Here's my view on the group DE option

[DiscostewSM]

I see nothing wrong with it. Why?

1) In most PuGs, if there is an enchanter, they'll usually greed all the BoP items, DE them, then the group rolls on the shards. The greed DE option allows the enchanter to not have to worry about DEing, bag space, etc.

2) What about the uncommon loot? Everyone will be rolling the DE option and flood the market, right? Maybe, but not to the extreme everyone makes it out to be. Why? Alts. I have an alt that is an enchanter, and EVERYTHING I pick up that is BoE, no matter which toon, I send to that alt to get DEed. with how long this game has been out, I wouldn't doubt that at least half the people with more than 1 alt have one that can DE, and do the same.

3) I have been in a good number of groups where after the instance was done, the enchanter, who said they'd greed on all BoP items to DE for the group afterwards, would end up leaving the group, log out, etc. Basically, they'd ninja it all.

All in all, I do not see this as being a problem, but more of a solution.

If it is really such a problem, then why not allow it to where if someone wins via the group DE option, the enchanter(s) in the group have a low chance of the DE "proccing" into some grey loot that can be sold?

[Doctor Professor]

Inb4 "Cool story bro"

[Chamass]

Inb4 "Cool story bro"

waste of serverspace...

Anyway, I think/hope/pray that blizzard wont let the DE option be there for BoE loot, which solves number 2. the only negative one u can name

Also, if an enchanter changes gear into magical dust, why would there be a residu to sell? Dissing is allready the best money-maker ingame, that sorta addition would make it way to powerfull, or a waste of bagspace (depending on the ammount of money :P)

[Heratix]

I would love to get this option tbh, for some reason my raidgroup doesn't have an enchanter so i just randomly /roll pieces that are unwanted, so people can vendor it.

[DiscostewSM]

I would love to get this option tbh, for some reason my raidgroup doesn't have an enchanter so i just randomly /roll pieces that are unwanted, so people can vendor it.

Actually, I think it's been stated that the option will only become available when there is an actual enchanter in the group involved in a mob kill.

[chila]

I see nothing wrong with it. Why?

1) In most PuGs, if there is an enchanter, they'll usually greed all the BoP items, DE them, then the group rolls on the shards. The greed DE option allows the enchanter to not have to worry about DEing, bag space, etc.

2) What about the uncommon loot? Everyone will be rolling the DE option and flood the market, right? Maybe, but not to the extreme everyone makes it out to be. Why? Alts. I have an alt that is an enchanter, and EVERYTHING I pick up that is BoE, no matter which toon, I send to that alt to get DEed. with how long this game has been out, I wouldn't doubt that at least half the people with more than 1 alt have one that can DE, and do the same.

3) I have been in a good number of groups where after the instance was done, the enchanter, who said they'd greed on all BoP items to DE for the group afterwards, would end up leaving the group, log out, etc. Basically, they'd ninja it all.

All in all, I do not see this as being a problem, but more of a solution.

If it is really such a problem, then why not allow it to where if someone wins via the group DE option, the enchanter(s) in the group have a low chance of the DE "proccing" into some grey loot that can be sold?

1. While the greed DE option makes things convenient for the enchanter who wants to DE for the group, it's useless for the enchanter who doesn't. While some enchanters wouldn't mind DEing for the group when they are given a choice to DE and not to DE some will undoubtedly start to mind when they are forced to DE.

2. While it might not be as extreme as some people make it out to be, the possibility exists for the market to be flooded.

3. The solution would be to not let an enchanter handle all the unwanted drops. Just greed for them and if you win something, do whatever you want with it -keep it, sell it or kindly ask the enchanter to help you disenchant it (if the group is successful the enchanter might not even ask you for any compensation.) Remember, the enchanter is doing you a favor; he is most likely adding value to what you had before.

[dotSeed]

Or you can use your brain and realise if the market is flooded with materials from disenchanted greens you can just greed them and vendor them like people have done for years.

[chila]

Or you can use your brain and realise if the market is flooded with materials from disenchanted greens you can just greed them and vendor them like people have done for years.

Greed is the same as DE right now just so you know.

