Holy Paladin PvE Healing

[Dualkalibur]

From reading this thread, it seems like no one has factored in our other healers in raid yet. Sorry, but I prefer to work WITH my other healers and not just be a lone wolf in the raid while healing. Questing or leveling, leave this lone wolf alone, but in a raid, teamwork teamwork teamwork.

So what if theres some downtime with HL spam? Pop divine plea, have 2 other raid healers keep the tank up for a whole 15 seconds, and get in there with seal of wisdom on(You should already have it on anyways with the glyph we have) and wack away at the boss. I have 28k mana raid buffed as a non JC and I know paladins out there with far more mana than I have, and I get over 1120 mana back on a proc. If you're a real paladin, you're in there with the melee wacking away at the boss anyways in between casts and during HS casts anyways, so you'll already have that passive mana regain through seal procs. Simply call out for them to help when you need to focus on the mana regen and stop casting. Think of it as the next generation of the 5 second rule from years ago.

As I'm fond of saying, that platemail ain't for show. Get in there with the melee! You want your mana back? Put your purse down and hit the fucking thing!

[FiveDkp]

Except i doubt you sustain a holy light for more than 5 mins next patch with the Illum changes lol.

And also if your raid wanted a healer that stopped every minute to hit the boss eevery 20 seconds, i think he'd get a new healer.
Sad but its the truth.

[iktankniet]

As I'm fond of saying, that platemail ain't for show. Get in there with the melee! You want your mana back? Put your purse down and hit the fucking thing!

plate wont save you from a boss's cleave attack. even if you would survive, you will put more stress on the other healers.

[Dualkalibur]

Except i doubt you sustain a holy light for more than 5 mins next patch with the Illum changes lol.

And also if your raid wanted a healer that stopped every minute to hit the boss eevery 20 seconds, i think he'd get a new healer.
Sad but its the truth.

If you're running out of mana EVERY minute, I'd say you have far bigger issues and they SHOULD bring another healer in. Stopping once or twice in a fight is no different than another healer going oom and getting innervated or a healer getting battle rezzed and getting their mana back. We have to cover them then, covering a paladin for 15 seconds, not 20(where did you get 20 from anyways?) should be no big deal.

plate wont save you from a boss's cleave attack. even if you would survive, you will put more stress on the other healers.

And unless they changed cleave to work from behind as well, you wont need to worry about the cleave. If you're standing in front of the boss with the tank, /facepalm
I said get in there with the melee. Behind. With the melee. Your seal of wisdom wont work on a parry, eliminate that from the table for profit.

[Zanter]

From reading this thread, it seems like no one has factored in our other healers in raid yet. Sorry, but I prefer to work WITH my other healers and not just be a lone wolf in the raid while healing. Questing or leveling, leave this lone wolf alone, but in a raid, teamwork teamwork teamwork.

So what if theres some downtime with HL spam? Pop divine plea, have 2 other raid healers keep the tank up for a whole 15 seconds, and get in there with seal of wisdom on(You should already have it on anyways with the glyph we have) and wack away at the boss. I have 28k mana raid buffed as a non JC and I know paladins out there with far more mana than I have, and I get over 1120 mana back on a proc. If you're a real paladin, you're in there with the melee wacking away at the boss anyways in between casts and during HS casts anyways, so you'll already have that passive mana regain through seal procs. Simply call out for them to help when you need to focus on the mana regen and stop casting. Think of it as the next generation of the 5 second rule from years ago.

As I'm fond of saying, that platemail ain't for show. Get in there with the melee! You want your mana back? Put your purse down and hit the fucking thing!

oh god i love you, finally someone who understands how the Holy Paladin should raid <3

[Gillinz]

More like how the pally should be designed to raid. Only an idiot would actually decide to run in there with seal of wisdom and melee for mana back. You shouldn't need to with Divine Plea and managing your casts like a semi-intelligent person.

