Banned today

[Carnivale]

The big issue here is there are 2 completely different scenarios resulting in the same 72 hour ban.

Scenario A) People undermanned the fight and killed flame leviathan in his area using no exploits, just killed him with proper kiting/good dps.

Scenario B) People pulled Flame Leviathan through his wall when he had 4 towers up and killed him outside without having to deal with any of the adds/etc in that fight, and without him resetting; which is supposed to happen upon the boss leaving his spawning area.

It is completely unreasonable that Blizzard would punish players for using tools which were given to them to kill a boss in a manner such as scenario A. No glitching, no nothing, just "this boss REQUIRES you to kite him, so if you can kite him well enough within the game's own mechanics and intended fight area, AND do enough dps, you can kill him."

Scenario B on the other hand, is a different story altogether. Players who killed FL in a manner which is INTENTIONALLY pulling him to an unintended zone to fight, as well as getting an unintended amount of attempts to kill him before his health resets deserve the 72 hour bans.

In conclusion, I think those who got banned for pulling him out of his zone with 4 towers up, etc were definitely exploiting intentionally and deserved the ban.
Those who just undermanned the fight and still killed him should not have had any actions taken against them as it is not their fault that Blizzard themselves made the fight just_that_easy.

[LTrain8]

Also speed runs could be done with out kiting a drake away. Kiting away is a result of changes blizzard made in the encounter to try and prevent speed runs.

So this can be done or it can't be done? Which is it? I've spotted another GM talking out the side of his mouth! I'm still confused is it exploitation or not. WoW doesn't want it to happen according to your statement....i.e. putting in a mechanic to prevent it. So once again how is the idea different and please spare me the barrier b.s. I'm not buying it.

[Guthlac-Feathermoon]

Our 10-man raid was banned today as well for Ulduar. We couldn't even figure out what it was for, until somebody remember that FL had bugged a few weeks back. When he emerged we backed out of the area to reset him before starting up, but he bugged and came out of his room to chase us. We retreated about halfway back towards the starting gate before shrugging and turning back to fight him.

These are 10 casual, squeaky-clean-ethics players. We didn't even think to use the repair platforms... >.<

[rhorle]

So this can be done or it can't be done? Which is it? I've spotted another GM talking out the side of his mouth! I'm still confused is it exploitation or not. WoW doesn't want it to happen according to your statement....i.e. putting in a mechanic to prevent it. So once again how is the idea different and please spare me the barrier b.s. I'm not buying it.

As I said, could. Speed runs of 10-man sarth 3d could be done before without kiting. This wasn't exploiting, as nothing was being exploited to do that. With 3.1 blizzard added new abilities to the drakes to make speed runs harder to do, still possible as people have shown.

The barrier is the key, so you can not just dismiss it. Fighting FL outside of his barrier is an exploit no matter how you spin it. That is pure and simple fact. The difference between FL and kiting a sarth drake is that there is no barrier preventing movement beyond a certain point.

[exochaft]

The big issue here is there are 2 completely different scenarios resulting in the same 72 hour ban.

Scenario A) People undermanned the fight and killed flame leviathan in his area using no exploits, just killed him with proper kiting/good dps.

Scenario B) People pulled Flame Leviathan through his wall when he had 4 towers up and killed him outside without having to deal with any of the adds/etc in that fight, and without him resetting; which is supposed to happen upon the boss leaving his spawning area.

It is completely unreasonable that Blizzard would punish players for using tools which were given to them to kill a boss in a manner such as scenario A. No glitching, no nothing, just "this boss REQUIRES you to kite him, so if you can kite him well enough within the game's own mechanics and intended fight area, AND do enough dps, you can kill him."

Scenario B on the other hand, is a different story altogether. Players who killed FL in a manner which is INTENTIONALLY pulling him to an unintended zone to fight, as well as getting an unintended amount of attempts to kill him before his health resets deserve the 72 hour bans.

In conclusion, I think those who got banned for pulling him out of his zone with 4 towers up, etc were definitely exploiting intentionally and deserved the ban.
Those who just undermanned the fight and still killed him should not have had any actions taken against them as it is not their fault that Blizzard themselves made the fight just_that_easy.

This is exactly what could get Blizz in trouble with its customer base. I'm honestly afraid to try something fun or inventive in-game now for fear they'll ban my account. I love trying to underman content since it's generally a test of skill, and I believe it helps me refine my abilities for when we have the full complement of raiders there. I also love to try/find strategies that aren't the standard "everyone does it, so it must be gospel" tactics, but I'm afraid Blizz might find it a non-intended way to complete content. If they stuck with banning people that kited him outside the fences area, this would be a non-issue. However, Blizz just slapped a bunch of their customers in the face for using their brains and skill. That doesn't win you customer loyalty.

[blitz156]

Well, just like 'out of character' Athene said when he was banned for hitting 80 too fast.

Bans/suspensions like this do usually come from 'creative use of game-mechanics' though.