[DiscostewSM]

As far as "flooding the market" is concerned, I hope you all realize that now, they made a recent hotfix with Abyss Shatter and getting more mats from DEing, so the market may already be flooded by the time the group DE option goes Live, and the flooding will have been done by the enchanters themselves.

[axio]

I don't mind DE'ing stuff for guildies (and usually tell them to trade me the BoP item if they want it DE'd after the run) but I hate DE'ing shit for pugs... especially when they are below 1000dps (and yes, my server has A LOT of them).

I understand why they added it, since with the crossrealm thing you can't trade enchanting mats, but an enchanter should not be forced to DE something if he doesn't want too.

[Eyetotem]

However a lot of times the rest of the group will tell the chanter "just keep em" and with this new option everyone will roll greed. Therefore the chanter will receive less mats.

No biggie if you are already maxed.

[ItachiZaku]

They better provide something like this for every other profession. Ore node? Yep, as the miner hits it, need/greed/pass should pop up. Skinning, Herbalism, cloth. I'm sick of people expecting free products of my profession that they have no part in my leveling.

I greed everything everytime Unless it is something like TOC and something I know someone wants comes up. And really, I vendor most of it anyways. DE that BOP Dagger for a 6g mat when it sells for 16g? No, thanks though.

[Crunchie]

To be honest as a enchanter running a heroic, i usually greed all items that drop - the group knows this. If someone in the group needs that drop they roll need.

After the run is over all who did not receive an item rolls for the shard. The highest roller (myself included on this roll) gets the abyss shard. i pass out dream shards to everyone else. Because this the fairest way i can do this.

However if someone has received an item and the shards have been handed out - ie everyone got something. If there is any shards left over, they are mine. I can not go out and farm shards like ore or herbs that regularly re-spawn over a short period of time. I dont care if you think i am greedy or not. Those extra shards help me make a income and buy more enchants. Just like farming for ore or herbs.

My objection to this change is that i am forced to shard, and due to the rng i could possibly leave the instance with nothing. While someone with stupid luck could walk away with everything.

[rabbimojo]

...
Point being, don't assume that just because a chanter is there it becomes that persons responsibility to do DE for the group. I would much rather they not mess with anything along the lines of a profession. If you group with a Ninja don't group with said person the next time and you will have no issues. If you are worried about it greed and vendor but don't try to build a new wheel, we already got one and it works fine.
...

They aren't going to be "forced" to DE it. You don't have to -do- anything as the enchanter.

They better provide something like this for every other profession. Ore node? Yep, as the miner hits it, need/greed/pass should pop up. Skinning, Herbalism, cloth. I'm sick of people expecting free products of my profession that they have no part in my leveling.
...

Pretty sure I've seen you say this in three related threads now, and you still have such a strange tone.
"They better"? Or what?
Cloth is already round robin. Skinning and herbalism are weak professions anyways, and part of why there are nodes is so those players get some benefit. Not to mention, if they're not in the group, the nodes may as well not exist.

Again: We are DEing things that belong to the group already. We do not have some inalienable right to the materials that come from that DE just because it was our presence that allowed them to be DE'd. We aren't even really adding any value at this point, since materials have dropped dramatically in price from everyone running instances and things getting DE'd en masse.

New argument, please.

[gaymer77]

I've been a maxed out enchanter for 5 years now on my priest and lock. In nearly every dungeon I've ran, I let people know up front I'm an enchanter & ask if they want me to DE the BOP stuff that nobody needs. I will admit to taking all the shards/crystals at the end of a run probably 20 times in those 5 years (every instance of this was because of retarded groups that did nothing but bicker with me, bicker each other, did stupid crap, let the tank die then yell at me for not healing as a shadow priest, bad tank who can't hold agro or pick up adds that lets me die where I'm nearly broken 1/2 through the dungeon, etc etc etc....all what I concider valid reasons) but none of them were full "ninja" moves because I would pass or mail out some after I left group to those who didn't fall into anything listed in the () I said. I concider myself to be an honest enchanter. I do NOT DE BOE for people in the group that I don't know somehow (RL friend, guildie, ran lots of stuff with them in the past, etc) because its not my job to do you favors just because we happen to be running some random dungeon together. I do agree with Eyetotem when he said how most of the time people tell the enchanter just to keep the mats anyway since most people don't need the shards but want the crystals. I also agree that most of the time I don't even DE blue or green weapons since they vendor for more than the mats sell for.

