont find the case they will be downsized! ;D .

The funny thing is they cant get any viable reports from players on the issues because they either Banned all the knowledgeable player who were trying to help the class and/Or quit the game because they got banned from the forums.


It gave them the impression that (I run the forums and i dont want any information from a person who complains there for i will banned you completely from posting.) :-X


Making player say well if you dont want my help and you dont want to help me then im gone! So all the hardcore shaman you would think still play there shaman have just deleted there shaman. Because they know blizzard will never fix them.

My account has been closed for 5 months now and i wont be playing until i see shaman fixed. I hang out with my friends an watch them play or play there characters but they even wont play there Enh shaman because it so bad in PvP. This is primarily due to them not raiding.

[Deathsworn]

Enh PvP isn't that bad at all... and yes I play a shammy as one of my mains...

Only problem I can see is that they're not a face-roller class, meaning they actually take SKILL to play.

[Omanley]

Enh PvP isn't that bad at all... and yes I play a shammy as one of my mains...

Only problem I can see is that they're not a face-roller class, meaning they actually take SKILL to play.

you´re either trying to be funny ( and failing ) or you simply have no glue what your talking about

skill has nothing to do with being gimped.

example: enhancement shaman vs rogue ( assuming enh has stoneclaw-gylph, fire-nova-stun, frozen power and earthern power, the rogue being muti/sub skilled, the shaman has full resilience gear except weapons ( ~700 resilience ) the rogue has hybrid gear ( because he doesn´t need resil that much )

rogue jumps the shaman. shaman pops SR to reduce the dmg taken and uses his trinket, because he is pretty much dead by the time the first stun weares of. shaman pops wolves for counter-stun, sets down fire-nova-totem and stoneclaw, uses stormstrike, rogue uses kidneyshot, gets stunned by nova-totem.

with the actions taken of the shaman, the first two stuns get shorten in duration, the incomming damage reduced, the rogue himself eats damage and the shaman gets a little heal from wolves.

even with these pretty much best options the shaman can take, the rogue has dashed out a lot of dmg himself, all of the heal on the shaman is halfed, the shaman is also slowed both in movement/casting speed and most notable of all, rogue hasn´t used yet:
-vanish ( and with it additional opening )
-blind ( able to stealth again, adittional opening )
-evasion
-dismantle
-cloak of shadows
-sprint
-preparation ( to use most of them a second time )

dont know if i forgot something, but i already owned rogues with awesome gear and i got killed without being able to do anything! by some green/blue geared rogues, simply because they make good use of all your cooldowns. good playing as a shaman can do a thing, but regardless how much you push, you cant beat a good rogue unless your lucky and he has pretty much anything on cooldown

enh lacks really good emergency abilities, that´s why he is no good. rogues and dk´s have awesome survival abilities, burst is also there, that´s why they are so friggin awesome

as gonard said: there are hundreds of smart shaman-players bringing ideas, i simply think that it is so much easier to create a whole new class on all these ideas, give it a dark image of death & evil and let it start at lvl55... ( why would one do something for one of the least played classed if you can simply make them play another class, by making wotlk more attractive? )

well, you get my point