Blizzard can ban you without reason and/or can well blame you for it. You are only RENTING an account that they own. You can be screwed over just because they feel like it.

You accepted this in terms of agreement. Yes its cruel but true.

[Dukamok]

The big issue here is there are 2 completely different scenarios resulting in the same 72 hour ban.

Scenario A) People undermanned the fight and killed flame leviathan in his area using no exploits, just killed him with proper kiting/good dps.

Scenario B) People pulled Flame Leviathan through his wall when he had 4 towers up and killed him outside without having to deal with any of the adds/etc in that fight, and without him resetting; which is supposed to happen upon the boss leaving his spawning area.

It is completely unreasonable that Blizzard would punish players for using tools which were given to them to kill a boss in a manner such as scenario A. No glitching, no nothing, just "this boss REQUIRES you to kite him, so if you can kite him well enough within the game's own mechanics and intended fight area, AND do enough dps, you can kill him."

Scenario B on the other hand, is a different story altogether. Players who killed FL in a manner which is INTENTIONALLY pulling him to an unintended zone to fight, as well as getting an unintended amount of attempts to kill him before his health resets deserve the 72 hour bans.

In conclusion, I think those who got banned for pulling him out of his zone with 4 towers up, etc were definitely exploiting intentionally and deserved the ban.
Those who just undermanned the fight and still killed him should not have had any actions taken against them as it is not their fault that Blizzard themselves made the fight just_that_easy.

Agree with this post completely, and I think it perfectly outlines the discrepancy that people aren't seeing in these bans that has been my concern all along. The Scenario B people obviously deserve a ban, but Scenario A has absolutely nothing wrong with the execution other than simple fight mechanics. He goes slow at first, so you keep him that way and just DPS him down. Simple as that. Knowing how to properly stack/roll Blue Pyrite or having enough DPS to kill a single turret or two is not exploitation.

[Thaeru]

Created an account for this thread.

Some guys were discussing this on the forums and I threw in my two cents, permabanned from the forums. Thinking nothing of it, I was about to do Ulduar with my guild and decided against it - today we had the majority of people banned for it, not all of them - just the majority of the raid from last night.

Blizzard's gone off the deep end, tbh.

[Dukamok]

Created an account for this thread.

Some guys were discussing this on the forums and I threw in my two cents, permabanned from the forums. Thinking nothing of it, I was about to do Ulduar with my guild and decided against it - today we had the majority of people banned for it, not all of them - just the majority of the raid from last night.

Blizzard's gone off the deep end, tbh.

Double extreme, and to your knowledge did they execute the fight properly? How many towers? What difficulty? This is quite honestly appalling and terrifying. I don't even want to attempt Ulduar on EITHER difficulty with a FULL raid now, let alone saunter in early with 23 because our healer is late or something ffs.

[Thaeru]

Double extreme, and to your knowledge did they execute the fight properly? How many towers? What difficulty? This is quite honestly appalling and terrifying. I don't even want to attempt Ulduar on EITHER difficulty with a FULL raid now, let alone saunter in early with 23 because our healer is late or something ffs.

They did it legit, or so they tell me - 25 people and none of them was kept in the entrance.&#160; They killed him in his area, we even had people get killed so it's not like they completely avoided damage.

EDIT: Heroic, no towers.

[Dukamok]

They did it legit, or so they tell me - 25 people and none of them was kept in the entrance. They killed him in his area, we even had people get killed so it's not like they completely avoided damage.

EDIT: Heroic, no towers.

Whaaaaaaaat

This is out of hand

[Xalius]

Quote from Xemafir (blue) on WoW-europe forums (http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread....21237627&sid=1)

We apologize for any confusion this issue may have caused you, Taerius, and I will be happy to try and clarify the situation. Remember that any feedback regarding the Game Master service can be sent to: WoWconcernsEu@Blizzard.com.

Now, an important point:

Action was never taken against Flame Leviathan killing accounts based solely on the number of players present during the fight.

There was a (now hotfixed) exploit that made it possible to trivialize the encounter and subsequently beat it with far fewer players than would be legitimately possible with the gear currently available in-game. This exploit was deemed to be contrary to the essence of the World of Warcraft, and action was therefore taken against those who were found to be abusing it. If you fought Flame Leviathan legitimately, simply with less than the maximum number of players present, you would not be included in the above group.

I hope that clarifies the situation. I won't be able to go into detail regarding the exploit itself, hotfix or not, but please ask if you have any further concerns.

I did him with a guildie and 2 friends of mine last week Tuesday and havent been banned yet (10man)

[Vanzant]

This is exactly what could get Blizz in trouble with its customer base. I'm honestly afraid to try something fun or inventive in-game now for fear they'll ban my account. I love trying to underman content since it's generally a test of skill, and I believe it helps me refine my abilities for when we have the full complement of raiders there. I also love to try/find strategies that aren't the standard "everyone does it, so it must be gospel" tactics, but I'm afraid Blizz might find it a non-intended way to complete content. If they stuck with banning people that kited him outside the fences area, this would be a non-issue. However, Blizz just slapped a bunch of their customers in the face for using their brains and skill. That doesn't win you customer loyalty.