That being said, I welcome this option because it will save me time and bag space and complaints that they didn't get what they wanted. Too many times I've DE'd a blue only to get the small chance for dust or essence from the DE and got called a liar and accused of DE'ing something else just so I could take the shard.

The market won't be flooded by this new option since you have to have an enchanter in the group who can DE the item in order to even have the option come up.

As far as "flooding the market" is concerned, I hope you all realize that now, they made a recent hotfix with Abyss Shatter and getting more mats from DEing, so the market may already be flooded by the time the group DE option goes Live, and the flooding will have been done by the enchanters themselves.

Actually if you read the patch notes, the hotfix was to fix the extra mats from being made. It wasn't a huge amount of extra mats being created but it was a couple extra. This is no longer an issue.

[Mithsploit]

I see nothing wrong with it.

What about the potential for people to run tons of instances and never win a Disenchant roll, when otherwise the majority of enchanters distribute stuff fairly at the end? (Remember, ninjas are the exception, not the rule)

If 10 people do a pug Naxx raid and there's something like 30 drops, and only 5 of those drops get Need rolls, there's about 25 crystals to distribute. In most raids, anyone who wants a fair share would be given 2 at the end of the run. The enchanter keeps the extra 5 as a sort of assumed payment for their service in turning something that would have to have been vendored into something that can be sold for more than the vendor value. The enchanter also gets any share that is left over from people who leave without asking for or wanting their share.



Now, with the Disenchant roll option, there's not just the potential, there's the guarantee that the mats won't be evenly distributed. Break it down to the simplest level: a 5 man group with 5 drops that all get DE'd. There's the possibility that one or two people win all the rolls, and the other 3 or 4 people (the enchanter included) run the chance of not getting anything, when otherwise there was the opportunity for a perfectly even split of one crystal per person.


Currently, there's also a common standard that people who win items they Need are not entitled to Disenchant mats, while people who didn't win anything they Needed (or who didn't Need on anything to begin with) are given a share of the Disenchants are compensation for a run that otherwise produced nothing for them.

Wit the Disenchant roll option, this fairness is eliminated. A person who wins Need roll is still going to roll Disenchant, and the possibility is just as real that people will win Need rolls and Disenchant rolls while people who only roll Disenchant might win nothing.

[Deleted]

You people are missing the point - disenchant has exactly the same priority as greed. It is exactly the same for enchanters, and non-enchanters get help because they don't have to bother asking the ench in the group to do it personally.

Just because there is an enchanter in your group does not make them your bitch and do all your enchanting needs. Personally, I try to avoid letting the pug group know that I am an enchanter so they dont bother me and I spend an extra 10 mins DEing crap.

If you choose to offer to DE all the loot and share it out, good for you and better for the groups that you run with. But, the procedure is now exactly the same, but the non-enchanters get a chance to get the DE mats even with lazy people like me.

[LeperHerring]

What about the potential for people to run tons of instances and never win a Disenchant roll, when otherwise the majority of enchanters distribute stuff fairly at the end? (Remember, ninjas are the exception, not the rule)

Random roll is the very definition of fair. Sure you can get lucky streaks, but you can also get losing streaks; over time everyone has the same expected outcome. I also don't see why someone should pass on a shard just because they got an item they need, these are two different classes of loot and can be treated completely separately.

[Peta]

For me the whole thing option is a blessing. Dunno what all the fuss is about. Too often when there is one DE. He/she plays forget en log's off with all the goods. Even if you say 'roll for shards?' in party chat the person plays like: haven't seen yur msg dude.
Was fun bb. especially me taking all the shards...

The last few months people have been buying up all shards and putting them up for more ridiculous prices.

[Cheezee]

You guys all seem to be missing the reason why so many enchanters are pissed off about this change. Let me put it into terms that a retarded monkey could understand.

It's my god damned DE button, keep your hands off of it!