[kungfumonkey]

I've always been a fan of using seal of wisdom to regen mana.The last few raids I've been seeing how far I can push it in prep for the patch and you can regen a hell of a lot of mana whilst still pumping out those heals.

Come patch 3.2 I think you will see more pallys using it as well.

[Dualkalibur]

More like how the pally should be designed to raid. Only an idiot would actually decide to run in there with seal of wisdom and melee for mana back. You shouldn't need to with Divine Plea and managing your casts like a semi-intelligent person.

I don't want this to turn into a flame war, but the opposite of your statement is also true. I've healed the entire Kologarn fight on 10 man without using divine plea once, and I had to spam heals all fight as we run 2 healers in 10 man ulduar. Properly managed, mana is easy. Not using all your abilities and cooldowns to thier fullest is a waste.

Sitting back with the casters and casting healing spells is fine for those healers with spirit based regeneration. As a paladin who can regenerate mana based on a weapon swing, ignoring that regen is bad. Weapon swings happen on instant cast spells, so even if you use FoL instead of HL, you still stand to gain a few weapon procs when you use HS and then the instant cast FoL after. Free mana is free mana. And 1120 or more per proc is hardly something to sneeze at.

Managing your heals sounds great in theory, but in practice thanks to RNG, what worked one time for one person, wont for another with the exact same setup. Right now, HL spam works easily. Come 3.2, it will take a lot more work to keep up. Paladins getting innervated, using seal of wisdom procs, blowing divine illumination every chance and coupling Divine plea with Avenging wrath as much as possible, etc. Mp5 is getting buffed, but illumination is getting nerfed by 50%(unless it changes, and I doubt it). Right now, illumination is 44% of my mana regen and some fights I'm regenning over 170k mana. Losing 22% of my mana is no laughing matter, so like all other good paladins will, I'll adapt and overcome

Simply speccing 51/20/0 and hitting sacred shield and beacon of light once each minute and spamming FoL for 7 minutes is far too boring in my book. People claiming to do that right now as a viable tank healing spec, well, enjoy it. You never have mana issues? Well, blizzard WANTS us to have mana issues so guess what? If we get forced to go down that road, MORE changes will come to make sure you can't just sit back and watch tv and spam FoL on the raid.

[Gillinz]

I don't want this to turn into a flame war, but the opposite of your statement is also true. I've healed the entire Kologarn fight on 10 man without using divine plea once, and I had to spam heals all fight as we run 2 healers in 10 man ulduar. Properly managed, mana is easy. Not using all your abilities and cooldowns to thier fullest is a waste.

Sitting back with the casters and casting healing spells is fine for those healers with spirit based regeneration. As a paladin who can regenerate mana based on a weapon swing, ignoring that regen is bad. Weapon swings happen on instant cast spells, so even if you use FoL instead of HL, you still stand to gain a few weapon procs when you use HS and then the instant cast FoL after. Free mana is free mana. And 1120 or more per proc is hardly something to sneeze at.

Managing your heals sounds great in theory, but in practice thanks to RNG, what worked one time for one person, wont for another with the exact same setup. Right now, HL spam works easily. Come 3.2, it will take a lot more work to keep up. Paladins getting innervated, using seal of wisdom procs, blowing divine illumination every chance and coupling Divine plea with Avenging wrath as much as possible, etc. Mp5 is getting buffed, but illumination is getting nerfed by 50%(unless it changes, and I doubt it). Right now, illumination is 44% of my mana regen and some fights I'm regenning over 170k mana. Losing 22% of my mana is no laughing matter, so like all other good paladins will, I'll adapt and overcome

Simply speccing 51/20/0 and hitting sacred shield and beacon of light once each minute and spamming FoL for 7 minutes is far too boring in my book. People claiming to do that right now as a viable tank healing spec, well, enjoy it. You never have mana issues? Well, blizzard WANTS us to have mana issues so guess what? If we get forced to go down that road, MORE changes will come to make sure you can't just sit back and watch tv and spam FoL on the raid.

