So with the nerfs to ret being so bad to inspire so much butthurt

[Fortoss]

Yes it is. It's on the ptrs. The numbers ppl have tested show it's worse than blood is now, and if you get seals of the pure, then righteousness almost beats it even though it can't crit.

Lol PTR-Public Test Realm(final build yet?) and almost beating something means it still loses.(Good argument for that seal but what are we talking about?) Didn't people test some encounter with numbers and say the numbers prove it's impossible to beat?(hint Yogg 0 watchers) Until final build is confirmed and righteousness beats SoC, you failed sry! Even your arguments of number testing fails. Should I go on?

[omegatrigun]

Also forbearance, c'mon really.

To tell me arena is the only pvp? Forbearance wouldn't be up after a divine shield, instant heals(bandage during divine shield if mana is your argument because mana mismanagement is your problem tbh) LoH and HoP?


If your gonna debate be intelligent atleast! To prove some L2Pally, you don't have to they post and show who they really are. I do remember saying something about situational and know what abilites work when.

So you want to balance around bg's? lol. Also, HoP doesn't stop magic dmg, which all but 2 classes have, and one of the classes that doesn't can break bubble.

[omegatrigun]

Lol PTR-Public Test Realm(final build yet?) and almost beating something means it still loses.(Good argument for that seal but what are we talking about?) Didn't people test some encounter with numbers and say the numbers prove it's impossible to beat?(hint Yogg 0 watchers) Until final build is confirmed and righteousness beats SoC, you failed sry! Even your arguments of number testing fails. Should I go on?

Okay, I'll spell it out. In testing, SoR does more average judgement and seal dmg with sotp, it just can't crit. Also, speak english. Impossible to beat? wtf?

Also, it probably is the final build due to the latest builds not having hardly any class changes, and being mostly bug fixes.

[Fortoss]

You're saying im the one not being intelligent? You're the one who wants to balance classes around bg's. Not to mention HoP doesn't work against magic, which all except 2 classes use.

You just tried to HoP fighting a mage huh? I said in PVP not bgs. Once again you HoP'd fighting a mage huh? Can't you use LoH in world PvP? Oh wait the only PvP that matters is a broken arena system! <---cwatididthur Broken Arena System hahahaha new topic :P

There is more to PvP than just arenas. How can you play your class to your full potential is you can't follow a thread?

[Fortoss]

Okay, I'll spell it out. In testing, SoR does more average judgement and seal dmg with sotp, it just can't crit. Also, speak english. Impossible to beat? wtf?

Also, it probably is the final build due to the latest builds not having hardly any class changes, and being mostly bug fixes.

What did you spell out? Our burst is gone and resilience improved! A steady increase damage will cause more of a panic and waste of mana than a steady stream of the S A M E damage constantly. Healers will go from a flash type heal to a HL type heal by the 5th stack, no?

[Fortoss]

So you want to balance around bg's? lol. Also, HoP doesn't stop magic dmg, which all but 2 classes have, and one of the classes that doesn't can break bubble.

Dks,Rogues,Warriors, and Druids do physical damage! The debuffs will still do damage but what about the mitigation of physical damage? Wow your reasoning is making my head hurt! Break the bubble and be immune to a stun at the same time? Or do you waste your interrupts and stuns at the beginning trying to be superman?

[Finch]

ret are so OP that they even have the longest ramp-up time!

hello from feral druid lol

[Skiball]

Staying with my paladin through and through. Always will Ret was nerfed to worse than BC the moment they did the bubble nerf, the ONLY way we couldn't be kited, CCed, or close on any enemy target.

That being said back in BC (where ret was better actually because good players topped dps and pvp while the baddies gave ret the bad wrap instead of baddies keeping up and the class not being possible even for good ones to do #1 damage like it is now) I learned a solution to playing in a game where the "Paladin Rule" (simply not being allowed to do anything well without the cult bitching) exists:

Grab some lube, bend over and grab the ankles, and just take each nerf because you'll drive yourself crazy trying to rationalize the irrational.

Shockadin was murderd at wrath, Ret was dead 1 month after wrath launch, Holy mana regen going in the shitter this patch.....

Please don't touch prot. Leave it alone. Please. I know Prot is getting "buffed" but everytime a paladin is buffed it gets nerfed back worse than it was in the first place instead of restored to the original form. I like it the way it is. idc about a second cooldown. Don't touch it. Hands off blizzard.

[Roflcêr]

re-roll dk bitches like everyone else did at wrath. Or you can roll a lock cuz they got the best benifet from the resil change. Soul link + your damage reduction = plate.

[Skiball]

Oh I forgot to mentio one good thing. I appreciate they are trying to put ret dps back up a bit, so credit is due there even if nothing else makes sense. Only wish the BC days were back when you could top dps everytime as ret if you played it right, instead of never in wrath because of the programed difference between pure and hybrid classes along with other issues.

Thanks for at least trying for pve dps in this patch

[omegatrigun]

You just tried to HoP fighting a mage huh? I said in PVP not bgs. Once again you HoP'd fighting a mage huh? Can't you use LoH in world PvP? Oh wait the only PvP that matters is a broken arena system! <---cwatididthur Broken Arena System hahahaha new topic :P

There is more to PvP than just arenas. How can you play your class to your full potential is you can't follow a thread?