Agreed. If undermanning FL is such a big deal, then ban 99.9% of the players WW for having a friend/guildie run their alts thru ANY lower level instance for XP / gear. That's an exploit of game mechanics if you think about it for more than 2 seconds.

[Dukamok]

Xalius' quote is promising. Sounds like they might shape up a little, or that only SOME of them are banning for no reason (ie. legit kill/undermanned) not all of them. Still, lots of reports of bans on legit undermanned kills regardless.

[Proffessor]

Undermanning it is fine, if you can legitimately do so, these people that PULLED HIM OUT OF HIS PEN did not do so. How freaking hard is this for people to grasp? It is THEIR game, and they WILL decide on what is accecptable and what is not. You do NOT own any part of the game created, and have no rights to abuse it as you see fit. You agreed to this when you signed in.

The issue here seems to lie with ill-informed GM's banning with haste, on matters they have been inproperly instructed to do so on.

[mmathes339]

If you were banned/suspended for no reason I feel sorry for you and hope it can be undone/refunded. However, after reading most of these posts (I skipped the blatent nerd rage) I have come to a conclusion that I would like to share. "Kiting" means to have the mob/boss chase you around the arena...not bounce him back and forth like a ping pong ball. Is it smart to come up with that idea? Kinnda, but it's still an exploit and should be hotfixed or patched. As far as the ones who pissed and moaned about not wanting to pay repair bills. ITS NOT REAL MONEY! If you did it on accident and totally didn't know he was buggy and thought he'd be a good lil tank and stay in his pen then I am not ranting at you, but you could have wiped it, like most people do when a boss bugs. I'm a holy pally, so my repair bills are usually small unless we wipe. But plate costs alot to fix man. Still, it doesn't bug me that much when we have to wipe a boss cuz something went wrong, it's part of the game. To those who thought they would be cool and glitch him on purpose that is cheating and IMO should be a lifetime ban. I think that blizz is going a lil overboard with the mass suspentions, but on the other hand they aren't being as crazy strict as they could be. The ones who intentionally cheated in the fight aren't getting the punishment they should, they are getting a reduced one cuz there is no real way to prove it. Hopefully they will fix it soon (After fixing the holiday bug. :P) and while you're off let me introduce you to a really cool hobby
reading.
This includes but is not limited to:
*Abuse of game mechanics or "bugs".
*Use of add-ons, "mods", external hardware, or any unapproved third party
software to automate gameplay. << Is a canned reponse. They are not accusing you of haxx

[Sabeathell]

registered here solely for the purpose of sharing my ban story.

On US friday evening (I live in New Zealand) I was in Ironforge and the trade chat was occasionally getting spammed by gold farmers. Some people where commenting about how irritating they were so I did a foolish thing that I thought was funny at the time. I realized some people would report it based on the format of the post, but I figured a GM would read the reported post and see it for the satirical parody it was intended as.

My main toons name is Sabeathell and I posted in tradechat:

Hello Everyone! -{Sabby Express}- has gold for sale at the awesome rate of US$25 for 25g!!! prompt delivery within 6 months!. see www.goldfarmersshoulddieinafire.com for more info!!

I thought that at most I would get a minor telling off for taking the mickey out of what must be an irritating problem, but about 30-60 minutes later I was disconnected and I received an email notifying me that my account has been closed.

no warning, no gm conversation, just disconnected and account closed

So after waiting 3 days nothing has happened even tho' I have (according to the blizz support section) applied through all appropriate channels. With no other means to contact blizz, I created a trial account and opened a ticket to speak with a gm.
the wait time for the ticket was 5 and a quarter hours ... not cool

but after I did find out from the gm (no mention of this is made on the website) that the only way I can get my account reactivated is by personally ringing the accounts department.

heres the kicker.

the australasian number does not work but the US one does.
so tonight I will be waiting up until 3am so that I can spend the equivalent of 3 months WoW subscription to try and fix a problem that I assume was caused by an over zealous admin script.

suck to be me, I'm not a gold farmer or a griefer and the comment gave people a laugh about an irritating situation.

admin script crits sabeathell for 7856487547847865765765786765876

[Deleted]

the ban is justified - not for exploiting something but for no skill gaming. exploiting a boss that's already freeloot is more than just lame...it's pathetic :>

[nwo]

An ex-guildie friend of mine got banned when 3.1 came out because he had all the new 50+ glyphs after the first 2 or 3 days and had about 500 auctions up of just glyphs alone. Blizzard banned him without any warning for controlling the market even though anyone else could have done the same at expense of investing about 30k-50k gold into inscription books/mats. I would understand if he was completely trying to dominate the market by buying out other people's glyphs on the AH, but nobody else bothered to buy this many books at such a high price, so that's not the case.

[Nawramsti]

I 3 man flame levy every week the normal way.