TLR
I get lots of mana from whacking the boss while the other healers cut my slack.

[Dualkalibur]

L2Read then

No need for slack if you get the procs off instant cast spells. No stopping of healing to wack, no slack. Only difference is your placement. Instead of being back where you get 0 mana, you stand where you actually do. Not a hard concept, right?

[kungfumonkey]

TLR
I get lots of mana from whacking the boss while the other healers cut my slack.

With that logic the same can be said everytime you pop Divine Plea (half healing for 15 secs!!!), im assuming you use DP.. hey you may be so awesome you never have to.

Almost all boss enconters (yes there are exceptions) have luls in the fight where you get the chance to catch your breath, regen some mana, pop DP. No one is suggesting you walk over and start meleeing the boss in the middle of the most intensive part of the fight, but there are ways and means.

[Gillinz]

You would at most get two white hits off during the HS->FoL combo, and anything beyond that is wasted time. I dont think that warrants being in potentially bad positioning :\

[Brabun]

Most people are still under impression that "HL spam" is possible. It was never (let me repeat it again: never) possible 3.1, and of course will be even less possible in 3.2 after illumination nerf.

(Note that for "HL spam" I mean being able to cast HL on every GCD without sacrificing your HPS output by using DP)

There's really 2 important changes that will affect your gear and playstyle:

1. Illumination nerf and mp5 buff. While currently (3.1) 1 point of crit rating equals (on average and in terms of mana regen) 0.5 points of mp5, that is, mp5 being about 2x better, post-3.2 1 point of mp5 will be 4x-5x better than a point of crit rating. For you this means: get rid of every single possible crit rating enchant, glyph, gem and replace it with mp5 one.
2. BL change. You are now able to keep BL on the tank ALL the time without having to worry about non-tank targeted overheals not healing the tank. They will heal the tank now with 3.2, and this is amazing. This will significantly change the way you use BL and select healing targets.

Other changes aren't that important. You can't do much about -5% int nerf from talents, and you're casting FoL now already so added hot component won't require any special handling.

[Heretushi]

And there I was thinking I was the only Holy Paladin EVAR to not be able to substain the infamous "ever lasting HL spam". Too bad everyone keep mentionning that myth non stop.

People that think every Paladin should be able to spam HL without ever running oom are fools. Fools that didn't run hard modes.

[Caean]

But...but...I can spam HL on Grand Widow Faerlina!

That's hard mode, right?

[Heretushi]

Note that I have nothing against Holy Light per se. I use it everytime it needs to be used. I just use all the other spells when they make sense too.

I just don't pretend to spam HL non stop when its not logical to do so.

[Alenko]

Int is still going to be the best stat for holy paladins.Some might argue that sp is gonna be up there as well for certain builds, such as FoL spam.

2pc t7 and 2 pc t8 is horrible imo, holy shock should only be used when you need a quick instant heal and have no time to cast, otherwise it will oom you faster than other spells and it's also not the most mana efficient spell, therefore it shouldn't be spammed whenever it is off of cooldown.

4 pc t8 is probably gonna be the best way to go.

mp5 will be number 1 stat next patch with the increase to all mp5 on gear and wth the nerfs to illumination and Divine int, sp and haste will out weight int.

[Caean]

Really?

How well are you going to sustain healing without a mana pool?

Did you plan on stacking infinite mp5 and never using DP?

[Alenko]

Really?

How well are you going to sustain healing without a mana pool?

Did you plan on stacking infinite mp5 and never using DP?

I currently have a max int set and an mp5 set and in my mp5 set (which uses no int gems in any capacity) and full25 man raid buffed I still have 27k mana, easily enough to spam HL if need be.

also, I can still use DP even when I stack mp5, please, l2play

[heartledger]

im a main paladin healer in 10 man 25 man ulduar and i dont spamm HL, i sue Fol bl and alot sacred shield and i never go oom. this other pally use HL spamm is like 78% overhealing and always have to drink. Plus ive stack sp and crit gems/enchant,