No, I'm not saying to use HoP against a mage, genius. You said pallies have 3 lives and used HoP as one of the lives when HoP doesn't protect against all dmg.

There may be more to pvp than arenas, but arenas are how you get the best pvp gear, and is considered the top end of pvp, therefore, that's what pvp should be balanced around.

Once they start handing out BiS pvp gear for bg's, then that's when they can balance around it.

[dotsdotsdots]

I'm so laughing. Even tho my DK gets nerfed pretty hard too, it's still an unbelievable huge difference between the whine posts in the DK forum and the stuff going on here. Paladins will always be the biggest cry-kids (followed by rogues) in wow. It's awesome

[omegatrigun]

What did you spell out? Our burst is gone and resilience improved! A steady increase damage will cause more of a panic and waste of mana than a steady stream of the S A M E damage constantly. Healers will go from a flash type heal to a HL type heal by the 5th stack, no?

It won't cause any panic with no way of straining healers (aka ms or some kind of mana drain). You're overestimating the power of SoV, it's not a huge improvement. Also, you have to stay on the target to get and keep up the stacks.

Ret has never been a wear down dps. It's always been a chain cc chain burst down dps.

[omegatrigun]

I'm so laughing. Even tho my DK gets nerfed pretty hard too, it's still an unbelievable huge difference between the whine posts in the DK forum and the stuff going on here. Paladins will always be the biggest cry-kids (followed by rogues) in wow. It's awesome

Dk's were nowhere near nerfed as bad. Pallies will always get mad the most because they have a few years of bad class design as a reason.

[Ninjarobot44]

The FoTM has swamed the class so bad at this point i think your talking about more then half though.

Possibly, but I completely support it if it will help the good rets get a little more respect.

[Amran20]

Dks,Rogues,Warriors, and Druids do physical damage! The debuffs will still do damage but what about the mitigation of physical damage? Wow your reasoning is making my head hurt! Break the bubble and be immune to a stun at the same time? Or do you waste your interrupts and stuns at the beginning trying to be superman?

DK will Frost Strike you, Scourge strike you, or if he's Blood, just Rune Tap for health then Mind Freeze and Strangulate your heals.
Warrior will Shattering Throw, or if you stun him, trinket, then Shattering Throw.
Druid will shift out, Cyclone.... Cyclone.... Cyclone... then shift back to cat and resume attacking. If Balance will laugh, if Resto will heal to full and regen, never to be killed.
Rogue will use an escape ability, break combat, stealth, and then resume screwing you in the anus.
Hunter will just shoot you with a Freezing Arrow and laugh as your precious Phys-Immunity drains away, and then will resume attacking.

So no, HoP is not even remotely a "3rd" life.

You're bad, stop posting.

[Ránëwén]

just make all the spells do 2 things... 1 for pvp and second for pve ;x

Bin thinking about the same.. If they do it that way, they can balance for PvP without changes in PvE.. and the other way around of course

[Fortoss]

DK will Frost Strike you, Scourge strike you, or if he's Blood, just Rune Tap for health then Mind Freeze and Strangulate your heals.
Warrior will Shattering Throw, or if you stun him, trinket, then Shattering Throw.
Druid will shift out, Cyclone.... Cyclone.... Cyclone... then shift back to cat and resume attacking. If Balance will laugh, if Resto will heal to full and regen, never to be killed.
Rogue will use an escape ability, break combat, stealth, and then resume screwing you in the anus.
Hunter will just shoot you with a Freezing Arrow and laugh as your precious Phys-Immunity drains away, and then will resume attacking.

So no, HoP is not even remotely a "3rd" life.


You're bad, stop posting.

Hey Genius fighting a rogue and it doesn't protect you? You can't heal it HoP? That's your only defense is a HoP? You just gave a few examples that show your an IDIOT!

I'm bad, so now you want to be a Keyboard Cowboy and call names? Frost Strike isn't physical? Scourge Strike isn't physical? Take ten steps turn around then alt F4 PLS! You gave examples that were piss poor and prove ignorance is your best quality.

About your scenerios, I'll just Repentence(I know you'll trinket) then I'll HoJ pop AW+Wrathstone and collect my loot off your dead corpse.

So IDIOT in the right situation a HoP can and will be a third life, if you read earlier posts you will see words like situational and know what abilities work when.

Failing is failing, but your used to it!

[Fortoss]

So I don't have to explain the fake heal after this IDIOT posts again: You act like your gonna heal then, stop the heal before they use the ability and they waste a CD. See I do understand a heal can be stopped while HoP'd.

[Mindark]

You just gave a few examples that show your an IDIOT!

About your scenerios, I'll just Repentence(I know you'll trinket) then I'll HoJ pop AW+Wrathstone and collect my loot off your dead corpse.

So IDIOT in the right situation a HoP can and will be a third life, if you read earlier posts you will see words like situational and know what abilities work when.

Failing is failing, but your used to it!

So you'll pop AW just after popping HoP? Do you know which abilities work when?